Operate Logic from within docked entity

[conductor94]

Hello everybody,

with this Thread i hope to raise some good ideas on the solution of a current problem:

As i try to design a (ready for RP) system for cargo pod storage and transportation i recognized, that its not possible to operate the ship cores activation beam while docked to an other structure.
In detail i dock my tender ship to the storage structure to securely undock the pod from the structure and redock it to the tender. After that the tender undocks from the storage structure and may go where ever the cargo is needed.
To undock the cargo pod from the structure i use a button that simply releases the pod. But i can not activate the button from within the tender entity via its ship cores activation beam.

My only solution would be to link an inner ship remote to an wireless module on the tender that is linked to the button on the storage structure that releases the pod. This comes with the downside, that i would need this setup for every docking bay on the storage structure as well as on ships and stations where the tender delivers the cargo - causing an infinite amount on inner ship remotes on the tender ship.

The preferred solution would be to use the activation beam of the tender to trigger the button on the storage structure, but i see no possibility on how to achieve this.

I hope my explanation is understandable and i really welcome all possible solutions you may consider!
Thanks for your help!

 

[StormWing0]

Use the wireless method, as annoying as it is it's the best route unless someone else has a better idea. Using the ship's activation beam might not work in the future so don't count on it for everything.

 

[conductor94]

Use the wireless method, as annoying as it is it's the best route unless someone else has a better idea. Using the ship's activation beam might not work in the future so don't count on it for everything.

Ok, are there any ambitions to remove this feature? i think it's really useful, also for opening hangar doors from the outside for example.

But in the current situation it's not working either.

And even thou the wireless method is the currently working one, it has the downsides mentioned above as you need a wireless for every pod docking point and it's not working with foreign ships the tender is not yet connected too.

 

[StormWing0]

The other downside to wireless is they tend to disconnect themselves from time to time. Also as you mentioned ships not currently connected. There's a way to solve the issue but it takes both ships having the correct logic on them for it to work and is really dependent on what you are up to.

Try messing around with directly undocking the pods by having a signal or activator linked to the rail, (C on logic block V on rail block). That will undock it. Also the shootoff & pickup rails with pickup points come to mind but again it needs to undock and dock system on both ships.

 

[GalactusX]

hi mate, another solution can be... when your cargo ship "dock" to the station or other big ship, transfer your cargo pods from entitie A to B.

I mean, when ship A (where cargo pods are) dock to entitie B (for example your factory station base) it send a logic signal and move his cargo pods by rails.

When you need to load again the cargo pod from entitie B to A, just click one button and do all the automatic precess in reverse.

That´s what you want do?

 

[Tocks13]

Another way would be, that you have an "activator entity" in your ship. That means, that you have a small ship, min 2 Blocks, inside your ship at a specific Point away from your docking. at the same point you put down an trigger field from the station. the Signal from the trigger field would also be hooked up with the rail to an "and" signal. This means, that the Field only sends a signal if an entity is inside the field and something is docked. If you then undock your activator entity, the triger field activates and sends a signal. using a Pickup point, you could instantly redock the activator entity.
Last time I checked, fields didn't trigger on docked entitys.

 

[conductor94]

Well ok, i currently have a special setup for docking and undocking on both sides, on the tender as well as on the storage facility. The exchance is working if i exit the tender and press the buttons manualy. Hoped to find a way to do this without the need to exit the ship. I use logic linked to the rail to undock the pod from the tender and use a pick-up pint to snap it to the target structure. This works well as long as the pick-up point is enabled - but i need to disable it, so the pod would not snap back to the storage facility - at least temporarily.

hi mate, another solution can be... when your cargo ship "dock" to the station or other big ship, transfer your cargo pods from entitie A to B.

I mean, when ship A (where cargo pods are) dock to entitie B (for example your factory station base) it send a logic signal and move his cargo pods by rails.

Ok, you mean to do it all automated - without player intervention?
On the one hand i would like to be able to take influence on the process - but thats irrelevant if it's the solution. But to trigger this correctly i would need to have the follwing logic:

If there is a pod on the storage facility and the tender ship docks, the storage releases the pod.
If there is no pod and the tender ship docks it enables the pick-up point.

This requires to recieve a signal from the point where the pod docks and have it linked so it could get undocked by logic, doesn't it? I remember to have read in the last updates that having both functions on one rail is currently not possible ....

Another way would be, that you have an "activator entity" in your ship. That means, that you have a small ship, min 2 Blocks, inside your ship at a specific Point away from your docking. at the same point you put down an trigger field from the station. the Signal from the trigger field would also be hooked up with the rail to an "and" signal. This means, that the Field only sends a signal if an entity is inside the field and something is docked. If you then undock your activator entity, the triger field activates and sends a signal. using a Pickup point, you could instantly redock the activator entity.
Last time I checked, fields didn't trigger on docked entitys.

Ok. This seems to be a work around. Quite strange idea, but currently working. I'll need to try this.

 

[Tocks13]

Another way would be to have dedicated Docks. But that would mean having 2, which might not be desired.

To the other Idea:
I think it should work aswell. If you place an Activation Modul next to the Rail, it should track, whether or not something is docked. Then connecting from a button, which is not next to it, to the rail should let you undock whats on that rail.
But that also means no good control over what happens. Especially edge Cases: What happens if you already have a container on the Ship and on the Docking port?

And about strange solutions:
As long as it works, I don't care

 

[DrTarDIS]

... But to trigger this correctly i would need to have the follwing logic:
If there is a pod on the storage facility and the tender ship docks, the storage releases the pod.
If there is no pod and the tender ship docks it enables the pick-up point.

activator under (or linked from) the rail where the pod is give you true/false on "pod is here" {podt} or {podf}
Activator under the ships docking point gives you "the ship is here" true false {shipT} {shipf}

when the ship is there, but a pod has not been docked in the past X seconds (say 5) you want the Pod dock in receiving mode. so you put the activator for the pickup point {podp}

{podp} <-have it run off a {not} <- which gets it's signal from an {or} <- that gets signal from every block on a 5-second chain of {delay} <- which is triggered "on" whenever a pod is docked.
that chain makes it instantly "turn off" when a pod is docked, and stay off for 5 seconds when one undocks. that should handle all usage cases of pods, right?
the {podp} activator controlling the pickup rail can probably be use to convert the entire rail-chain of that area into "loading" carrier to take the pod away 5 seconds after one undocks

From the ship side, same circuit works for a pod pickup/drop: if there hasn't been one in me in 5 seconds({and} the pilot has toggled his "pickup/dropoff"inner-ship), turn it on"

to pickup/release auto it would be: if there is a pod {podt} and a ship docks, you want the pod to undock and load.
{podt} then {shipt} is important here

so {and} <- {shipt} and {podt} as a basic, but we need to protect versus it throwing away the pod right away, on drop off.

if the docking point has a method of physically moving the cargo away in it's "loading" phase I don't see it being a problem by adding a 5 seconds "grace period for the pod to travel away, otherwise you need to adjust you delay period enough to have the pilot "take off right away" after a drop off to avoid the return to ship.
so {dedock pod" logic}<- {and} <- {shipt} and every block in a {delay chain}<-{podt}

Especially edge Cases: What happens if you already have a container on the Ship and on the Docking port?

I assume the ship won't "fit" on the dock, so nothing happens?

 

[Tocks13]

About not fitting:
That depends on the design of the Docking Port.
Do you have a Container on the outside, covered in space Dust and space roaches, that you directly dock onto your ship?
Or do you prefer your Container safely hidden inside of your base, only leaving to be transported by your freighter?
Question of Design philosophy.
While I often tend to do unnecessary complex designs like the second one, the first one is much easier to implement and probably more preferable for people, who don't like messing with logic too much.