The ultimate drone R&D thread

[Gerion]

Could we get this thread pinned? It is awesome.

We are rapidly passing everything else in posts and views, so I guess we should pertition for it.

So mods. We have around 100000 drones right here. You want to pin this thread, right? Because if not, who knows what might happen when I accidently press this shiny red button labeled "kill all the fleshbags, minions".

Seriously now, drones are coming to the point where I am completely out of answers. The best way to go for it now (that i can see) is to fix the swarm missiles and then have one swarm turret for every 2-3 drones you encounter in addition to swarm missiles mounted on your ship. Everything else has failed. Either too inaccurate, easily overwhelmed or completly overgunning the drones (using a titans turrets for it).

 

[Keptick]

Anti-drone drones. Most drones are meant to kill ships and use missiles. A couple drone equipped with anti-missile turrets could make short work of an entire swarm :p . It's all about specialization!

Now we'll see anti-anti-drone drones XD[DOUBLEPOST=1414526420,1414526361][/DOUBLEPOST]Or you could just do this:

 

[Loadout]

I think I got sleeper racks to work. Basically, they are "drone mines" you bring to a destination (for example spots around your station). These drone mines are basically drone racks, but the main difference is that they have a mesh like structure (a hollow cube with holes) made of activation blocks. The mesh cube is 9x9x9 and contains a docked 5x5x5 "nanodrone" that just has a bobby ai, a pulse computer, a thruster and a power block (and faction computer). When the drone mine is deployed at the target location, you activate fixed docking AI in the drone mine via the structure tab, then you leave the core and press a button that undocks the nanodrone. When anything hostile is close, the nanodrone will pursue it and pass the activation block mesh, which will trigger logic to undock all drones on the sleeper rack and detonate disintegrators that will destroy the rack (the same disintegrators also make sure everything undocks when the rack takes even the slightest bit of damage).

Advantages over just deploying a ton of drones manually:
- You get the transportation carrier built-in with every mine
- It only shows as 1 hostile target in navigation instead of like 16-32
- It only counts as one floating entity while inactive in case your server of choice doesn't like too many for them.
- It spawns red diamonds in your enemy's face (rule of cool).

@Loadout ye but trust me the 410k are worth it My old drone already was able to wreck larger ships pretty ok, and the boom per buck has increased over the old drone :D
BTW, missile/cannon on drones = awesome vs AI and larger targets in general
combine it with missile/beam and the drone will also be able to harm players in small fighters as well as do even more damage to anything.

Wants... whenever I finish my light carrier i'll be building one of those. As well as adding a heavier version of my flea design. Which will probably be named The Roach.

This looks awesome and does help in certain situations... but I get the feeling deploying these all over would be cost prohibitive. I mean there are 8x8x8 sectors in each "system" right? That's something like 512 quadrants you'd need to deploy one in. I think it'd be better to save them for critical defenses of say, the home or System_Wide -base station? Where you could easily use several racks to defend the critical area from invaders.

As an afterthought that could also free up your primary ships to roam about freely, given you no longer have to worry about defense of the main base area.

 

[Keptick]

See that red circle in front? That may or may not be a skoomdrone launch tube.

 

[Loadout]

See that red circle in front? That may or may not be a skoomdrone launch tube.

I see your skoomdrone launch tube and raise you and anti-missile-drone... drone.

 

[Thalanor]

I tried that, but I failed when I couldn't find any way to activate the AI on the turrets without getting into the drone core or to the drone bobby module. The structure tab doesn't work with chain-docked stuff If science has come up with something I do wish to hear :D

I also need a micro drone now. Critter, basically. A little larger than 7x7xX though as the cost of all the weapon computers/AI/faction module begin to matter at these sizes, I think.

 

[Loadout]

I tried that, but I failed when I couldn't find any way to activate the AI on the turrets without getting into the drone core or to the drone bobby module. The structure tab doesn't work with chain-docked stuff

I actually use the whole thing as a turret on my ship and then just undock whenever I need more mobile support. It's a throwaway turret with thrusters basically. Generally speaking the AI would be active long before ever releasing it into the wild so it's not a big deal.

 

[sagethe13th]

Anti-drone drones. Most drones are meant to kill ships and use missiles. A couple drone equipped with anti-missile turrets could make short work of an entire swarm :p . It's all about specialization!

Now we'll see anti-anti-drone drones XD[DOUBLEPOST=1414526420,1414526361][/DOUBLEPOST]Or you could just do this:

Awesome image. Makes feel all warm and fuzzy.

I've been playing around with trying to make anti-missile drones to try and beat my missile based drones. The problem with drones armed with point defense turrets seems to be that the AI likes to fly in close reducing the effectiveness of their own point defenses. This resulted in them mostly just getting there asses kicked. After that I basically just went for all firepower flak drones. The idea being that they would wipe out the missiles just by filling space will bullets in their attempts to destroy the opposing drones. This resulted in them winning only half of time though. It was sort of a toss up where they either took hits from the sides and were wiped out or all the missiles ended up coming from about the same direction allowing the flak drone to take out the missiles and the drones that launched them in short order.

I'm still trying to figure out how to make a frigate or destroyer that can fight off a drone swarm.

 

[Loadout]

Awesome image. Makes feel all warm and fuzzy.

I've been playing around with trying to make anti-missile drones to try and beat my missile based drones. The problem with drones armed with point defense turrets seems to be that the AI likes to fly in close reducing the effectiveness of their own point defenses. This resulted in them mostly just getting there asses kicked. After that I basically just went for all firepower flak drones. The idea being that they would wipe out the missiles just by filling space will bullets in their attempts to destroy the opposing drones. This resulted in them winning only half of time though. It was sort of a toss up where they either took hits from the sides and were wiped out or all the missiles ended up coming from about the same direction allowing the flak drone to take out the missiles and the drones that launched them in short order.

I'm still trying to figure out how to make a frigate or destroyer that can fight off a drone swarm.

Try Perma-Jamming your ship. AI will ignore anything Jammed and so far is my trick to beating drone swarms. A small frigate with a few powerhouse weapons and a perma-jam should take care of most drone swarms. Mind you this won't work with AI because as soon as one exits the jammer is disabled. I also cannot find any evidence of logic blocks turning on jammers. *sniffle* so long anti-drone-drones with perma jammers...

 

[sagethe13th]

Try Perma-Jamming your ship. AI will ignore anything Jammed and so far is my trick to beating drone swarms. A small frigate with a few powerhouse weapons and a perma-jam should take care of most drone swarms. Mind you this won't work with AI because as soon as one exits the jammer is disabled. I also cannot find any evidence of logic blocks turning on jammers. *sniffle* so long anti-drone-drones with perma jammers...

Fair Point. I tend to forget about cloaking and jamming. I had a corvette that could beat a drone swarm. But this consisted of a lot of running away and thinning out the swarm with lock-on missile at long distance before closing in and finishing the job with heat seekers once I lowered their DPS enough.

I guess the problem I'm trying to address isn't so much soloing a drone swarm as much as trying to figure out how to protect other ships from drones as part of a fleet action. Hence why I was looking into point defense drones as well.

 

[Loadout]

Fair Point. I tend to forget about cloaking and jamming. I had a corvette that could beat a drone swarm. But this consisted of a lot of running away and thinning out the swarm with lock-on missile at long distance before closing in and finishing the job with heat seekers once I lowered their DPS enough.

I guess the problem I'm trying to address isn't so much soloing a drone swarm as much as trying to figure out how to protect other ships from drones as part of a fleet action. Hence why I was looking into point defense drones as well.

I totally agree, since Jamming only works on the player ship and countering drones with drones is somewhat redundant the best way to deal is somewhat undecided.

Coordination between players is great, although requires multiple player ships, in which case everyone should just jam and be done with it for now. Weapon wise doesn't even matter when everyone is invisible to the drones to begin with.

Anti-Drones require a serious amount of firepower to be able to deny large clusters of missiles. This makes them less cost effective than their missile armed brethren. Since the name of the game is firepower at a cheap price, this somewhat breaks the rule of drones.

Hypothetically if your anti-drones had shield drainers + a pierce weapon they could remove the only protection most drones have and kill them rapidly. I have yet to test this theory but it's in the works.

Flak has the potential to shutdown missiles but only works haphazardly and isn't as fleet friendly as one would like.

This leaves only a few small options left;

1. Simply ignore the drones and let your own deal with them, while you are jammed and targeting the carrier ship. Tell your fleet AI's to focus fire on your selected target and make sure you mark that carrier.
2. Jam/Cloak and go straight for the carrier. Destroy the racks before they launch and it's game-over.
3. Forget jamming and bring LOTS of DAKKA. More Dakka is Good Dakka.
4. Swarm vs missile swarm and pray they don't derp out against your own fleet.
5. Crash the server and laugh while the poor admins sort it out.
6. Use space-mines to either push away drones or ion their shields so they're all one hitter quitters.

I can't honestly think of anything besides those 6 ways to deal with drones in a fleet action.

 

[ltmauve]

I'm not sure if ships that undock from a factioned ship maintain their faction. If they do, you can use lots and lots of cores to distract the drones, while your own drones ignore them.

 

[Gerion]

The corvette is finished, costing a grand total of 20 million to deploy. Its totally unusable in fleet action, as it uses 3 separate swarm missile systems (2 dual-barreled ones on the sides and one front mounted) to deal with drones. When I tested those, i lost my station. Shouldnt have skimped on defenses I guess.
It has a total of 700k shields, a reload of 3k (?). Not perfect, but it can take a moderatly sized swarm by itself without sustaining lasting damage.
Secondary armament are a pulsecannon and a rapid-fire cannon (w/punch-through). Its enough to hit a smaller ship rather hard and the rapid cannon can be used to some extend against drones as well as to shoot down missiles.
Acceleration and turning is good, cant complain.
The thing looks absolutely hidious. I am not a great builder. It has a decent shape when you look at it from below though.
Power is stable. If you fire every weapon, you run into problems, but its not necessary to do so most of the time. Either pulsecannon or swarm missiles. Both are not required at the same time.

It took down 60 Isanths in a test without losing 10% of its shields. Against @Thalanor s sirius drones it fared a bit less well. 30 of those hurt a lot, but the corvette emerged victorious.

 

[Loadout]

The corvette is finished, costing a grand total of 20 million to deploy. Its totally unusable in fleet action, as it uses 3 separate swarm missile systems (2 dual-barreled ones on the sides and one front mounted) to deal with drones. When I tested those, i lost my station. Shouldnt have skimped on defenses I guess.
It has a total of 700k shields, a reload of 3k (?). Not perfect, but it can take a moderatly sized swarm by itself without sustaining lasting damage.
Secondary armament are a pulsecannon and a rapid-fire cannon (w/punch-through). Its enough to hit a smaller ship rather hard and the rapid cannon can be used to some extend against drones as well as to shoot down missiles.
Acceleration and turning is good, cant complain.
The thing looks absolutely hidious. I am not a great builder. It has a decent shape when you look at it from below though.
Power is stable. If you fire every weapon, you run into problems, but its not necessary to do so most of the time. Either pulsecannon or swarm missiles. Both are not required at the same time.

It took down 60 Isanths in a test without losing 10% of its shields. Against @Thalanor s sirius drones it fared a bit less well. 30 of those hurt a lot, but the corvette emerged victorious.

To be fair most people I've met are not fabulous builders. Those that I have been lucky to speak with generally agree that either you design systems then make it pretty, or you make it pretty first and then stuff it with whatever you need. Don't feel bad if it's not gorgeous, you can always add stuff to the outside to make it look nicer =) long as you've got the systems in there you can change the outside around and fiddle with it over time. Or just build a new ship and fill in the same systems in a different shape, I do that A-LOT.

Good to hear that it survived a modestly sized swarm though. That is an important thing to be able to do. Now I wonder how it'd fair against a carrier or as an AI escort. Perhaps you could test that out and give us some results? Any example of a steady build is a thing we could all use as a launching point for our countermeasures programs. =)

 

[Argyle_Ninja]

I think I'm getting somewhere..

Spoiler: Oh yes..

 

[Gerion]

To be fair most people I've met are not fabulous builders. Those that I have been lucky to speak with generally agree that either you design systems then make it pretty, or you make it pretty first and then stuff it with whatever you need. Don't feel bad if it's not gorgeous, you can always add stuff to the outside to make it look nicer =) long as you've got the systems in there you can change the outside around and fiddle with it over time. Or just build a new ship and fill in the same systems in a different shape, I do that A-LOT.

Good to hear that it survived a modestly sized swarm though. That is an important thing to be able to do. Now I wonder how it'd fair against a carrier or as an AI escort. Perhaps you could test that out and give us some results? Any example of a steady build is a thing we could all use as a launching point for our countermeasures programs. =)

As an AI escort, I cannot recommend the Voidburn. Its swarm missiles will target the ship it escorts, and those can pack quite a punch, especially when you have friendly drones out. Against carriers (as in: The drones are the main weapons) it does quite nicely. You get rid off the drones via the swarm missiles, then use the pulsecannon (which i accidently equipped with an explosive effect instead of the intended ion...) and the rapid fire cannon to destroy the carrier.
And I know i could fiddle around with it later. But I am also bad at that. Right now, its just this amorpheous, vaguely ship-looking black thing spewing missiles.

 

[Thalanor]

Awesome basestar @Argyle_Ninja :D
My take on nanodrones:

Caeli- class microdrone
9x5x11, 30 mass, 35 thrust, 95k credits
4200 power/s, default cap
1200 shields
guided missile at 4.6k damage (3% support, 100% explosive effect)


Because of the huge missile radius compared to the damage, no damage is wasted even when 20 drones all send their missiles after one core - even if the core has already overheated, the incoming missiles will still destroy more and more surrounding blocks (deny salvage).

It is excellent boom-for-money. The guided missile maxes out the utility of the default power cap (minus a tidbit of tolerance margin), and it only costs 95k. Larger drones do not exceed the missile power / cost ratio usually (actually they are worse as they require power capacity increases).

Also it looks more like a fighter than a crate, which makes room for developing fighter, heavy fighter and corvette versions of it.

 

[sagethe13th]

Here is my current best drone design. The Vuldian Death Lotus. In fiction these work like the funnels from the Gundam universe. Separate attack vehicles that add firepower to a primary ship and are linked to the pilot's will.

So here are the stats.

Mass: 26.8
Size: 7x7x7
Power: 50,000 (2957 regen)
Thrust: 26.9 (1:1)
Shields: 885 (11 regen)

It has four missile tubes that hit for 750 base damage a pop. So 3000 damage overall.

I'm noticing that the ineffective nature of point defense systems against these guys is due to the turrets slow turning speed. Once these things get close to a ship and spread out the point defenses become useless.

When I was taking pictures, I accidently spawned them to close to a pirate station and the drones went after it. It didn't end well for the pirates.

 

[Mortiferum]

Wait...

Best defense against drone is simply to have greater shield regent than swarm dps?

And turrets are non issue as drones do NOT attempt to reach Max speed anyway.

So a turret can easily snipe the drones

 

[Thalanor]

Wait...

Best defense against drone is simply to have greater shield regent than swarm dps?

And turrets are non issue as drones do NOT attempt to reach Max speed anyway.

So a turret can easily snipe the drones

The thing is, swarm dps is usually burst dps. Shield regen will not help you at all, only shield capacity will. Turrets never have enough shields (if they still want some firepower at least) to withstand a cost-wise comparable amount of drones burst-firing (applies to missiles mostly).

To withstand a drone attack of 1M cost, you would have to roughly have 50k shields on your turret. Balanced firepower-heavy turrets with 50k shields usually cost far more, and since the turrets are mounted on a larger much slower entity, they cannot profit much from slow drone speed.