Recognized Turrets system with Pictures - [ Poll]

[WaffulMann]

Maybe the size of your hinge determines how far it can rotate? I'd rather not have aesthetics limit a turret's field of fire. BTW, one hinge block should be enough for a small turret to rotate all the way up, while the Charon's main turret or anything of that scale would require a lot.

I think I need numbers. Say you put 10 hinge blocks on your gun turret. How does it rotate differently than, say, a 1 block rotation?

Plus, some small turrets with small guns still need to rotate a lot since they are mainly used for flak and aa

 

[ltmauve]

I think I need numbers. Say you put 10 hinge blocks on your gun turret. How does it rotate differently than, say, a 1 block rotation?

Plus, some small turrets with small guns still need to rotate a lot since they are mainly used for flak and aa

Okay, numbers: the max tilt and turning speed of the turret will increase, approaching 90 max tilt and a turn limit based on the size of the turret. One block should be enough for small turrets; anything under ~20m probably should get most of the tilt and decent turning with 1-3 blocks, but larger turrets will require wayyyyy more hinge.

 

[Coke McCain]

But then how are you going to calculate the angle limit in which the gun can elevate?

You could just lock the max elevation for the gun at 90 degrees since anything more than that is technically redundant. I personally don't like the idea and think clipping should be avoided unless it's absolutely necessary for a number of reasons.

 

[starhaiden]

I don't think you would need to have guns on turrets when you can dock turrets to turrets and you can change the size docking area and make it rectangular.

 

[WaffulMann]

I don't think you would need to have guns on turrets when you can dock turrets to turrets and you can change the size docking area and make it rectangular.

Yes, yes, come back to me when you have a working battleship turret using current mechanics

You could just lock the max elevation for the gun at 90 degrees since anything more than that is technically redundant. I personally don't like the idea and think clipping should be avoided unless it's absolutely necessary for a number of reasons.

Yes, it is redundant but it allows more flexibility. Or is it actually a bad idea I need the community's thoughts.

Plus, I also need the thoughts of a dev to see if this is even possible with how the game currenntly works.

 

[Coke McCain]

Yes, it is redundant but it allows more flexibility.

It's redundant but I don't really think that's a problem. The only upside I see to limiting gun elevation is that it could be a potential balancing factor.

 

[Izikiel]

I've always wanted this implemented. Would make my turrets all look much better, and be much more efficient.

As to your problem of redundancy, I think that it would be better to allow the base connector block to clip, but not the actual gun/turret part. However, that would be much harder to implement. Maybe a kind of ghost block, like the area triggers?

 

[Lenier]

I say no limit. free movement until collision, but I see no reason to allow any clipping. Consider:

 

[WaffulMann]

I say no limit. free movement until collision, but I see no reason to allow any clipping. Consider:
View attachment 4050

Yes, this is brilliant :D

 

[ltmauve]

Except there are designs that won't work as well with a system that doesn't allow clipping, and that means that all turrets have to look the same. We currently have a huge variety of ship and turret shapes, and it would suck if all the turrets had to be redone.

 

[WaffulMann]

Except there are designs that won't work as well with a system that doesn't allow clipping, and that means that all turrets have to look the same. We currently have a huge variety of ship and turret shapes, and it would suck if all the turrets had to be redone.

I'll put it frankly; the current system is bad. This game is still in alpha, features are bound to change. If one is afraid to redo one's ships then perhaps they should not play an alpha game. I hope I'm not offending anybody except the current turret system.
Could you please give me an example of the current system that isn't feasible in my suggestion? I would like to improve it.

 

[ltmauve]

I'm not arguing against it under the grounds of "stuff we make in alpha should always work," but "a mechanic should not limit aesthetics to only one or two options." Look at crimson-artist's turrets. There's no way you get a full range of rotation with clipping. If a system that prevents clipping is added, only a few turret designs will be viable, which will outright suck.

 

[WaffulMann]

I'm not arguing against it under the grounds of "stuff we make in alpha should always work," but "a mechanic should not limit aesthetics to only one or two options." Look at crimson-artist's turrets. There's no way you get a full range of rotation with clipping. If a system that prevents clipping is added, only a few turret designs will be viable, which will outright suck.

Take http://starmadedock.net/content/enforcer-autocannon.1230/ for example.
All he needs to do is raise the docking unit by one block and turn the little wedges near the base into the actual base, then profit.
Then http://starmadedock.net/content/tc-gluttony-turret.1156/
This is an even easier conversion. sides= base, center= gun.
Finally http://starmadedock.net/content/tc-envy-turret.1155/
Here the middle part can be the base, and the two sides the gun(s).
Note that these are crimson's turrets.


There is nothing saying that the connector needs to be at the center of the turret, nor that it can only be attached to the end of a gun. Out of the top of my head I can think of at least 5 to 10 different configs. Just use imagination.

Also, here's to hoping at at least a certain Calbiri can give a yes/no to this.

 

[marcus87]

So much yes to this suggestion, I am in violent agreement with this idea. And since this is suggestion thread for turrets may I again ask for a new kind of turret? Think of phaser banks from Star Trek or the spasms torpedo launchers from covenant halo.

Basically a turret which does not turn but has a area that can be reached from said weapons. All it would need are regular weapons and a turret AI that fires when something comes into its area of effect.

Also you might want to limit the amount of stuff which you can conseal under the hull of the ship. It would be bead if small turrets have to much shields. They would be to hard of a target for small craft. Maybe make the shaft of the turret wider if it is deep. Say my turret base reaches 5 blocks deep, it then has to have a diameter of 10 blocks to give an area to attack.

 

[ltmauve]

I do not see how adding clipping makes the game better. All I see it that it will limit aesthetic choices, and also add more performance costs, since the game will have to check interactions between each and every turret while moving. It isn't worth it.
This. The top part is clearly supposed to be the barrel, but there's no way to get it to properly tilt and still look good without clipping.

 

[NeonSturm]

I do not see how adding clipping makes the game better. All I see it that it will limit aesthetic choices, and also add more performance costs, since the game will have to check interactions between each and every turret while moving. It isn't worth it.

Somewhat true, but you can also calculate the minimum pitch for each angle around yaw once you leave build mode (this can also be used to prevent firing at your ship) after a test-run in all directions.

Clipping is ugly, but once turrets can be divided into pitch and yaw parts, players will avoid that automatically.

 

[Lenier]

I see no real limiting factor here. Pretty much all of these designs, with some creativity, can be done without clipping.

 

[Lecic]

Also you might want to limit the amount of stuff which you can conseal under the hull of the ship. It would be bead if small turrets have to much shields. They would be to hard of a target for small craft. Maybe make the shaft of the turret wider if it is deep. Say my turret base reaches 5 blocks deep, it then has to have a diameter of 10 blocks to give an area to attack.

But if you put more shields on the turret inside the main ship, you lose space in the main ship for its own shields, which will make it easier to kill. It's a trade off.

 

[WaffulMann]

Thank you.
I totally agree with Lecic, you are sacrificing internal ship systems for turret systems. In my case the turret's "base" as in the part under the hull can be nonexistent, The turret be placed just like turrets today, right there on the hull. That of course means that it's not as well protected, but then your ship is better protected.
Remember everything here is just a small portion of what you can do if this system is implemented, a lot more stuff can be done with this too.
Also, is any dev considering this? Would just like to know.

 

[ltmauve]

I do feel that completely disallowing clipping means turrets have to proporitonalty larger than before to get the same number of blocks (simply due to how the geometry of a circle versus a square. Anyway, what does not allowing clipping give to the game?