Disintegrators (un-nerfing)

[jayman38]

A quiet whisper in the dark: But I thought that Disintegrators were not main-combat devices. I thought they were designed for utility/mining purposes.... Also, self-destruct and astronaut traps if the mood strikes. Standard shields should be great defense against a simple box of TNT.

 

[ltmauve]

If something ignores shields, trolls will use it to grief ships. However, I do agree with chaining disintegrators to create larger explosions.

 

[Achriel]

Seems everyone is worrying about Griefers, which is a factor to consider, but when it becomes a primary concern that denotes an entirely different problem. Docked Ships/Stations could easily remain invulnerable which will limit misuse to some degree and ships left floating in space are already very vulnerable. The only real problem is 2 players meeting each other and one intent on destroying the other, griefer or not we have at least one player wanting to destroy another's ship.. if that's a problem then don't play a PvP game/server.

Perhaps the easiest setting is simply making disintegrators an 'enemy' flag of a temporary type (if we gave them shield ignoring powers). We already have faction & player enemy flags perhaps we need certain weapons/device flags that server the same purpose. Think of this as the WMD (Weapons of Mass Destruction) flag which possessing these objects will make anyone normally neutral to you target you as an enemy (let the Allies & Friends remain the same unless they toggle it otherwise).

It's more coding than I had hoped for the developers but it's also something that might be useful down the road (and very configurable in the server settings). Having the Trading guild and many bases decide your ship (and not you as a player) are undesirable makes the use of these types of vessels much more strategic.

Before anyone mentions the 'jump out of a ramming ship' to escape certain death, that can be solved by the increased mass of disintegrators or a myriad of other methods (make the enemy flag stick to the player for 2-3 minutes etc..). I prefer the idea of disintegrators interfering with shields making them very difficult to shield, bigger BOOM equates to a decreased shield efficiency and as we know shooting a disintegrator loaded ship is more or less an insta-kill (or at least it was).

 

[Zone1135]

I just thought I would add my two cents (even though it's been over a month since anyone said anything.)

I like the idea of dis-integrators going through shields. I personally would use such a feature in things like bombers and things like that. But I also understand a lot of the negatives this can create. Hence I though, why not make it so they go through shields but they can't be protected by shields either? So if you have dis-integrators on your ship they can be shot at regardless of your shields.
This would (in my opinion) force people who were wanting to use them to at least have them partially concealed until they were useable, because they would cause a lot of risk to the ship they were on.

I'm going to overstep the topic a bit here but if griefing still occurs, then I think a range buff and reload nerf of the push pulse could make it an effective defense for ships. It would also add another layer of strategy because people would have to either wait till you fire your push pulse before trying to bomb you or look for unguarded spots where the pulse doesn't reach.

 

[EMC007]

Wait, what?

Disintegrators already pass through shields, at least for me

I agree that grouping of disintegrators should make it more powerful, but I thought that they already went through shields because every time I've tested around with them, they devastated the ship without even causing the shield effect

Also I add explosive containers on some of my ships for fun as if they were fuel tanks, but they wouldn't be destroyed until the shields are down, so making them explodable without the shields would cause issues

 

[Zone1135]

Well all you would need is some hull around your explosives, you could still use them as fuel tanks. You wouldn't just have your fuel sitting out there, it would make more sense to me to at least have some form of physical protection for something like that instead of just relying on shields.

I also though they went through shields, but after doing some testing noticed that if I went into a ship I just hit with one its shields were almost completely depleted. So I can only assume they must just have really high damage or something.

 

[Daniel L.]

Your ideas are bad, and you should feel bad.

Just have dis-intergrators do more damage, but good lord, don't make them just pass through shields.

Disintegrators have no use otherwise and it makes sense that they should go through shields, if you want defenses then just jump away or use turrets or a logic based pulse system that destroys anything that gets close to a ships hull,

Besides it makes a great weapon for underdog factions by being able to void the defenses of a large faction, Its makes anyone formidable and makes the pvp fair.

 

[DivineEvil]

I've never seiously considered using DIs for either purpoces. Whether the buff might look like, I only care for them being made from something more than a lump of processed junk. Jisper capsules might be a good choice.

 

[Incap]

Disintegrators have no use otherwise and it makes sense that they should go through shields, if you want defenses then just jump away or use turrets or a logic based pulse system that destroys anything that gets close to a ships hull,

Besides it makes a great weapon for underdog factions by being able to void the defenses of a large faction, Its makes anyone formidable and makes the pvp fair.

How dare you remind me of this thread. I will curse you and your entire bloodline.

You also have terrible ideas

 

[philthy mcnasty]

'Complex' isn't the word I'd use to describe your thinking.

I have no clue what you're talking about when you say logic chains. How the hell do logic chains factor into people using them to grief? This is how it'll play out. Place Core > add power and thrusters> ADD DISINTEGRATORS > point at enemy > hit top speed > exit core while in motion > free kill

Do you see the issue? That's a very simple and cheap way to grief.

And turrets only work if it's an enemy. If the thing doesn't have a faction block then the turret won't recognize if the player isn't in it. I just blew a bigger hole in your logic than a dis-integrator blast in a ship without shields.

Now you're saying we should have 2 types of shields? You mean physical armour right? That'd make sense for collisions and such, and maybe if the armour was effective at protecting against damage, then yeah, maybe disintegrators would be okay. But then you should nerf the damage so they can't be abused. You can't have it both ways.

combine this with the new grappling beam, and you have a drop pod.

Personally, i think disentragators need to be a boarding party thing. Give them 3 flavors: normal, timed delay that pierces shields, and remote detonated that pierces shields. The last two are for boarding only, and bypass faction restrictions on ships and stations.

Now, can the be triggered by an area of effect logic block? cause i was thinking of leaving some booby trapped ships to float around for people to explore...

 

[Incap]

combine this with the new grappling beam, and you have a drop pod.

Personally, i think disentragators need to be a boarding party thing. Give them 3 flavors: normal, timed delay that pierces shields, and remote detonated that pierces shields. The last two are for boarding only, and bypass faction restrictions on ships and stations.

Now, can the be triggered by an area of effect logic block? cause i was thinking of leaving some booby trapped ships to float around for people to explore...

No. Stop it.

 

[philthy mcnasty]

No. Stop it.

Nope.

As a professional griefer, so far in this boarding update, i have created what i call "the hunley", a drop pod with an explosive at the front. Its primary usage: hide in asteroids, while jamming, and waiting for noob ships to try to mine.

I then break open the hull near the core, weld my way to the player, and kill them.

Added fun if they had the salvage beams hooked up to storage chests, as i get all their stuff to boot. but this has only happened once in the 4 times in which i have done this.

boarding charges, will allow me to grief bigger targets.

 

[Incap]

Nope.

As a professional griefer, so far in this boarding update, i have created what i call "the hunley", a drop pod with an explosive at the front. Its primary usage: hide in asteroids, while jamming, and waiting for noob ships to try to mine.

I then break open the hull near the core, weld my way to the player, and kill them.

Added fun if they had the salvage beams hooked up to storage chests, as i get all their stuff to boot. but this has only happened once in the 4 times in which i have done this.

boarding charges, will allow me to grief bigger targets.

So you want these changes to make it easier to grief people.

Go to hell.

 

[philthy mcnasty]

Before the rail update, i was having trouble trying to create interlocking mines, now i can make them no problems.

I am not sure how cloaking works, if at all, for unmaned ships, if it can be triggered by logic. If it can, then i may try to make interlocked, cloaked and jammed mines.

I know before the rail update, i had a small docking module, around a ships core, covered in dsintgrators. i would dock this to a bomber, fly that into a planet, then from the bomber, release the docked cores.

This was a fun, and working dumb fire bomb.

 

[Daniel L.]

No need to worry about griefers anything can be destroyed due to negligence of attention to defenses, Is destroying a ship without shields griefing? if you want to stop a torpedo without being there to do so yourself or using turrets, Just use area triggers to activate a damage pulse that will destroy the torpedo.

 

[AtraUnam]

No need to worry about griefers anything can be destroyed due to negligence of attention to defenses, Is destroying a ship without shields griefing? if you want to stop a torpedo without being there to do so yourself or using turrets, Just use area triggers to activate a damage pulse that will destroy the torpedo.

That would be great if area triggers where at all reliable and it didn't take more than 300 damage pulses simply to provide complete defense against torpedoes for a mere 100x50x25 vessel. And if you are unable to get a warhead past a turret defense system you have no business deciding how they should be balanced.

 

[Yrjosmiel]

Da fok are disintegrators?

 

[CyberTao]

Da fok are disintegrators?

The original name for 'Warheads' as they are called now, this is a really old thread that was randomly dragged back up, so expect some things to maybe not make sense.

 

[BDLS]

No need to worry about griefers anything can be destroyed due to negligence of attention to defenses, Is destroying a ship without shields griefing? if you want to stop a torpedo without being there to do so yourself or using turrets, Just use area triggers to activate a damage pulse that will destroy the torpedo.

A retarded solution to a retarded idea. As I said before, it's retarded to expect everyone to cover their ships in area triggers linked to a damage pulse comp and praying it stops a cloaked deathstick

Just give warheads push pulse effect on hit or some kind of neat debuff.

Ignoring shields is literal space AIDS

Alright incap I'm commuting sudoku for bumping this thead again

 

[Daniel L.]

A retarded solution to a retarded idea. As I said before, it's retarded to expect everyone to cover their ships in area triggers linked to a damage pulse comp and praying it stops a cloaked deathstick

Just give warheads push pulse effect on hit or some kind of neat debuff.

Ignoring shields is literal space AIDS

Alright incap I'm commuting sudoku for bumping this thead again

The game cant go on with the unfair pvp, a guy with a big ship can easily murder a little ship, is that fair? A well designed and flown little ship should have as fair a chance of winning as the large one