Power System Overhaul Proposal

[mrnotsoevil]

Funny that suddenly this proposed overhaul comes up: As I don't actively play Starmade since ~2 Weeks anymore, I thought what could be improved. One thing was to maybe add reactors to Starmade

Back to topic: I like the idea. I never liked the way it's currently handled and everything ... just needs more actual complexity (complexity as in "you need to think" not in "annoying task"). Shield and thrusters were mentioned, too and I think similar systems for them would make Starmade more enjoyable. Also: Why not let those systems work together? For example certain reactor types produce additional resources that can be used by other systems.

Here's an example: You have an antimatter reactor that produces power. To make power it generates plasma. Some weapons need plasma to work (as fuel). So you could build a conduit to fuel the weapon. In the reactor control you could decide how much plasma would be available for external systems and how much is used for generating power.

(My idea may be a bit unrefined but I think something in this direction would give great opportunity to push players into more variety of ships and making every component useful)

 

[Groovrider]

OK, I'm pretty much on board with most of this. The details can be worked out but this a direction i think the game needs. A few things:

1. heat sink systems have to be a thing.
2. (I realise this will be unpopular) This game needs a consumable economy. You have at this time a golden opportunity to kill so many birds with one stone. REACTOR CORES MUST EVENTUALLY WEAR OUT. Half of the current players will curse you but future players will love you for it.

 

[petlahk]

I am loving this prospect, however I do see one potential exploit. In between the first two photos you talk about the ability to add interior inside the heat zone since quote "those only affect systems." Unless you have some way around it, wouldn't this mean you could place a reactor in the middle of the ship, fill the heat boundary around the reactor with the entire ship's interior/ fill something like 75% of the heat boundary with interior and circumvent the heat boundary's effects to your systems?

The way I understood it was that if other systems are within the heat boundary you get something akin to "Overheating." where you get extra heat added to your reactor. It isn't that your systems aren't adding heat, it's that by putting them inside the boundary their adding extra heat.

For example, if, in real life, you stuck a regular computer chip right up against the wall of a blazing hot reactor chamber you'd run into problems. If the computer chip is farther away you're still using energy produced by the reactor, but not damaging your electronics.

 

[Red Raptor]

I'll state upfront I'm not a Pvper or strong combater but I do love the design process of ships, including interiors, even if this means being inefficient in the current system for combat. I would also like to see a move away from the current ship core system, and the strange power reactor design requirements.

This design you have put forth falls in line of what I'd like to see, a ship that can be created with non-combat related interiors, and still have manageable combat effective systems. And I'm thinking this would make the coming crew system so much easier for everyone, which is something else I'm looking forward to.

I'm excited that ship systems placement might finally mean something.

I think it's fair that small ships keep simple requirements and larger ships need much more difficult design considerations.

The management of heat is a good idea to help balance out the bigger is better system we have now. Perhaps, one of the available chambers could be IR radiators that need to be touching "space" blocks. A cheap but vulnerable method of heat management.

Hydrogen scoops could be another cheap external chamber type but it increases reactor output. I guess I would just like to see more external systems, to see fewer hulls of complete armor coverage, for non combat ships.

It's a neat concept and I'm excited to see it implemented.

 

[SchnellBier]

I like the idea a lot since system building is my least favorite part of starmade. Everything that makes it more interesting is welcome. I just throw out 2 thoughts about this:

1. Will this system force a certain ship design on people? If you need a big block of "ship" for the heat box it will certainly give bulky designs an advantage.

2. The "heat" is a nice mechanic in combination with scanners. Ships that produce a lot of heat could get easily trackable compared to low heat ships.

 

[Crashmaster]

“inner hull”, which will be a low mass, low HP block. You could use it to fill empty areas in your ship

Builders: Placing large volumes of systems is tedious

Schema: How about placing large volumes of garbage blocks?

 

[Yogzototh]

Woah, this update would certainly break a whole bunch of ships, including all those goodies that won the whatever competition.

I suggest give players an option to select between basic or advanced design mode for their ships. Simple mode would be what we currently have (but a bit nerfed), while complex mode will be changing as each aspect of shipbuilding is overhauled.

This way the people who feel constrained could still build functional ships, although far less combat-capable than the "advanced" ships.

If starmade was a game with clear progression, the basic mode would basically be the low-tier simple system while the advanced mode is high-tier system made for more experienced players.

 

[Xacktar]

I hate that all my ships are gonna be obsolete... but the new system does sound much better and I'm looking forward to building in it.

 

[Criss]

Will there be a way to gauge one's heat level? Will we get an idea of how efficient our reactor designs are? Will the math be available to us?

Yes. Heat will essentially replace your power capacity/generation gauges on the HUD. Or something similar. As for reactor efficiency we are unsure how this will be displayed to you, if at all. This system is more complex than adding a block and seeing how high the power regen amount goes up.

The use of "reactor rod" in your writeup implies fission

Reactor rods could mean a simple heat sink, as that is what they really are in this situation. A component of a larger structure. No defined power generating processes are being used. It's just simply power. Furthermore, it's just an idea. We might not use reactor rods.

Might I ask, to confirm, this will mean that all shield/thruster/power will have to be completely re-worked?

This system will likely break everything. While we have dealt with these sorts of changes in the past, they never solved the problem. We hope that this one does.

I'd like to think that for a while BOTH systems would work while people got things updated and then phase the old system out.

IIRC we said we would make the new system a config file opt-in until it was ready for release. The may still be kept to the dev build versions however.

For example certain reactor types produce additional resources that can be used by other systems.

This is a possibility. We have a lot of options here. However it also comes with a lot of double-checking and discussion.

REACTOR CORES MUST EVENTUALLY WEAR OUT

Reactors are still blocks on a ship, and there are no plans to place any sort of item into the reactor. This may be okay for a single ship, but we expect players to be using fleets of ships with their friends. Replacing reactors or items will get tedious and is not worth the micromanagement.

Will this system force a certain ship design on people? If you need a big block of "ship" for the heat box it will certainly give bulky designs an advantage.

It should allow a range of reactor shapes and flexibility in where they are placed. There may also be bonuses based on how you place them. Right now, the only goal is to put a reactor throughout an entire ship and call it a job done. With this you may have to weight the options of where to put a reactor depending on how you want the ship laid out and what bonuses are available.

 

[Captain_Boroski]

I unironically like this

 

[petlahk]

On the one hand I really like the idea of this heat-based system rather than a purely power-based system. However, on the other-hand I find it somewhat disagreeable that there would be absolutely no power requirement, and that it all be based on heat.

I think that my initial distaste at the idea of there being no power numbers is a result of being used to dealing with power numbers in video games for so long. What you've proposed in a new idea that usually isn't done that I think is going to work. And, I think that some of the initial negativity is due to it not being clear how exactly the new heat system is going to tie in with the energy requirements of various systems such as weapons and thrusters.

What it comes down to is, it's all well and good that it be a heat system, but I think there's still one big question. How are we going to visualize, and manage the power requirements of our other systems if it's all tied to one universal percentage bar? I think the heat system, while it's a good idea, ties too much necessary information into one percentage bar, that on the surface, appears to be somewhat arbitrary. What menus, or mechanics are we going to be able to use to visualize this?

 

[Aesthetics]

Does this mean our ships will have to look like chandeliers now?

NOT GOOD.​

 

[Yogzototh]

Does this mean our ships will have to look like chandeliers now?​

Well the ships dont actually need to be physically connected in starmade, so you could just have a bunch of armored boxes flying together

 

[Aesthetics]

Well the ships dont actually need to be physically connected in starmade, so you could just have a bunch of armored boxes flying together

That sound worse.​

 

[SkylordLuke]

I (and pretty much 99% of people who are not minmax tryhards) will love this new change,it will finally be FUN to build systems. This will add another level of immersion into the RP spectrum of the game,and still be fun for you min maxers to figure out the best minmax solutions,ay?

 

[Comradecolonel]

Seems pretty rough as far as whole idea goes but I like certain aspects that it will add. Overall it seems that building systems this way will provide for interesting considerations. I also like that my ship won't have the be full of systems like a space jelly donut. I always hated looking inside my ship and see nothing but empty space. This sort of system will make the insides of ship actually look interesting.

 

[Criss]

Since it was said in the original post, I'll make a point of bringing it up again. If you have concerns please write them out. We posted this to ask what the community thinks. If the best response you can come up with is a few gifs or memes, we'd rather you just not post. Take the time to write out a response and work with us. Thank you.

 

[Lecic]

i am a filthy casual,and I (and pretty much 99% of people who are not minmax tryhards) will love this new change,it will finally be FUN to build systems. This will add another level of immersion into the RP spectrum of the game,and still be fun for you min maxers to figure out the best minmax solutions,ay?

Let me make this as simple as possible.

In the current system, you can make any ship into an ultra effective meta boat as long as it is even remotely wedge shaped. So you can still easily make a good looking ship that is also min-maxed.

With the proposed system, every meta ship is going to be shaped like a gigantic chandelier.

The idea that the game should be balanced around the whims of aesthetic RP builders and not around the PvP that those balance changes will actually effect is idiotic.

 

[-=DWM=-]

So, in fact the ships will have a central reactor, instead of that the whole ship is a shaped 'battery/recharger'?

Just link the whole ship system to the reactor without any 'battery backup', just backup reactors?

The idea sounds nice. Still, does it even matter? Small ships will still be 'weak' and big ships will still be strong.
Meh, if the missile was only an standard atom bomb then every ship has equal chances... Doesn't matter if it was fitted on a big or small ship. Suddenly a few small ships have more meaning when they would attack a big ship. But if you link the weapons with power, then there is still a problem.

But it will be an interesting idea. It's game over if the reactor is damaged. Like real ships....

 

[Criss]

With the proposed system, every meta ship is going to be shaped like a gigantic chandelier

If I were to take that shape literally, it would make it incredibly easy for players to target your ships systems and disable them. With a current wedge shaped hull, fitted with a system that spaces out the reactors internally it would make it harder to pinpoint those weak spots. If say you have a string of conduits leading to chambers on the outside of the build structure, those are the first things I am targeting.