Read by Schine Asteroid Wrangling: A new way to mine.

[the_Grey_Sky]

Hi all. Long time Starmade player/fan first time on forum.

I have been thinking long and hard about a couple of changes that I would love to be considered and improved (through forum discussion) possibly even to a point of Starmade implementation.

The short version: Use Starmade shipyards to deconstruct asteroids/chucks of planets. These are brought to the shipyards by asteroid wrangling ships.

The full idea: Make a change to the way salvaging beams work by making them more of a cutting tool. This would allow small ships to slice off chunks of asteroids that can then be transported to a shipyard to be deconstructed. This can also be used to slice off chunks of planets. Larger, stronger ships will have the power to move larger and larger pieces of asteroid. Once the piece of asteroid or planet has been transported back to the player's station, they will fly the chunk into the Shipyard. A shipyard which has already been set to asteroid mining mode would hold the asteroid at its center of mass: the player must ensure that the asteroid can fit or will have trim the asteroid to make it fit.

The reason for this change: the current system for asteroid mining is something that is fun at first but soon becomes a chore. This idea adds more to the over all process of asteroid mining but I can foresee players actually enjoying slicing asteroids up, docking the chunks to a ship and transporting large chunks back to their home base.

When I am mining in the game currently, I just seem to slice up the asteroid into chunks, or slowly and painfully erase the asteroid systematically. This gets boring very quickly. I think I just enjoy being able to slice thorough the asteroid in one sweep with my supersized mining blaster ship.

I thought about using the shipyard for two reasons. The first being that shipyards already construct/deconstruct ship grids. The second is that shipyards can be made any size, therefore allowing players to build a very small one right at the beginning to use for this very purpose.

Thank you for your time, and I would love your contribution to this idea!

 

[NeonSturm]

I really like it.

A small ship can transport a big chunk.
If not through hyperspace/jump, then maybe through a gate to a salvaging-station.

But some ships (especially larger) may put effort into on-board salvaging modules (less efficient, but you only get that much before you need to target another asteroid - which takes time)

 

[the_Grey_Sky]

The only issue i see with on board salvaging modules, is we will probably end up with the currant system, so there would be no point to change it. Or if you meant something more like the refinery's, it may put to much favor onto mobile stations, and to my currant understanding that is not going to happen that's why i though it would be more like dragging chunks around

 

[terra mining corp.]

I think it would be more fun to have automated miing drills you could set up on a planet or asteroid that would mine and you could set up a factory to be fed,the fun part would be protecting from pirates and other players.

 

[Deserea]

Im for this, but, not as a replacement for the current mining, as another way to do it, sure. my mining vessel right now *eats* a full asteroid in one firing of my mining beams, and this suggestion would make it take /forever/ to do the same thing, and it would get for me, very tedious, very fast. The current mining is already tedious, lets not add more time spent traveling back and forth, and make it the only way, please.

As another way for sure, im for it. As the only way, no. Leave mining beams in game as they are, cause honestly in my singleplayer game(if this was made the only), this would just about kill the game for me out of sheer boredom, and the fact id have to redesign a mining vessel ive been working on for the better part of this games life span.

 

[Valck]

my mining vessel right now *eats* a full asteroid in one firing of my mining beams, and this suggestion would make it take /forever/ to do the same thing, and it would get for me, very tedious, very fast.

Of course rebalancing would have to happen. I don't see why it would have to be less rewarding. Milling up the asteroid in a refinery could simply yield the tenfold amount of resources you're getting by shooting it with lasers, so you might even net more stuff per time than you do now. And both systems could exist in parallel.

 

[Deserea]

Of course rebalancing would have to happen. I don't see why it would have to be less rewarding. Milling up the asteroid in a refinery could simply yield the tenfold amount of resources you're getting by shooting it with lasers, so you might even net more stuff per time than you do now. And both systems could exist in parallel.

Sure they could, but one would(more than likely) always be better than the other. If you make milling an asteroid give more resources, then mining lasers become less than desirable, and overall probably worth far less to the point of being useless.( from a single player standpoint only since you have nothing to worry about at all, and thats my concern, as i play on a build server for multiplayer.). Players find the best way to do things, thats always the case. It wouldnt be so bad /if/ singleplayer had random raids that would happen, as it would make it risky to pull an asteroid back to a base. On multiplayer, dragging a asteroid back to be milled would be quite risky(and i could for sure see the reward for doing so boosted) depending on the server you are playing in, and the faction you belong to.

 

[Nickizzy]

I think it would be more fun to have automated miing drills you could set up on a planet or asteroid that would mine and you could set up a factory to be fed,the fun part would be protecting from pirates and other players.

Like a sort if reasource zone/ ore vein?

One thing I never saw adressed was how people would move asteoids around. Bumping it or shooting it with push and pull effect are just really random, maybe a "tractor beam" or "containent field", that held an object(nonstation/attatched planet segment) a set difference away from where it's facing. Useful for holding stuff, but doesn't sheild it, and ships cannot fire weapons while in the feild(but can move out and shoot after a certain range(stop beams can keep an enemy ship inside, otherwise it will fly out. It can still rotate around, and stays with the craft(like astronauts aligning) and gravitate back to the center of the feild if they move away.

 

[spunkiethefirst]

Like a sort if reasource zone/ ore vein?

One thing I never saw adressed was how people would move asteoids around. Bumping it or shooting it with push and pull effect are just really random, maybe a "tractor beam" or "containent field", that held an object(nonstation/attatched planet segment) a set difference away from where it's facing. Useful for holding stuff, but doesn't sheild it, and ships cannot fire weapons while in the feild(but can move out and shoot after a certain range(stop beams can keep an enemy ship inside, otherwise it will fly out. It can still rotate around, and stays with the craft(like astronauts aligning) and gravitate back to the center of the feild if they move away.

The most effective and controllable way I have found is the pull effect as it wont spin the asteroid. As far as sending asteroids to your base you can pull them through a warp gate that you mount on another asteroid and send them to your homebase warp gate to get the mining bonus from your claimed homebase system. This becomes more necessary on servers that have asteroid respawn disabled.

 

[Psychochicken]

Sure they could, but one would(more than likely) always be better than the other. If you make milling an asteroid give more resources, then mining lasers become less than desirable, and overall probably worth far less to the point of being useless.

I think it would be more fun to have automated miing drills you could set up on a planet or asteroid that would mine and you could set up a factory to be fed,the fun part would be protecting from pirates and other players.

As far as I can see there are three ways of mining mentioned: the mining beam, deconstructing asteroids in shipyrad and a stationary mining. I believe all three are possible, without making one of them useless to a certain point.
These three ways of mining could be seen as tiers of mining. In early game you will start out with the cheapest one, which also will give you less than the other two tiers. Than after gathering materials and credits enough it's possible to purchase a better mining tool (tier 2). This will give a better chances for more valuble materials when mining or mining faster. Than to go to the last tier you need a even bigger amount of materials, credits and maybe even faction points to get the best tools, or the permission/knowledge to use the best tool.
Also when using the highest tier, there could be a risk when using it. An example: The stationary mining is set as a tier three, which gives most materials in the shortest time, but the owner of the facility have to protect it from pirates, players and other dangers, and maybe only make this way of mining possible in rare places. Some people will not take that risk and therefore keep using tier two and get fewer materials, but dosen't have to think about or invest so much in protecting against dangers.

The use of mining tool will also depend on how the players are living in the Starmade universe. If you are a player who likes to travel and never settle down, than you might prefer a mining laser over the other two, even though this tool might provide you with less than the other two ways of mining. (Depending on which way of mining is set to be the most efficient).

The use of mining tool could also depend on what type of ore a player need. There could be a difference in what the chances are for getting a specific ore, depending on what tool you are using. So in some cases the mining laser is the preferred tool, and in other cases it's best to use the shipyard.

So as I see it, one way of mining dosen't take the place of the other way.

 

[Nexusdog]

I foresee a scenario evolving... asteroid griefing, whereby factions on a server corral asteroids into one sector controlled by another faction to prohibit movement and/or create lag.

It's quite a good idea, but bear in mind the potentially negative consequences as well.

 

[sayerulz]

I foresee a scenario evolving... asteroid griefing, whereby factions on a server corral asteroids into one sector controlled by another faction to prohibit movement and/or create lag.

It's quite a good idea, but bear in mind the potentially negative consequences as well.

There's not really anything stopping people from doing this as it is. It is easier to make a bunch of ship cores and cover them in rock with the 10x10 build tool than to move a bunch of asteroids anyway.

I personally think this is a great idea.

 

[the_Grey_Sky]

Like a sort if reasource zone/ ore vein?

One thing I never saw adressed was how people would move asteoids around.

-snip-

I had thought That it used a grapple system, that would function exactly like the rail docking or maybe a containment field like you said. I left the method open to discussion, I should have been more specific.

As far as I can see there are three ways of mining mentioned: the mining beam, deconstructing asteroids in shipyrad and a stationary mining. I believe all three are possible, without making one of them useless to a certain point.
These three ways of mining could be seen as tiers of mining.

-Snip-

So as I see it, one way of mining dosen't take the place of the other way.

This more what I had imagined
But I never thought of tiers, Great Idea!

 

[Nickizzy]

I had thought That it used a grapple system, that would function exactly like the rail docking or maybe a containment field like you said. I left the method open to discussion, I should have been more specific.

One thing I never saw adressed was how people would move asteoids around. Bumping it or shooting it with push and pull effect are just really random, maybe a "tractor beam" or "containent field", that held an object(nonstation/attatched planet segment) a set difference away from where it's facing. Useful for holding stuff, but doesn't sheild it, and ships cannot fire weapons while in the feild(but can move out and shoot after a certain range(stop beams can keep an enemy ship inside, otherwise it will fly out. It can still rotate around, and stays with the craft(like astronauts aligning) and gravitate back to the center of the feild if they move away.

I said it 6 posts up^-^. But a less expensive grappeling system or a rail block that stuck to other blocks like a sticky block would be cool as well.

 

[Nickizzy]

That just made me think of a bunch of cool uses for sticky blocks! Sticky bombs or drone swarm swatters! The only problem would be grefers stealling capital ships and running off with them. Hopefully the thruster system will fix this, only thruster hunks would be able to make decent speed with any ship.

 

[Chances_Ghost]

step 1, spawwn warp gate in middle of astroid field

step 2, push/pull the astraids through it to your mining station

step 3, build mining arrays around your new astroids

step, 4 laugh as you push a single button to mine an entire astroid field surrounding your station

 

[the_Grey_Sky]

That just made me think of a bunch of cool uses for sticky blocks! Sticky bombs or drone swarm swatters! The only problem would be grefers stealling capital ships and running off with them.
Snip
.

Love this idea actually!
although we could just use the default rails, but add a block that when receiving an input fires like a harpoon and inserts a rail docker block into the object, only works if the object is not allready on rails, must be supplied with rail docker blocks, has a range max of two blocks, and uses up a rail docker block regardless of a successful activation or not. Destroys the block it is placed in.
Could be used to grab small ships as well as asteroids.

Edit: once the object has been harpooned it could dock to the harpoon launcher block, and then begin to travel along it like any other rail, this way you would need rail mass blocks to grab anything too big

 

[ToasterBorst]

I have done several experiments in this vein involving capitol ship systems with a warp gate on a ship (does not currently work) and attempting to dock an asteroid to a ship (also does not currently work); the idea being to bring the asteroids back to a station with a large logic fired salvage array. While these mechanics are currently not working, I love the idea and yes, I'd totally be an asteroid wrangler. I'll go ahead and bump this discussion to the council for further review.. so do please continue evolving it!

 

[Gunseng]

Wouldn't this also make a "Processing Ship" possible? Basically like the massive fishing vessels that gut and can tuna while at sea, pull the asteroid onto a rail and the rail feeds it through salvage beams.

 

[the_Grey_Sky]

I have done several experiments in this vein involving capitol ship systems with a warp got on a ship (does not currently work) and attempting to dock an asteroid to a ship (also does not currently work); the idea being to bring the asteroids back to a station with a large logic fired salvage array. While these mechanics are currently not working, I love the idea and yes, I'd totally be an asteroid wrangler. I'll go ahead and bump this discussion to the council for further review.. so do please continue evolving it!

Yes I tried something much like this and also found I could not move the asteroids effectively, thank you for bringing it to the light of the council! :D

Wouldn't this also make a "Processing Ship" possible? Basically like the massive fishing vessels that gut and can tuna while at sea, pull the asteroid onto a rail and the rail feeds it through salvage beams.

That's a great idea, I had not thought of that