Prerelease v0.200.250

[Zoolimar]

Also how big is the shield radius?

25+N^0.3*5 where N is the number of recharge blocks in a group.

For 1000 blocks that would be 64.7 meters.

 

[PhiFouX]

I keep thinking that Power Update is the biggest mistake of the Video Game History !

 

[Non]

I keep thinking that's that Power Update is the biggest mistake of the Video Game History !

Not sure about biggest, there is some good stuff, but it's certainly up there.

 

[NuclearHolocaust]

You could put mass enhancers for the barrels to move, and thrusters for your mothership to use and to help you dock the turrets.

Ideally they would implement a system that lets us link weapons in the base to the barrels.

Thats what i wanted to point out, its basically nothing you can put in there.
I mean putting thrusters in a turret works in game, but realistically this is probably unlikely and does not really feel right when the turret base is actually a part of the turret and not a thrustersystem.
Mass enhancers are the only thing left then, which is really disappointing.
Putting in weapon modules linked to the barrels would be a thing, but its still just unnecessary to prevent any other defensive or supporting features on the turret base.


But by now i think it will be done this way anyway.
together with the shield radius stuff, thanks for ruining big turrets that are not just guns on a hinge

 

[Crimson-Artist]

I keep thinking that Power Update is the biggest mistake of the Video Game History !

no, that honor belongs to the New game experience for Star Wars Galaxies. seriously, screw SOE.

 

[kulbolen]

original ao and ff14 launches would have words w that as well. i can think of some pretty game killing mistakes lmao

 

[Astrocat]

I keep thinking that Power Update is the biggest mistake of the Video Game History !

cough No Man's Sky on release cough

 

[Matt_Bradock]

cough No Man's Sky on release cough

I think the Biggest Mistake in Video Game History, has the last SW Battlefront II scandal contending. It cost EA 2 billion US dollars in stock value, sales tanked, and they are stuck with a $60 game they can't monetize other than the base price despite having the entire business plan revolve around additional monetization. And the collective uproar of gamers ans Star Wars fans may even cost them the SW license as Disney doesn't like when the reputation of one of their franchises is hurt.

Derailment aside: while the current shape of things on the Power Update seems like a mess, the system itself might work with serious adjustments to the values.
Here are some quick remedies that would vastly improve creative freedom:
- Cut the distance needed between reactor and stabilisers in half (at least). This would allow people to realistically have other options than placing the reactor in one end of the ship and the stabilisers in the other, and maybe have options to realistically build something other than a needle or dumbbell, or place more than one group of stabilisers (on the 2 sides, for example) This also somewhat helps the controversy that reactors currently require ships that are definitely elongated on one direction, while shield scaling prefers shapes built towards a sphere due to diminishing returns on radius scaling.
- Tune the hit pont numbers. Chambers themselves should be considered non-critical systems (like shields, thrusters) that do not contribute to reactor HP. They are add-ons that do not directly affect power generation when hit (other than eliminating a consumer), they cause only the loss of bonus funtions. However, normal systems should still contribute to system HP, especially because THERE MUST BE A WAY TO OVERHEAT AND REMOVE ENTITIES THAT DO NOT HAVE A SINGLE REACTOR BLOCK ON THEM (turrets for example) if you don't want servers to clutter up with loose entities until the point of crash.

Other issues, for example how much empty space remains on old hulls when attempting a re-fit, even with extended interiors, should be still addressed (maybe nerf on shield caps or a modified hull block as promised earlier to act as a filler), but the most critical are the 2 above.

 

[Edymnion]

Thats what i wanted to point out, its basically nothing you can put in there.

Welp, to be completely honest? Its because people abused docked entities to game breaking levels.

When Schine took less drastic measures to try and get the "Hey guys, this is bad, please don't do this" message across, they basically just flipped the bird and found a different way to do it.

So its like anything else in gaming. A minority ruined it for everybody else.

 

[LoSboccacc]

Welp, to be completely honest? Its because people abused docked entities to game breaking levels.

removing docked entity effects from going uphill in the dock chain would have been enough (almost, there's circular docking to be fixed too, but still)

some formula tweak to shield and weapons to avoid gigantism and that'd be it.

anyway.

anyone knows how to level up trees that branch after the first level? like the armor chamber - I can specify the effect first level but can't level up, it's always grayed out

 

[Edymnion]

removing docked entity effects from going uphill in the dock chain would have been enough (almost, there's circular docking to be fixed too, but still)

Well, they couldn't go downhill because of docked reactors. They couldn't go uphill because people just docked reactors and then docked turrets directly to those reactors instead of the main ship. They couldn't have their own shields because people covered ships in shield turrets that caused hell on servers. There were even people making entire HULLS docked to systems to prevent things like punch through from getting to their systems.

anyone knows how to level up trees that branch after the first level? like the armor chamber - I can specify the effect first level but can't level up, it's always grayed out

If its an upgrade of the existing thing, like level 1-2-3, then you just have to hit the upgrade button. If its a completely different thing that has something else as a pre-req, you need to build the chambers to reflect that. As in, have your base chamber for the base ability, then build a new chamber coming off of it that you can then specify as the secondary effect chamber.

 

[Non]

There were even people making entire HULLS docked to systems to prevent things like punch through from getting to their systems.

To stop punch? Punch is made to break through hulls and armor bars, a docked hull doesn't stop it.

 

[Edymnion]

To stop punch? Punch is made to break through hulls and armor bars, a docked hull doesn't stop it.

Should have said piercing, sorry.

The way it was was that it would shoot through an entity but not anything behind it. So people were docking entire hulls as an abusive way to prevent the shots from reaching into the systems, and it was basically destroying servers whenever a big ship like that went down because the hull undocked and suddenly you had millions of blocks clipping through each other.

 

[Ithirahad]

THERE MUST BE A WAY TO OVERHEAT AND REMOVE ENTITIES THAT DO NOT HAVE A SINGLE REACTOR BLOCK ON THEM (turrets for example) if you don't want servers to clutter up with loose entities until the point of crash.

The ship core has, or should have, some RHP. However, this might mean that we're back to coring for turrets...

 

[Zoolimar]

Well, they couldn't go downhill because of docked reactors. They couldn't go uphill because people just docked reactors and then docked turrets directly to those reactors instead of the main ship. They couldn't have their own shields because people covered ships in shield turrets that caused hell on servers. There were even people making entire HULLS docked to systems to prevent things like punch through from getting to their systems.

Reason is simple - because game systems were designed in such a way that it was beneficial to do so.

Because reactors had non-linear scaling and a cap - so of course you will build reactors up to cap and dock more of them.
Shields had diminishing returns and it was possible to have some additional benefits due to how damage was going through docked entities up to main ship - so of course docked shields and armor were used.

I have an evil urge to try and make a non-docked shield / armor that is kept at a ship by clamps, that just hug it tightly. Sadly it probably will come out on the first sector change or even sooner.

 

[Edymnion]

I have an evil urge to try and make a non-docked shield / armor that is kept at a ship by clamps, that just hug it tightly. Sadly it probably will come out on the first sector change or even sooner.

Get creative with fleet mechanics!

We know that ships will always try to line up in rows on either side of you, you should be able to make what is effectively a barrier/shield ship that puts a shell segment around your main ship that is held in place by the barrier ship holding formation.

 

[Zoolimar]

Get creative with fleet mechanics!

For that you need better AI and fleet controls. As long as I can evade AI ships that have larger TWR than my own ship it won't work. Because there are no reasons to engage them at their best. Running from them is much more reasonable, especially since they spread around and you can kill them in smaller groups.

 

[Edymnion]

For that you need better AI and fleet controls.

Which will come in time.

We have to have the mechanics and tools in place for the AI to use before we can write the AI. AI has been dumb as bricks in this game for ages because its always just been a placeholder. Its good enough to test things with, thats all it needs to be right now. Once all the components are in place, smarter AI can be written once we're relatively sure we aren't going to invalidate it 6 months later.

 

[Non]

Which will come in time.

Oh sure, yeah, that works, lets just have the game be unplayable for months between updates, who needs fun anyway?

 

[Edymnion]

Oh sure, yeah, that works, lets just have the game be unplayable for months between updates, who needs fun anyway?

The game is not unplayable, stop exaggerating.

And honestly, its an alpha. The goal right now isn't to have the funnest game in the universe, its to get stuff implemented and have enough players to use as unpaid testers. Thats it.

Alpha state games are incomplete, buggy, and unoptomized. By definition. If that is unacceptable to someone, they don't need to be in an alpha.