StarMade v0.201.126 - Weapon Update

[Captain Fortius]

Projectile Width
By putting down blocks next to your weapon’s output, you can increases its projectile width. On impact, this will cause more damage to be redirected towards the front, basically shrinking your damage pattern and increasing its width. This can be used to counter any over penetration, or to destroy more superficial blocks if needed.

Allright! Let's try it out with three cannons built of exactly the same number of blocks, but arranged to different widths:




Wait, what?



WHAT?



WAAAAAT???!!!

This'd be a super neat feature, one that I've really wanted for over half a decade, but -unless I'm doing something really wrong here- sadly it doesn't seem to be in the actual game.

 

[yoyo2901]

Great update and all and good work but...
before:

after:

back to the drawing board i go..

 

[Spartan-228]

Allright! Let's try it out with three cannons built of exactly the same number of blocks, but arranged to different widths:

View attachment 49487

View attachment 49486
Wait, what?

View attachment 49489

WHAT?

View attachment 49490

WAAAAAT???!!!

This'd be a super neat feature, one that I've really wanted for over half a decade, but -unless I'm doing something really wrong here- sadly it doesn't seem to be in the actual game.

I don't know I had good results with mine

Entrance point.

Sorry this shot should have been better, but you can sort of see the internal damage.

Exit point.

 

[JinM]

back to the drawing board i go..

I like that they changed the white hull textures though. - Now it doesn't melt my face off when I look at them inside of rooms. :D

 

[Captain Fortius]

I don't know I had good results with mine

That looks like a very support heavy weapon. I believe the impact crater's size is due to additional effects, and not any "projectile width scaling".

I'll go and do some testing now with your numbers, but you can do it too: Add an 1x1 diameter barrel extension to your cannon group. Shoot.

-Does the projectile look different?
-Does the impact crater look different?

 

[Spartan-228]

That looks like a very support heavy weapon. I believe the impact crater's size is due to additional effects, and not any "projectile width scaling".

I'll go and do some testing now with your numbers, but you can do it too: Add an 1x1 diameter barrel extension to your cannon group. Shoot.

-Does the projectile look different?
-Does the impact crater look different?

I did a small test and you may be right there was no real difference, guess they need to take a look at that new system again.

EDIT: actual I just realized the damage being done is not a 3x3 like I meant it to be or the 1x1 that I tryed to do in the test afterword but 5x5 which is the size of the cannon mane body, hummm more testing needed.
EDIT: So I made a cannon with the exact same states as the one I had on my ship the first time except the thing was a single line of cannon (Yes I know very long gun)

The only big difference is the entrance point is smaller other than that there is little difference. It should also be noted that results can very drastically depending on the angle of the hit even a shallow one.

 

[Captain Fortius]

hummm more testing needed.

Results time!

I recreated the cannon you were using - at least numerically - in three different shapes; extra thin, regular, and extra wide.


Here's what I've learned:

Visually, the projectiles remained the same. Doesn't look very nice when a 25x25 barrel fires a bolt like that.


Damage wise, the difference is noticable, but it took building a weapon this large, with effects, to actually show, and the 1x1 cannon punched an 8x8 hole, the 5x5 punched an 11x11, and the 25x25 did a 17x17 X-mark.

Miscellanious lessons:

-Recoil is still a viable means of propulsion.
-Recoil really does make the game lag as predicted, when firing the weapon, and when hitting the target. The heavier the weapon, and/or the target, the more noticable it is.
-Recoil makes the ship spin in circles when you're shooting in free-camera mode.
-Spin from recoil while in free-camera mode doesn't display properly until you switch back to normal camera view (ship's alignment fails to update visually), though you'll notice your shots going in odd directions.
-"Realign Ship" and "Stop rotation" buttons don't work while in free camera mode. (exists since power 2.0 release)
-Hovering the cursor over weapon blocks no longer displays which block is the output.
- Cannon blocks and Beam blocks are almost identical visually.

 

[Spartan-228]

Results time!

I recreated the cannon you were using - at least numerically - in three different shapes; extra thin, regular, and extra wide.
View attachment 49497

Here's what I've learned:
View attachment 49498
Visually, the projectiles remained the same. Doesn't look very nice when a 25x25 barrel fires a bolt like that.

View attachment 49499
Damage wise, the difference is noticable, but it took building a weapon this large, with effects, to actually show, and the 1x1 cannon punched an 8x8 hole, the 5x5 punched an 11x11, and the 25x25 did a 17x17.

Miscellanious lessons:

-Recoil is still a viable means of propulsion.
-Recoil really does make the game lag as predicted, when firing the weapon, and when hitting the target. The heavier the weapon, and/or the target, the more noticable it is.
-Recoil makes the ship spin in circles when you're shooting in free-camera mode.
-Spin from recoil while in free-camera mode doesn't display properly until you switch back to normal camera view (ship's alignment fails to update visually), though you'll notice your shots going in odd directions.
-"Realign Ship" and "Stop rotation" buttons don't work while in free camera mode. (exists since power 2.0 release)

- Cannon blocks and Beam blocks are almost identical visually.

Ya they have some work to do. As for the lag, on the server I own, I have yet to have any noticeable lag.

 

[JackBeFlippen]

Hello players,

the weapons update is finally out. Read the full news here:

StarMade News - StarMade v0.201.126 - Weapon Update

Thanks for playing StarMade,
- Schema and the Schine Team

for those of you who do not want to read it all, I read out loud for you. :P

 

[Cluwne]

Friendly reminder:

Basic Armor (previously Hull)

• (Effective) HP: 75 → 250
• Armor Rating: 500

Hull is now armor, which means your hull test cubes now have some tough armor from their sheer size.
You might want to test the block destruction or acid pattern on something more... soft, like asteroid rock for example.

 

[Captain Fortius]

I've noticed that, but we're not going to be fighting against asteroids, will we? :D
Blocks can show light scratching as well, the test cannons don't need to outright destroy them in this case.

My first test pics clearly show 1 block wide holes and the neighbouring blocks in pristine, unscratched condition. Which would indicate, a fatter projectile didn't impact upon them.

Still, for the sake of thoroughness, here you go;



1x1 holes by the cannons from my first test; all three impacted at the same point so it looks more like 1x2

10, 14, 16 block wide holes by cannons from the second test. Some unevennes due to the rock going into a wild spin after being shot.

At any rate, I'm more troubled by the wide gunbarrels shooting thin looking projectiles. Which is probably easier to fix than any damage scaling, and has no impact on combat balance.

 

[Cluwne]

I was talking more about test cubes being made of asteroid rock, perhaps even with strata of differently-colored rocks for prettiness or at-a-glance depth measurement.
'Roid rock is a stand-in for system blocks, throw a layer of armor on the sides and you have a decent target to measure the destructive potential of your jumbo-sized boomstick.

 

[Ithirahad]

I was talking more about test cubes being made of asteroid rock, perhaps even with strata of differently-colored rocks for prettiness or at-a-glance depth measurement.
'Roid rock is a stand-in for system blocks, throw a layer of armor on the sides and you have a decent target to measure the destructive potential of your jumbo-sized boomstick.

Systems now have different mechanics for damage absorption than deco/rocks, IIRC.

 

[Nosajimiki]

Also seems that the galaxy map every sector is pre scanned now?

I didn't have this issue, check your configs.

Allright! Let's try it out with three cannons built of exactly the same number of blocks, but arranged to different widths:

View attachment 49487

View attachment 49486
Wait, what?

View attachment 49489

WHAT?

View attachment 49490

WAAAAAT???!!!

This'd be a super neat feature, one that I've really wanted for over half a decade, but -unless I'm doing something really wrong here- sadly it doesn't seem to be in the actual game.

This is because of armor rating, if you hit more armor rating than your weapon does damage, you only damage the block you hit (no acid).

I've noticed that, but we're not going to be fighting against asteroids, will we? :D
Blocks can show light scratching as well, the test cannons don't need to outright destroy them in this case.

My first test pics clearly show 1 block wide holes and the neighbouring blocks in pristine, unscratched condition. Which would indicate, a fatter projectile didn't impact upon them.

Still, for the sake of thoroughness, here you go;

View attachment 49500

1x1 holes by the cannons from my first test; all three impacted at the same point so it looks more like 1x2

10, 14, 16 block wide holes by cannons from the second test. Some unevennes due to the rock going into a wild spin after being shot.

At any rate, I'm more troubled by the wide gunbarrels shooting thin looking projectiles. Which is probably easier to fix than any damage scaling, and has no impact on combat balance.

This looks like you over-penetrated. Asteroids have shitty HP, so even a weak weapon can go right through them. If a weapon is strong enough to over penetrate, then your damage is averaged out along the line you hit so you lose the damage pattern you'd otherwise have.

Try targeting 200 m of system blocks instead to see the effect. As a side note though, target blocks should now always reflect the size of a ship's intended prey. A small anti-fighter turrets should use fighter sized target blocks with maybe 1 layer of adv armor. A ship with a giant spinal mounted cannon should probably use target block that is 500m thick of systems with a heavy armor prow and maybe a few bulkheads just for good measure.

 

[virtue1987]

Can someone tell me how to increase the projectile size? I place the blocks next to each other, but i only get a single output.
I dont know what i missed exactly.

 

[DrTarDIS]

Funny things i notice:

 <TractorBeam>
                <BasicValues>         
                        <TractorMassPerBlock>5</TractorMassPerBlock> <!-- mass that can be moved per block -->
                        <ReactorPowerConsumptionResting>10.0</ReactorPowerConsumptionResting>
                        <ReactorPowerConsumptionCharging>50.0</ReactorPowerConsumptionCharging>

                        <ForceToMassMax>10</ForceToMassMax> <!--  the maximum force applied, ForceToMassMax * target's mass -->
                        <TickRate>0.0249</TickRate>  <!-- tick time in seconds, beam must remain on target entity or this timer resets -->
                        <Distance>0.2</Distance> <!-- 1 is equal to 100% sector radius --> <!-- timeBetweenHits = 1 / (unitSize^pow)*mult -->
                        <CoolDown>5</CoolDown> <!-- Time it takes to fire beam again from the start-time it first activated -->
                        <BurstTime>-1</BurstTime> <!-- Time the beam will fire -->
                        <InitialTicks>0</InitialTicks> <!-- Ticks to do at the initial contact of beam with a block -->
                        <RailHitMultiplierParent>0</RailHitMultiplierParent> <!-- Salvage Damage percent done to target in own Rail Chain when target is equal or closer to root than this entity -->
                        <RailHitMultiplierChild>0</RailHitMultiplierChild> <!-- Salvage Damage percent done to target in own Rail Chain when target is further from root than this entity -->

<TractorBeam>....<RailHitMultiplierParent>0</RailHitMultiplierParent> <!-- Salvage Damage percent done to target in own Rail Chain when target is equal or closer to root than this entity -->
oversight on copy/paste of some occluded mechanic? Can I tractor-salvage captured ships if i change this to 200?

 

[Fugari2]

So I need some help here, my game ran perfectly fine before this update. Now before I load into a world I get an error message saying I need to update my intel graphics card. I have a MacBook Pro retina 2015 and I can't figure out how to update the card. I know the game doesn't support intel graphics card but its worked perfectly fine until now. this is probably the wrong place to post this but im very confused.

 

[ObiShawnKenobi]

Now I can finally make an X-wing that fires properly. Thanks volley fire!

 

[Captain Fortius]

This is because of armor rating, if you hit more armor rating than your weapon does damage, you only damage the block you hit (no acid).

Look at the pictures. An 1x1 needle projectile is coming out of 25x25 gunbarrels. Like it did before the update. Problem enough on it's own.

Both my targets were basic armor, the first one just 1 block thick; easily destroyed by a 250 block weapon, so what's that about acid damage not applying? Clearly the game just says "meh, this radius is 1"

The second target (in a post you didn't quote) is 5 blocks thick, and it's fired upon by monstrous, 8000 block cannons; results in clean penetrations as well, and area damage is showing, though more for thin weapons and less for thick weapons than expected; meaning, the damage model has a certain sweet spot for weapon sizes, below and above which the results are disappointing.

This looks like you over-penetrated. Asteroids have shitty HP, so even a weak weapon can go right through them. If a weapon is strong enough to over penetrate, then your damage is averaged out along the line you hit so you lose the damage pattern you'd otherwise have.

..... Those cannons left pretty much the same marks on the asteroid as they did on basic armor.

You must be misunderstanding something here. According to your first paragraph, I don't get area damage if my shot's can't penetrate fully, and according to your second, I don't get area damage if they CAN.

Overpenetration means, the bullet has a buttload of energy it didn't transfer to the target, because it punched clean through and kept flying.

No matter how easy a target, if the shot didn't outright ricochet off, it's impossible for a projectile to leave a smaller hole than itself... Yes, if the target was thicker, it could have destroyed more material. Yes, a fatter projectile with the same energy could have destroyed more blocks even if the target is thin.

And that's exactly what I tested; all three of my tests (small cannons vs thin armor, huge cannons vs thick armor, both size vs asteroid) each had three drastically different barrel shapes, which was stated in this very update would achieve drastically different damage patterns and either help to penetrate big targets or stop your shots from overpenetrating small targets.

 

[Kingofanime]

Are these damage value correct???

an 84 block cannon does 1680 dps



an 84 block beam weapon does 6303 dps (I have no idea why it says 126 dps at the top?????)



And if I made it an arc beam cannon (beam/missile), it's 10,504 dps, and it completely out performs a cannon/cannon weapon)