StarMade Ship Systems 2.0

    Discussion in 'Game News' started by schema, May 16, 2017.

    1. RedAlert_007

      RedAlert_007 [Insert generic custom title here]

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      [​IMG]

      Yo devs, hit me up if you need some help testing ;)
       
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    2. Malacodor

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      The day when a small ship will be realistically able to defeat a much bigger ship, that isn't badly designed, will be the day I'll delete the game, and I'm sure I won't be the only one.

      Griefers' paradise - no thanks.
       
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    3. Optapodamus

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      In many games/sci-fi genre's bombers are the natural counter to capital ships. Rts games like the homeworld series for example use a rock paper scissors style counters where capital ships beat frigates, frigates beat fighters, fighters beat capitals. Starcraft is another example, battlecruisers are countered by fighters, Starwars empire at war, star destroyers by bombers.

      Griefing is defined as " a person who harasses or deliberately provokes other players or members in order to spoil their enjoyment."
      Ship boarding actions would be defined as pvp. Starwars battlefront 2 was very popular for similar boarding mechanics. One could attack the enemy capital ships hard points from the outside using a fighter or land in the launch bay and attack the systems from the inside.
       
    4. jontyfreack

      jontyfreack Pipe-God-Emperor of starmade

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      no.

      Reasons include those already stated in another thread by the likes of redalert, and I do not have to expand on those reasons.

      However I myself at somepoint thought that something like regenerating blocks would be cool, but I asked myself "how on earth would this work" and realised that regenerative blocks would make fighting completely pointless apart from some form of fun if people like shooting things and not gaining anything from it. But I can see where the ideas for stuff like this comes from and it is in regards of ships being too easy to destroy and ships being to easy to destroy things with, the only real solution for this is to change the balance of the game somewhat, and I have faith that systems 2.0 can help somewhat.

      Well a fighter/small ship would do absolutely jack against a large ship, the only reason in some sci-fi bombers can damage capital ships is because they carry absurdly overpowered weapons and bombs for their size. In some cases bombers are used to bomb ships once their shields are depleted because, well, bombs destroy more than pin-point lasers. Essentially a small ship should pose no threat whatsoever to a larger ship as long as the larger ship has shields, SM already has warheads that are sometimes used effectively against larger ships as an annoyance to either: drive the larger ship away because they are pissed, drive the larger ship into a full on assault by several other large-ish ships, destroy dockers on ships, Debby.

      All in all, a basic non-optimised small ship will be able to fight other non-optimised small ships and maybe pose a threat to something twice its size, but never something around 2m mass (unless it is optimised extremely to do just that and basically nothing else)
       
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    5. Optapodamus

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      Regenerating blocks: I wasn't insinuating that ships be able to completely heal while in the middle of battle. Maybe be able to make some minor repairs in a long drawn out battle, being able to bring some systems back up for keep them from failing with some effort, like star trek. I thought I made it clear that the ship would take a long time to repair on it's own even after the battle, which would facilitate the use of shipyards, and ships with repair beams.

      Fighters designed to destroy larger ships in popular games: Star wars, Y-wings, Tie bombers. Star wars empire at war; bombers were the greatest counter to capital ships and excelled at destroying "hard points" like shield generators, engines, and individual weapon batteries. Starcraft: The counter to battle cruisers: Anti-air fighter craft. Homeworld: Heavy cruiser is most vulnerable to fighters.
      The argument might be made that most often in sci fi very large ships are countered by small bombers.
       
    6. Lecic

      Lecic Convicted Lancake Abuser

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      Small ships can already put out a huge amount of DPS for their size, and this is a voxel game. We cannot balance things in the same way.
       
    7. silverfoe

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      My question to you is:
      Why would you then bother investing in a big ship to begin with?
       
    8. JumpSuit

      JumpSuit Lost-Legacy Director

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      Can this thread just 'let die', as the band Green Day would put it ;)
       
    9. MeRobo

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      But that is where a big problem with that game came from. Due to bombers (and other ships with torpedos and iirc missiles) being able to circumvent shields, you could use bombers to leave the enemy with ships consisting of nothing but engines snd shield generators.

      Why your suggestion supports griefing: You give players a cheap way of destroying expensive things of other players and I'm pretty sure, having your stuff destroyed by something which only requires a fraction of the destroyed ship's cost will spoil your enjoyment. And people would know this.
       
    10. Optapodamus

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      I was giving examples to people who claimed that the idea of small ships beating larger ships was ridiculous

      Because the big ship would theoretically be best against destroyer/frigates. You'd then want anti-fighter frigates to accompany your capital ship, etc etc. So as to promote diverse fleets with ships in specialized roles.

      Sounds good to me ;)

      It is less safe, that would make it more fun actually lol. A pawn overtakes a queen in chess, it's frustrating but I don't think the pawn is to blame, I think my poor strategy is. In my opinion, which I mistakenly thought was the consensus, the game lacks strategic variety.
       
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    11. Ithirahad

      Ithirahad Arana'Aethi
      Community Mentor

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      Or, it might stop people from flying titanic ships and feeling invincible in them. I have to agree that the idea isn't altogether a good one, but the repercussions wouldn't be all bad, either. People couldn't fly massive ships alone willy-nilly any more; they would only deploy such things, and the sheer firepower that they can carry, if they have a sufficient defense against smaller vessels.
       
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    12. deathsoul097

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      Personally i quite like the idea of Bombers, and it isnt actually a griefing tool, and let me tell you why. If you arent putting Point Defence on your ship, then you deserve to die from enemy bombers. Its not like they cant be killed, and one bomb wont be effective on its own.

      This is something that already has a pre-existing natural counter in the game, that you don't see simply because there is no reason to utilize it. Bombers are gonna be a ship like any other, and making a bomber swarm so big they can overwhelm a small fleet's Point Defence is going to be so expensive that it will be almost infeasible.
       
      #532 deathsoul097, Sep 15, 2017 at 9:30 AM
      Last edited: Sep 15, 2017 at 10:48 PM
    13. Malacodor

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      You won't destroy anything big with a single fighter in these games. What you do is defeating few big ships with many small ones for the same resource cost as the big ones. And that is exactly what we already have in StarMade for quite some time.
       
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