Hyperdrive v jump drive

[alterintel]

From a strictly scifi physics standpoint a jump should be harder to accomplish than a warp or hyper drive.
Since hyper drive / warp only requires that space be warped or rippled, it would require less power.
however since a jump requires a complete folding of space, it should require more power and should be harder to do.

So in my thinking the whole warp/jump idea is reversed. Warp should be for regular ships, while only capitol or titan ships should be capable of jumping.
with more jump blocks you could get more range, while with more warp blocks you could get faster speeds.
(So in a merging of scifi genres , once you reach warp 10 you've basically created a jump drive.)

While I don't think my opinion here is going to change any minds, I just thought that I'd put that out there, to see what everybody else thought.

 

[Rixxan]

Star Trek uses warp drive, which folds the space around you very similar to jump drive now, but limitless range and it's faster but not that fast. Jump Drive, as seen in BSG, jumps you by warping the space until the point you wish to occupy and the point you occupy are the same, and then re-expands that space so that you are now at point B. this makes it nearly instantaneous, maybe a five second process, and you're anywhere within the 'red line', past wich the warp in space could and most likely will send you off course or destroyed because the FTL system or 'compressor' can't compress that much space. Think of it like a piece of paper. thrusters get you from point a-b slowly, going all the way across the surface of the paper. Hyperdrive (star Wars) speeds up that process, but you are still have to go from a-b over the surface area, so hyperdrive takes a long time, such as the transit time from tattoine to alderaan or what's left of it. Jump Drive folds the paper in half, poking a hole through the paper to go from point a-b through the paper, but the bigger the paper, or distance you need to travel, the more work goes into it and a greater margin of error. Once you poke through with bsg, you put a piece of tape over the hole in the paper on both sides, and unfold the paper with you on the side you want. Stargate uses a similar system, except it's permanent conduit, requiring a previously existing portal on the other side to use the land-based stargates, much the same to starmade's warp gates.

 

[Reilly Reese]

By Stargate we are referring to their hyperdrive system which is similar to Starwars hyperdrives

 

[Rixxan]

By Stargate we are referring to their hyperdrive system which is similar to Starwars hyperdrives

Ah, well I don't watch the show so I was assuming the stationary (ish) circle-things. But what I said for star wars still applies to the stargate ones then. It's faster but not as fast as jump drives for long distance.

 

[Gareth_lol]

Yep the best sc-fi battle evar!

It is pretty good

 

[Rixxan]

Also: to poke holes through and heal the fabric of space (our "Paper"), you require more power over a shorter time than by being able to still generate power through the trip in hyperdrive, so it's all a matter of all the power now or long power over time. Small ships couldn't handle the power of a jump drive and so would have hyperdrive, but capital ships can afford the power loss and jump places.

 

[Gareth_lol]

Ah, well I don't watch the show so I was assuming the stationary (ish) circle-things. But what I said for star wars still applies to the stargate ones then. It's faster but not as fast as jump drives for long distance.

I think that is the problem with the current Jump drives, pretty much instant travel defined only by the server set max jump distance, I think a good compromise could be a hard cap on max jump drive distance so they can still be used for small jumps and have a hyperdrive for anything else.

 

[Reilly Reese]

By default they travel 8 sectors.

 

[Gareth_lol]

Also: to poke holes through and heal the fabric of space (our "Paper"), you require more power over a shorter time than by being able to still generate power through the trip in hyperdrive, so it's all a matter of all the power now or long power over time. Small ships couldn't handle the power of a jump drive and so would have hyperdrive, but capital ships can afford the power loss and jump places.

Close, but from what I understand hyperspace would use less power than jump drive as it opens up a window to another space time dimension where light speed and relativity don't apply, thus allowing faster than light travel without the relativistic problems.
A jump drive would be folding our space time so the jump point and the arrival point become one allowing for the instant travel.

 

[Rixxan]

I think that is the problem with the current Jump drives, pretty much instant travel defined only by the server set max jump distance, I think a good compromise could be a hard cap on max jump drive distance so they can still be used for small jumps and have a hyperdrive for anything else.

I kinda see your point, but I think in reverse. I think that the distance you can jump and recharge time should be determined by the size of your jump drive. Hyperspace for faster transit from point a-b when you don't have the power/need for jump and if fuel ever gets added then fuel costs come in, plus you can explore more in hyperspace. But if you want, you should be able to pack a ship full of jump drives and power and jump long distances and go really far, but then the server hard cap (admin defined) sets the 'red line' of how far you can jump.

Close, but from what I understand hyperspace would use less power than jump drive as it opens up a window to another space time dimension where light speed and relativity don't apply, thus allowing faster than light travel without the relativistic problems.
A jump drive would be folding our space time so the jump point and the arrival point become one allowing for the instant travel.

Starmade has made it a point not to have loading screens. The best we could do was make it similar to the effect of today's jump drive, making you mainly invincible to sublight enemies. but maybe make it so you could be followed and attacked (Star Trek Into Darkness Jar Jar Abrams warp fight much) But YES, it does make sense that hyperdrive would cost less power for less speed.

 

[Gareth_lol]

I kinda see your point, but I think in reverse. I think that the distance you can jump and recharge time should be determined by the size of your jump drive. Hyperspace for faster transit from point a-b when you don't have the power/need for jump and if fuel ever gets added then fuel costs come in, plus you can explore more in hyperspace. But if you want, you should be able to pack a ship full of jump drives and power and jump long distances and go really far, but then the server hard cap (admin defined) sets the 'red line' of how far you can jump.

Starmade has made it a point not to have loading screens. The best we could do was make it similar to the effect of today's jump drive, making you mainly invincible to sublight enemies. but maybe make it so you could be followed and attacked (Star Trek Into Darkness Jar Jar Abrams warp fight much) But YES, it does make sense that hyperdrive would cost less power for less speed.

I think if jump drives are to remain they could be re designed using the current dev Hyperspace ideas (Capital ship system that sets the ships sub light speed to 0) so that large capitals can jump from point to point where as all other ships need to use Hyperspace, think of it this way, getting out and walking around your ship as you jump to the other side of the galaxy, watching your image move across the map, Going afk to get another beer :P I think it would be amazing.

I'm not a fan of combat in hyperspace, it should be strictly for travel IMO, as for the power cost v speed argument, I think a jump where only one jump is needed a jump drive would obv be faster (say the 8 sector default) but over longer distances where you would (with a jump drive have to drop out and recharge) a single trip through hyperspace would be a little faster.

 

[Rixxan]

I think if jump drives are to remain they could be re designed using the current dev Hyperspace ideas (Capital ship system that sets the ships sub light speed to 0) so that large capitals can jump from point to point where as all other ships need to use Hyperspace, think of it this way, getting out and walking around your ship as you jump to the other side of the galaxy, watching your image move across the map, Going afk to get another beer :p I think it would be amazing.

I'm not a fan of combat in hyperspace, it should be strictly for travel IMO, as for the power cost v speed argument, I think a jump where only one jump is needed a jump drive would obv be faster (say the 8 sector default) but over longer distances where you would (with a jump drive have to drop out and recharge) a single trip through hyperspace would be a little faster.

Grape Juice for me, underage here.

But I digress.
I disagree with jump drives disabling sublight, you see ships like the Galactica who still move around, making them floating space stations that don't allow movement is, IMO, a really bad idea. You never see a ship that just moves from point to point via jump drives and can't move out of the way of a suicide mission or WMD, or enter orbit. No combat in hyperspace is fine, but you have to be moving. if you aren't moving you shouldn't be in hyperspace, no hiders here!
Yes, there should be a max distance jump drives can do, but I think there should be a server hard cap and a ship percent cap. In BSG, the raptors have really tiny jump drives, which force them to use 28-29 jumps each way from Galactica to Caprica and back again where a cylon basestar, huge ass thing that it is, with strong FTL drives, only requires two jumps each way. The more of a ship you have your jump drive be the more powerful it should be and the longer it should go.

 

[TomW1605]

Star Trek uses warp drive, which folds the space around you very similar to jump drive now

star trek warp is nothing like the curent jump drive system.

This is what I think of with Hyperspace, for anyone who needs a visual idea

this is almost identical to warp

 

[Gareth_lol]

Grape Juice for me, underage here.

But I digress.
I disagree with jump drives disabling sublight, you see ships like the Galactica who still move around, making them floating space stations that don't allow movement is, IMO, a really bad idea. You never see a ship that just moves from point to point via jump drives and can't move out of the way of a suicide mission or WMD, or enter orbit. No combat in hyperspace is fine, but you have to be moving. if you aren't moving you shouldn't be in hyperspace, no hiders here!
Yes, there should be a max distance jump drives can do, but I think there should be a server hard cap and a ship percent cap. In BSG, the raptors have really tiny jump drives, which force them to use 28-29 jumps each way from Galactica to Caprica and back again where a cylon basestar, huge ass thing that it is, with strong FTL drives, only requires two jumps each way. The more of a ship you have your jump drive be the more powerful it should be and the longer it should go.

Oh, you boor bugger with the grape juice lol.
I agree that sublight should not be disabled but that is the current thought for Hyperspace by the devs of this game and I would rather see that on jump rather than hyperspace, I am not opposed to the ship % cap for drives, that makes sense I am just still not a fan of the instant wormhole type FTL system.

this is almost identical to warp

In looks maybe, in the way they work, not even close, Warp does exactly what it sounds like it would, it warps our space time in a bubble around the ship allowing for what seems like faster than light travel, where as hyperspace opens a window to another dimension of space time allowing the ship to move outside of our known 4 dimensional universe (Its a mind f**k but its there :P).

The theoretical speeds of warp are much slower to that of hyperspace, Warp 10 would still be slower than even an "entry level" hyperdrive.

 

[TomW1605]

ok but the first part about not being like jump drive is correct, right? and warp 10 could go literally anywhere instantly (i agree this is like jump drive) but how is that not as fast as hyperspace?

 

[Gareth_lol]

ok but the first part about not being like jump drive is correct, right? and warp 10 could go literally anywhere instantly (i agree this is like jump drive) but how is that not as fast as hyperspace?

Ugh... I forgot that voyager copped out the lovely "warp 10 is infinite speed" doozy.
Looking at warp 9.75 as reference then it is said to take 5 days to travel 40 LY where as the worst hyperspace known (at least in stargate) can travel at 0.001 LY per second.

 

[Crimson-Artist]

in terms of the future features, hyperdrive is already planned however it will be used for intergalactic travel(long range) where the current jump drives are for inter-sector/inter-stellar travel(short range)

Interesting idea though.

 

[Blaza612]

Personally, I would prefer something more similar to EVE's warp drive, as it's closer to how IRL warp drives are going to be (fucking with space-time to move space at ludicrous speeds, thus the ship) and would also solve a couple more problems Starmade has. Refer to this suggestion: Change warp system and Interdictors for a more complete collection of ideas and how it helps the game the best.

 

[Gareth_lol]

in terms of the future features, hyperdrive is already planned however it will be used for intergalactic travel(long range) where the current jump drives are for inter-sector/inter-stellar travel(short range)

Interesting idea though.

Where did you read that current plan for the hyperdrives? from what I read they are going to be making it a capital ship system that once installed provides the ship with a debuff reducing its sub light speed to 0% in essence making it a floating brick capable of using hyperspace as its only means of travel.
My Idea on those lines would be to make Jump drives the system to lower the ships sub light speed to 0% and then jump instantly from sector to sector and have the smaller ships fitted with Hyper drives to travel through subspace and take time to reach their destination.

Personally, I would prefer something more similar to EVE's warp drive, as it's closer to how IRL warp drives are going to be (fucking with space-time to move space at ludicrous speeds, thus the ship) and would also solve a couple more problems Starmade has. Refer to this suggestion: Change warp system and Interdictors for a more complete collection of ideas and how it helps the game the best.

Those are not bad ideas, I personally would rather a hyperdrive than a warp drive but that's just me :P The charge up time for me is something that is not really something that my sci fi bread and butter (Stargate) really went into, in the way I would like it the Drive can be turned on whenever you have the power to do so but once you drop out the drive needs to "Cool down" before you can use it again.

 

[bormos3]