Artificial Planet (Station) Development

[EricBlank]

So the next project i wanted to work on was a spherical artificial planet. But before i really get started, i wanted some advice, maybe some hurtles and solutions other players have had working on a similar project in the past.

The plan was to have a hollow center where additional parts could be docked. The planet itself would probably have to be at least 150m diameter, and around that i was going to dock a crystal armor sphere to act as a shield, which would rotate in two directions simultaneously, giving it some protection when the basic shields go down and preventing people crashing into the buildings on the surface.

My biggest worry is that radial gravity fields from the reactor chamber still wont work very well. Assuming i smoothed over the surface of the planet with slabs and wedges, how awkward would it be to walk around on the surface? Are there any outstanding bugs i need to worry about, like transitions between gravity fields causing players to get stuck or anything? Additionally, how is gravity on docked entities working with it now? Used to be pretty iffy whether hoving over an entity that was docked to a planet would apply gravity to you, and then it was equally confusing how far from the docked entity + planet youd have to get to escape again. So docking "elevator" ships to a planet to transport you into orbit was glitchy as shit and dangerous, because sometimes, but not all the time, a ship docked to the top of that elevator would be subject to gravity and fall to the ground and glitch out after undocking, or pilots flying over it would suddenly crash into the docked ship because it applied gravity to them. Is there a safe way to do it now, though?

Ive concluded that i would want the shield bubble to originate from the center of the sphere, which means id have to connect at least two equal size groups on opposite sides. But it also has to be big enough to encompass both the planet and the rotating crystal armor shield. The reactor and its chambers would have to share opposing sides (or could the reactor be a ring around the center like the bubble? It has to be big enough to provide a lot of power regardless) but wheres a good place to put the stabilizers? Ive considered in the shell of the planet, like forming a mantle layer along with shield capacitors, but that wont leave much room for the chambers. I also considered putting them in orbit a couple hundred meters outside the shield, requiring shields of their own, and then using those "satellites" to dock defense turrets and 4 usd docking arms for player ships. I figured with the stabilizers inside the mantle of the planet i could dock satellites anyway. But, that would expand the field of gravity directly, right, and then shit would crash into the planetary shield all the time, which is bad.

The defense turrets, then, would be on the satellites, and players can dock on then and from there teleport to the planet surface. I could make one orbital supercapitol turret, but it would have trouble with shooting anything that got between it and the planet, probably.

I wanted this to function as either a neutral derelict station or a faction's outpost station. But with gravity fucking shit up, how can it have anything outside the shield sphere? How would a player get inside, through a public access teleporter from their own ship? Satellites could have teleporters on them, but are satellites a good idea with the radial gravity field? Is it worth it to even attempt such a project?

 

[Scypio]

Skylord luke did a project a while ago using rails to have a station looking like current dodecahedron planets. This plus the right chamber and some gravity blocks with trigger aera blocks would do good. To be honest it would be best than a round planet.

 

[EricBlank]

Thats not a bad idea, id have to create 26 roughly identical plates that dock to it on the six cardinal axes plus the diagonals and diagonals in-between. the station itself doesnt need to have a gravity field, only the individual plates, which would remove the concern of the station itself or anything docked to it that doesnt have its own gravity causing spacecraft to deorbit and crash. Id have to use area triggered gravity per plate, and if players get fed up with it, disable the logic on that and align to the plates manually, which would work fine too, just not be fancy gravity like one would expect from a "planet"

But thats 26+ entities in close contact with one another. Will that cause too much collision detection lag even while theyre docked?

 

[Dr. Whammy]

So the next project i wanted to work on was a spherical artificial planet. But before i really get started, i wanted some advice, maybe some hurtles and solutions other players have had working on a similar project in the past.

The plan was to have a hollow center where additional parts could be docked. The planet itself would probably have to be at least 150m diameter, and around that i was going to dock a crystal armor sphere to act as a shield, which would rotate in two directions simultaneously, giving it some protection when the basic shields go down and preventing people crashing into the buildings on the surface.

My biggest worry is that radial gravity fields from the reactor chamber still wont work very well. Assuming i smoothed over the surface of the planet with slabs and wedges, how awkward would it be to walk around on the surface? Are there any outstanding bugs i need to worry about, like transitions between gravity fields causing players to get stuck or anything? Additionally, how is gravity on docked entities working with it now? Used to be pretty iffy whether hoving over an entity that was docked to a planet would apply gravity to you, and then it was equally confusing how far from the docked entity + planet youd have to get to escape again. So docking "elevator" ships to a planet to transport you into orbit was glitchy as shit and dangerous, because sometimes, but not all the time, a ship docked to the top of that elevator would be subject to gravity and fall to the ground and glitch out after undocking, or pilots flying over it would suddenly crash into the docked ship because it applied gravity to them. Is there a safe way to do it now, though?

Ive concluded that i would want the shield bubble to originate from the center of the sphere, which means id have to connect at least two equal size groups on opposite sides. But it also has to be big enough to encompass both the planet and the rotating crystal armor shield. The reactor and its chambers would have to share opposing sides (or could the reactor be a ring around the center like the bubble? It has to be big enough to provide a lot of power regardless) but wheres a good place to put the stabilizers? Ive considered in the shell of the planet, like forming a mantle layer along with shield capacitors, but that wont leave much room for the chambers. I also considered putting them in orbit a couple hundred meters outside the shield, requiring shields of their own, and then using those "satellites" to dock defense turrets and 4 usd docking arms for player ships. I figured with the stabilizers inside the mantle of the planet i could dock satellites anyway. But, that would expand the field of gravity directly, right, and then shit would crash into the planetary shield all the time, which is bad.

The defense turrets, then, would be on the satellites, and players can dock on then and from there teleport to the planet surface. I could make one orbital supercapitol turret, but it would have trouble with shooting anything that got between it and the planet, probably.

I wanted this to function as either a neutral derelict station or a faction's outpost station. But with gravity fucking shit up, how can it have anything outside the shield sphere? How would a player get inside, through a public access teleporter from their own ship? Satellites could have teleporters on them, but are satellites a good idea with the radial gravity field? Is it worth it to even attempt such a project?

Awesome! I too am making artificial planets.

To expand on radial gravity; it appears to pull you to the part of the structure you are closest to rather than the center of mass. I found myself involuntarily orbiting the inside of a 400 meter wide hollow sphere the other day; scraping the walls as I flew around.

Since these Mass chambers do not work as intended, my next test will be another 6-sided octogonal polyhedron. I plan to use docked entities to supply temporary gravity to each of the six main sides. It's not a perfect solution (build orientation for factories will be off) but it should work.


I'll be watching this thread to see what you come up with. Maybe we can come up with a solution to the problem without waiting on Schine.

 

[DrTarDIS]

ERm, Won't socked-entities negate the whole "gravity chamber" to begin with? Those can't be active on ships, only stations.

 

[Dr. Whammy]

ERm, Won't socked-entities negate the whole "gravity chamber" to begin with? Those can't be active on ships, only stations.

That's correct. Hence why I used the words temporary gravity.

I'll be using the old gravity generator block combined with area triggers placed in gateways at the edges of the docked plates. I may even dock a few diagonal plates to increase habitable space and create a less jarring transition as you walk from on plate to the next. I figure 45 degrees is a lot less disorienting than a complete 90 degree flip.

I'll still leave the mass chamber in place but in the "unspecified" state for when Schine figures it out.

 

[Scypio]

But thats 26+ entities in close contact with one another. Will that cause too much collision detection lag even while theyre docked?

If you use a rail speed controller and put the rail speed to 0 you should be good. Also collision detection should be lighter on the game now.

The hardest part about this project is finding the correct size and angle for every plates. In a few words, the planning.

 

[Dr. Whammy]

For plates, I highly recommend an octagonal polyhedron. You'll get:
- 6 octagons
- 12 squares
- 8 hexagons


All diagonal plates will be set at 45 degree angles.

 

[EricBlank]

Yeah, that was the design i settled on too. Getting them to line up reasonably well and finding the correct size is gonna be the key. I still wanted to make something in the 150-180m diameter range

 

[Scypio]

You can go much further.

Going with a real dodecahedron rather than an octagonal polyhedron would speed up the process. You'll only have one type of plate rather than 3. It's just not as easy as it seems with the angles but it's not that hard. Just a few basic maths.

 

[kiddan]

You can go much further.

Going with a real dodecahedron rather than an octagonal polyhedron would speed up the process. You'll only have one type of plate rather than 3. It's just not as easy as it seems with the angles but it's not that hard. Just a few basic maths.

Plus, we have a line tool now which should help you find common patterns inside your faces. =)

 

[EricBlank]

Well the problem there is aligning the faces at angles other than 45°, since the rail rotators work only at 45° angles. Ill probably stick to the funny octagon thing for now just for ease of docking and rotating plates into position. I had thought to use the different sized plates for different purposes anyways, like placing terrestrial parks and pools on the hexagons and using the squares for special commercial/government buildings and warehouses, with the residential areas on the octagons.

 

[Scypio]

Took some time to search Skylord's planet. Found it : https://starmadedock.net/threads/sk...al-faction-ships-list.3793/page-7#post-306817

If you want to use it for inspiration.

 

[EricBlank]

Thanks for linking to that, i couldnt actually fine it myself!

 

[Dr. Whammy]

My research/findings so far.

1) Luke's planet design can be replicated using turret bases rather than rail rotators. The catch is; if anything bumps a plate, or the game resets your "turrets" you might get a lag spike or misaligned plate. There's also that chunk load issue and the possibility that enemies may literally blow your planet to pieces.

2) The Octagon's 26 faces are technically more complex but can easily be mirrored. This is a good design to use if you want uninterrupted roads. The fact that it's mostly one piece will likely reduce lag and you don't have to worry about wayward plates flying all over the place after an attack.

3) After tearing my hair out trying to decide, I eventually opted for what seems to be the most challenging option; the sphere... Here's what I came up with.

Spoiler

At over 400 meters in diameter, this thing has a massive reactor and insane shielding with room for more. It will undoubtedly be an industrial juggernaut, as well as a royal pain to destroy. I'm looking at YOU Grand Moff Tarkin!!!

I scrapped the idea of using plates and used regular gravity blocks on the 6 "sides" with area triggers so that you go weightless when you leave one of the main cities. The north city will house my command center, a hospital, factories and a shop. I'll copy-paste my templates onto the remaining habitable (non-ocean) sides to make more functional cities but I can also leave one or more of the sides empty so that a friend/faction-mate can build their own command post on my planet; similar to the faction info booths mounted to the neutral station on LvD.

The diagonal 'cities' are mostly decoration but each one will house a diagonally mounted "micro plate" with area-triggered gravity. This will allow you to walk the entire circumference of the planet, via road while on foot. ...or at least until you reach a coast line.

 

[Kraengis]

My research/findings so far.

1) Luke's planet design can be replicated using turret bases rather than rail rotators. The catch is; if anything bumps a plate, or the game resets your "turrets" you might get a lag spike or misaligned plate. There's also that chunk load issue and the possibility that enemies may literally blow your planet to pieces/

2) The Octagon's 26 faces are technically more complex but can easily be mirrored. This is a good design to use if you want uninterrupted roads. The fact that it's mostly one piece will likely reduce lag and you don't have to worry about wayward plates flying all over the place after an attack.

3) After tearing my hair out trying to decide, I eventually opted for what seems to be the most challenging option; the sphere... Here's what I came up with.

Spoiler

At over 400 meters in diameter, this thing has a massive reactor and insane shielding with room for more. It will undoubtedly be an industrial juggernaut, as well as a royal pain to destroy. I'm looking at YOU Grand Moff Tarkin!!!

I scrapped the idea of using plates and used regular gravity blocks on the 6 "sides" with area triggers so that you go weightless when you leave one of the main cities. The north city will house my command center, a hospital, factories and a shop. I'll copy-paste my templates onto the remaining habitable (non-ocean) sides to make more functional cities but I can also leave one or more of the sides empty so that a friend/faction-mate can build their own command post on my planet; similar to the faction info booths mounted to the neutral station on LvD.

The diagonal 'cities' are mostly decoration but each one will house a diagonally mounted "micro plate" with area-triggered gravity. This will allow you to walk the entire circumference of the planet, via road while on foot. ...or at least until you reach a coast line.
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Looks nice!

But what about cubic planets, did someone ever try to make one? I'd imagine it would be hard to make it look right but at least there would be no problems with gravity.

Spoiler: cubes

 

[Dr. Whammy]

Looks nice!

But what about cubic planets, did someone ever try to make one? I'd imagine it would be hard to make it look right but at least there would be no problems with gravity.

Spoiler: cubes

Thanks,

My planetoid essentially is the same concept as a cube (6 sides) but with some aesthetic filler material in between the "sides".

While those cube planets look absolutely epic, it has been thoroughly documented that excessive cubism, while efficient, can cause severe emotional distress in certain individuals...

Spoiler

Spoiler

 

[EricBlank]

That sphere looks amazing honestly. I cant imagine a finished product of mine looking that good.

I dont have pics but i made a spherical core and stuffed shielding and reactors in rings around the center of it, and the shield turned out big enough to cover the entire planet + plates + atmospheric shield and have 400k recharge leftover.

The atmospheric shield i already set up a rotating base for, linked to randomizers on half second logic clocks, the sphere itself just needs to be built.

The octagon plates probably should be part of the station itself then? I had thought about using docked plates on every face, with the rails turned off.

My grand plan was to have water canals between all the plates as a buffer with bridges over them. I thought it would look neat :v

 

[Dr. Whammy]

That sphere looks amazing honestly. I cant imagine a finished product of mine looking that good.

I dont have pics but i made a spherical core and stuffed shielding and reactors in rings around the center of it, and the shield turned out big enough to cover the entire planet + plates + atmospheric shield and have 400k recharge leftover.

The atmospheric shield i already set up a rotating base for, linked to randomizers on half second logic clocks, the sphere itself just needs to be built.

The octagon plates probably should be part of the station itself then? I had thought about using docked plates on every face, with the rails turned off.

My grand plan was to have water canals between all the plates as a buffer with bridges over them. I thought it would look neat :v

For the main system, I find that the most efficient way of building the power/shield combo is to...

- Build your reactor core as the center of the planet. This phase will determine the overall size that the planet needs to be in order to support your reactor.

- Build stabilizers on all 6 axes to get the most efficiency-to-size ratio. I recommend a safety buffer (extra stabilizers) but it's not entirely necessary.

- Build your shield recharger around your reactor. This will allow you to take full advantage of its spherical radius. Keep an eye on your shield recharge/capacity numbers. My reactor is shaped like a "jack" with a large spherical shield recharger wrapped around it. Overlapping cubes or a spherical reactor surrounded by a spherical shield recharger will work as well. Shield capacitors can be put virtually anywhere.

- Be sure to pay attention to your integrity values. Take advantage of the size of this structure to maximize integrity in case you take system damage.

With roughly 122,000 reactor blocks and a 6 axis stabilizer radius of roughly 380 meters, my reactor generates over 12 million power/sec. That's with full stability and a 60% safety buffer. This system can power a shield with a 717 meter radius, a 70+ million capacity and over 8 Million regeneration per second. ...and still have 65% reactor capacity remaining for... um... "research satellites".


Regarding "looks"; don't sell yourself short. You can do this.

When you start to add your planet's external surface details and aesthetics, focus on the top plate for your main city/base and make templates of literally everything; as it saves time (and sanity) later. Use your templates on any other side/plate you wish to 'inhabit'. If your planet is all one piece like mine, building will be awkward at first since you can't rotate the view but the templates and load\copy\paste functions will help out a ton. Make friends with the 'remove/replace' function in advance build mode; as it is a good way to quickly convert "oceans" to "forests", "deserts" or low density "urban" terrain.

I hope this helps.

Edit: The canal idea can work also. It will create a valid reason to reorient to the new gravity of the next plate.


[doublepost=1536001289,1536001079][/doublepost]Octagon plates can go either way. But separate plates will allow for easier build orientation and gravity management.

 

[EricBlank]

Yeah i kinda just made donut shaped reactors and rechargers counter-rotating around the core. I needed the core hollow for the atmosheric shield to dock to.

Ive made a couple template sets for hallways already, just not exterior buildings. Thats gonna be fun.