The Hyper-Realm, non-instantaneous FTL travel method

[Calbiri]

• Many a spacefarer has dreamt of traveling the stars in a fabled FTL capable ship. Despite many disastrous experiments aimed at achieving a simile of this dream, one problem has continued to plague scientists and engineers, the catastrophic damage caused by collisions of matter at superluminal velocities. Even individual atoms pose a risk, the energies unleashed by impacting an asteroid or planet at FTL speeds are simply mind-boggling.
• Astronomers theorize that multiple universi have ceased to exist from this sort of energy release, and that the only reason ours hasn't suffered the same fate is due to a mysteriously physical speed limit of seemingly intelligent design.
• Now, the realm of hyper space has been known for some time, and its lack of any speed impediments has tempted many, for instantaneous travel would unlock the galaxy at last. Sadly every test ship attempting to travel via that realm has failed to return to normal space. Until now.
• A joint research project between the Calbirian Swarm and The Imperium of Man has yielded a possible solution.
• First, an answer to the mysterious loss of every ship attempting instantaneous hyper space jumps. A simple probe with no maneuvering capability was constructed to observe the hyper space realm and determine the nature of why ships never returned. The probe DID manage to return from hyper space after an minute, not having moved at all in real space. The probe had a major impact crater on its port side, but the starboard camera/data-storage were intact. The contents shocked the observing scientists.
• The probes memory core contained several minutes of video depicting a frightening spectacle, within the energetic realm of hyper space, void of all matter, there were... things... Nightmarish creatures of light and energy, ethereal demons, haunted this Hyper-Realm.
• The final seconds of footage revealed the source of the crater on the probe, a small apparition had approached with insane velocity and bitten off the missing portion. As the probe began to phase back out of the Hyper-Realm, the creature.., the daemon..., dissolved the ingested material and... grew.

I hope you enjoyed the bit of RP i threw in there, but for the sake of putting this concept into the game ill simplify.

1. Create a Hyper-Realm containing no natural blocks
2. Travel is not instant, but still at the 50 kph
3. Each meter traveled in Hyper-Realm translates to N meters traveled in normal space
4. When entering/leaving the Hyper-Realm a check can be made to insure no collisions will occur
5. The Hyper-Realm module should have a long cool down time to add strategy in its use and prevent simply spamming it. A large power draining charge-up requirement prior to Jumping could achieve the same effect
6. Any amount of time can be spent traveling in the Hyper-Realm, extended durations can be discouraged using the following methods
7. Shields will not recharge while in hyper space, and shield reserves will drain at a constant rate
8. Unshielded ships become vulnerable to matter ablation (your blocks start to dissolve, just like the damage you receive when too near a star)
9. Unshielded ships also become vulnerable to attack/block consumption by the Ethereal-Daemons that swarm through this realm (these could possibly also leech your shields)
10. As the Ethereal-Daemons consume blocks, they digest the blocks and grow larger, removing more blocks on each "attack"
11. Ethereal-Daemons can eventually grow massive enough to drop out of the Hyper-Realm to plague normal space
12. Ample cannon fire can disrupt Ethereal-Daemons, reducing their size (and potentially returning them to the Hyper-Realm) and eventually obliterating them (once they are reduced below 1 block), time can also eventually reduce them back to their natural state of 1 block
13. 1 Block sized Ethereal-Daemons are random spawn/despawned, only the larger versions will persist (save/load) in an area. (Yes this will create several dynamics in often used Hyper-Realm regions)
14. Other Daemons can be added later, like weapon firing types, types that have attained a physical form and board your vessel and remain even after leaving Hyper-Realm, ETC.
15. Large shielded ships can naturally stay in the Hyper-Realm longer than a small ship, and non-combat ships are not negatively effected for their lack of armaments, although an escort is beneficial
16. Even small fighters can use Hyper-Realm, simply dodging the Ethereal-Daemons attacks, although these fighters are advised to drop back to normal space before their shields fail, as block ablation on such small ships quickly leads to complete system failure.
17. I'm trying to create a viable FTL system while still avoiding pitfalls mentioned in other more instant methods mentions by schema, as well as using the new system to add depth to the Starmade universe
18. Think of Hyper-Realm travel somewhat like the Nether in Minecraft, in that case, traveling 1 block in the nether equates 8 blocks in the Overworld
19. Theres the possibility of using a flagship to link multiple ships to jump in sync, allowing fleet travel running off the flagships power/sheilds ?
20. Theres also the possibility of encountering other Stardwellers in Hyper-Realm, and choosing (or not) to engage in high risk combat (as losing sheilds with all those Ethereal-Daemons around is risky)
21. I may add other ideas as i think of them

 

[schema]

Oh wow, I really like that. It must be balanced very exact though.

If only one system would translate to one hyperspace which is basically the size of 16x16x16 sectors into the size of one sector, it would give players a lot more potential to meet. I\'m a bit worried though that regular space traveling would be negleted, so using that would have to be either resource heavy, risky, or both (like you already brought up).



A great idea overall though!

 

[Calbiri]

I added in the negatives that can be adjusted (like the sheild drain) to decrease time in Hyper-Realm, combined with the charge-up and/or cooldown times, this will prevent making multiple long-distance jumps in sequence. Im sure you could balance this

Also, yes, i advocate what you said about the size translation, thats the idea, its all locked in sync, and the mobs stay in the same general area (which will add a further possible cooldown time, as simply dropping out/in again will still leaving you fighting those huge daemons you dropped out to avoid, since not enough time has elasped for them to shrink back to normal)

I also see this working in combination with warpgates which would be geared to favor smaller ships (as opposed to Hyper-Realm favoring large ships) Ill post my ideas on this shortly

 

[Youka]

Feel like the nether-realm from minecraft, or warp travel from 40k but pretty cool ! Looks like you gave it a lot of thought =)

And a lot more convenient and awesome than FTL, or gate systems.



About long distances trip i have another simpler suggestion.

it would be really practical to be able to grab a planet\'s coordinates through the K assigned map.



I spent an awful amount of time yesterday night rtying to reach a planet on NASS and i lost the track of it at every sector change...Even worse from one sector to another, the planet often seemed to have changed place...Resulting in me going in circles for a long time before realising i was actually back to the initial sector. =/



At least getting the coordinates of the planet i clicked in the map would allow me to enter it in the navigation

 

[Logoscyth]

So, you want the Nether in Starmade? Fine by me. I\'d enjoy the challenge. Perhaps, as you mentioned above, only ships of a certain mass can enter hyperspace? Since you mentioned warp gates, maybe an implementation like EVE Online\'s wormhole space system? Each wormhole is allotted a certain amount of mass that can pass through it, and every ship passing through decreases that amount until the wormhole closes. Anyway, this is a neat idea. I\'d like to see the implications of this on multiplayer gameplay.

 

[Calbiri]

I was thinking about this, but i forgot to mention it, YES a nav system would be vital in this, although given the size differences, the Hyper-Realm nav could only reliably get you to the same system, not the exact sector (which might help solve the issue schema mentioned of ignoring normal space) so once you get to a system, you still need to navigate it manually in regular space

 

[Calbiri]

Nato linked this to me and its EXACTLY the look i had in mind for the Hyper-realm background

http://thelordinquisitor.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/BattleBarge_Coteaz.jpg

the blue/green lightning storm effect behind that ship, but it would be all around you in the Hyper-Realm

maybe even add in a bleed-through looking effect when entering/leaving Hyper-Realm to make you ship look JUST like it doesn in that picture

 

[Calbiri]

Hyper-Realm has no mass limit, nor should it, smaller ships are simply at high risk from staying in Hyper-Realm for too long. Thats why a Gate system for the smaller ships is a good idea, so i advocate both systems.

Gates arent the sort used in Eve, more like something from Portal, two gates linked together with gate size determined by the surrounding gate, like in minecrafts nethergate (maybe you could even see through?) although you would still need to cross the \"sector border\" that would exist as a sort of event horizon between the two gates

The building blocks for gates would be Exspensive, in materials or credit price (to the tune of hundreds of millions of credits per block, an individual can feild a gate, at a risk of losing the blocks, but only at extreme costs) larger gates can literally fit larger ships through them, but are exponentially more exspensive as the circumfrance of the gate requires more and more blocks to expand.

Gates may also require a charge up time (you drain your power to operate the gate)

Gates can be destroyed (or if unfaction protected, even stolen) so defense of them is vital

A very brave faction may even feild a gate onto/into a carrier to provide a mobile access point, but given the price of the blocks, they could stand to lose a great deal (as well as provide a back-door to potential invasion if they lose the ship)

1 gate can link to only 1 matching gate (easily determined by only allowing 2 of each gate name, and requiring that they match shape

 

[MrFURB]

This is a good idea, but there needs to be counterplay options for this. Imagine people using this to instantly field large carriers with other docked vessels/turrets. Unless you leave AI ships in hyperspace, which is impossible under your method, you can\'t expect the enemy. The only effective defense tactic is to have constant hyperspace scouting going on or to set up a fully automatic ambush force of AI craft, neither of which are directly linked to the players having fun, but to them building something and sending it out like an ant queen making herself guards.

Yes, whatever is coming out of hyperspace is temporarily out of power, but it doesn\'t that long to recharge power, especially if it has smaller ships docked to it.

At the same time, there is no effective way to track the movements of enemies through subspace or cripple their use of subspace because you would have to first find their nearly-infinite-distance-away capital ships and attack and destroy them before they can subspace away. If subspace as you have stated it comes out I would use it almost exclusively and all my attack pattern would be fielding medium/large carriers and letting loose swarms of AI frigates before retreating until I can sub-warp again.

An idea I have is that in order to enter/exit subspace you have to have a non-hostile whatever-block-subspace-computer-may-be in the sector already. Put it on bases, put it on stealth ships (Sneak them into enemy groups and then subwarp your force straight to them, shame on them for not being vigilant enough!), put it on a huge firebase to ambush would-be ambushers, and I\'m sure there will be many other uses for it. Just an idea!

 

[bobucles]

This is a clone of the minecraft nether realm!

Not that there\'s anything wrong with that. We all want to build big ships and test them against horrible horrible demons.

 

[Calbiri]

minecraft isnt the first universe to consider this concept, it only happens to resemble the nether, and being a voxel game i did use it as an example, if anything though, the heart of this concept is from 40k and the chaos, and no- there wont be pigmen...

 

[Calbiri]

i like the idea of this encouraging carriers actually.

your ignoring other possible defenses (and points)

firstly, as 1 sector in Hyper-Realm equates to 1 system in normal space (16x16x16 sectors) trying to accuratly drop into the exact right sector to suprise attack someone isnt all that easy, and most bases will already have automated defenses. (ai turret \"sattelite\" station or thrusterless ships)

second, frequent ships in a particular regions hyper-realm will tend to make the local daemons more powerful as they continue to grow (they need time to shrink down remember) so \"hotspots\" can be created in the Hyper-Realm, just jump in a large mass ship and leave it there, the local daemons will devour it, become dangerously large and will essentially \"guard\" that area from all outsiders (all players)

finding ships in subspace is pointless, nobody is suppose to \"camp\" there, its a slower version of the instant jump concept, but its not suppose to be somewhere your willing to sit around launching fighters from, not even in super powerfull ships, as larger ships will have more daemons draining their sheilds/eating their blocks

wont most attackers be using a carrier fleet anyways? regardless of hyper-realm

 

[Calbiri]

Thanks for all the posts so far, your making me think :D

 

[ownedhawk]

perhaps the warp is uncharted and you have too find the entrance/exit portals scattered about the galaxy, would give you fixed locations to defend, require you too traverse the warp too pre-plan routes for fleet movement and be less exploitable. just my thoughts

 

[Ira Sol]

Thumbs ups! This sounds like an amazing idea.

 

[ownedhawk]

it wouldnt negate travel through standard space ever, just be a means to travel greater distances

 

[MrFURB]

Anyone writing coordinates down and that has a basic concept of what the subspace is won\'t \'miss\' a jump.

The hotspots idea is good, but will it not also affect bases/trade routes? People would have to deal with the inconvenience of having to first travel a sector off to get rid of subspace turbulence.

And one of the concepts I find most important in such a large world is that of borders and territory. To feel like player actions have an impact on the world as a whole there needs to be relatively clear borders between larger factions, pirate groups, good mining/exploring space, etc. Without clear borders and terriitories being markable and read, mining, salvaging, and warfare will be sporadic and nobody will know where good territory is, and will likely be wandering about for a few hours before finding untarnished space.

I don\'t want faction warfare in this game to come down to who can find/destroy the enemy\'s base first or attack with the fewest enemies online. That is what Minecraft is. I\'d love for combat to be centralized around valuable territories and the renewing resources within them, slowly pushing in with each victory until your opponent collapses... Then you can make a mad rush for the enemy base now that they don\'t have the resources to ward off a good siege.

Giving people a way of travelling thorugh massive distances is good. Convenience is good. Giving people a way to ignore blockades and appear wherever whenever is something I can\'t bring myself to accept.

 

[R_Artis]

build epic reactor, stuff it with shields and rape those demons. :D or even get pvned when you realize demon is 15x biger than your ship :D if it will be added to game then i can\'t wait.

 

[Travbro]

Meh. The demons thing makes it a direct 40k ripoff. Make it moderately trippy and make it slowly deal damage to ships over time. That way only heavily shielded ships can stay in it for long periods of time, favoring it as a means of travel for large ships. Once shielding inside hyperspace wears off, it should deal block damage, the same way that suns do right now. That, I could get behind. But as a Warp ripoff, I\'ll pass.

 

[Present_containing]

I hate this idea.