Help Designing Potent Turret system for Huge 3km ship

[ControlledAnger]

I'm currently in the process of building a 3km (100m block) ship and im theorizing the turrets before I start on them but im relatively new to Starmade and pvp so I need some help here.

The goals this system needs to achieve are as follow;
-Must be able to hit targets from the other side of the sector (in case they are trying to out range me)
-Has capability to completely lower shields/armor/structure without self firing (rotational will be non existent)
-Able to shoot all angles around the ship (need designs for this, maybe have them floating beside the ship?
-Also need a wepon system to self fire in case turrets bug out or something goes wrong. Only option here is missile/missile/X without having to aim.

To make the guidelines of what I need, the format in order from start of the fight to finish is;
1. Opening shield drain Turrets, both long and short range.
2. Turrets to keep shields from recharging quick
3. Turrets to destroy armor as fast as possible
4. Turrets to deal as much structural dmg as possible
5. Turrets that finally hit vital systems and core as efficiently as possible.

 

[Bladeriker]

I would look up ship sizes and what servers can handle, as most ships over 2K cause massive lag, and chunk issues. PvP in a 3km ship may cause server crashing lag.

Other than that I would suggest playing around with different weapon load outs and finding what works for you, there are several threads about weapons, and turrets, that could be helpful.

 

[Dovan Empire]

Just like the person above said, ships that large wouldn't be viable. It doesn't matter how powerful your PC is, the game itself cannot handle that.

For weapon load out, I would recommend Beam-Pulse-Punch through. Its a deadly combination.
Also, don't forget AMS turrets. They're very helpful.

 

[ControlledAnger]

Ok lets ignore the size of the ship then since it really makes no difference in designing the system.

Need some advice from some experienced vets who have tested everything (Always doing this myself but making threads for validation + extra knowledge doesn't hurt).

 

[Malacodor]

How big was the biggest ship you completed so far?

 

[kingreol]

Id look at the thread stormwing has on pvp ships. Lots of small useful tidbits

 

[Panpiper]

You are going to have a very hard time getting any of the veteran players to take you seriously. As others have said, a 3K ship is quite impossible for any server to handle. Moreover no multiplayer server would let you play with such a ship, not solely because you would crash the server, but because there is no way you could ever generate the materials needed to build it any other way than admin cheating. Finally, and there is no delicate way to put this, you frankly lack any credibility announcing with your very first post both that you intend to build the godliest of ships, and that you also don't have the first clue as to how it should actually be built.

Build something small. Really small. Then build a mining ship that can harvest asteroids effectively and also fend off pirates. That should be your biggest goal to start with. You can spend a year just perfecting how to do that. From there you can progress into maybe cruiser sized ships with a 500-1000K blocks. You will find those amply big enough to keep you occupied for a very long time making them both effective and something a server admin will let onto a roleplay server.

Before asking such advice, essentially asking people to write just for you, things that have already been written about over and over and over again, read first what has already been written. Spend time reading the Wiki, read that thread Kingreol suggested for instance.

 

[-Moose-]

To expound on the points given. If you are after PvP you are actually much better off building ships much smaller than what you have planned. Power has a soft cap of 2M e/sec, that sounds like a lot but a 10k gun can drain that pretty fast, even with a significant chunk of capacitors. Aux power doesn't provide nearly enough while in it's off state to be useful and furthermore they explode. Even more of a reason; shields, thrust, shield recharging, and power have a serious case of diminishing returns. Meaning two piloted ships can usually take out a ship of combined mass or more.

A smaller specialized PvP ship tends to be much better than just a "big" ship.

That's not mentioning the time to build such a gargantuan ship. 100 million blocks at two blocks a second we're talking 13,888 hours. That's not counting things like planning, detailing, messing up, and refitting.

 

[Edymnion]

Yeah dude, not to sound snarky, but you basically just said "I don't know what I'm doing, do all my design work for me".

That never flies.

 

[Dire Venom]

If in doubt, add more missiles. Then add some more. And some more.
If your really feeling evil, then heat-seekers as well.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That being said, for turret options:
-Missiles are pretty much your solid all-rounder option. Fire off enough + some decoys and they'll always get through. Great alpha strike and auto-tracking plus huge AOE.
-Cannon-Cannon-Explosive is for when you want to juice up a ships insides. Give it enough power and it'll cut a ship in half and liquefy it's insides. Cannon + effect is also a very efficient combo and is good is every situation.
-Beams are substandard (with AI go cannons instead) Tend to be bad vs armour but still decent for taking down shields or as player fired weapons.
-Pulses.... never touch them.
-Never use overdrive as a tertiary effect.
-Keep your docking points & computers well hidden beneath the bulk of the turret + a few layers of armour.
-A few large turrets tend to be better than lots of really small ones.

-If your going for a very power heavy build then you may want to consider emp weapons. Suitably sized ones will lock 2e/s for every 1e/s you spend, thus if you dedicate half the power they regen/sec to emp you can completely lock down their ship (no shields, no thrust, no weapons, no warp, no anything XD). A different type of playstyle, but really difficult to counter and a large emp based ship will beable to decimate ships much larger than it. Main weakness is swarms.

-You can attach point defense turrets to other turrets, just create a separate entity to separate the turret top and the pds turret base first.

 

[Panpiper]

-Never use overdrive as a tertiary effect.

Generally speaking, this is good advice. However at one point I wanted to make an anti-drone, anti-fighter turret. I wanted for it to be able to be both a maximum rate of rapid fire cannon/cannon 'and' be able to crack an advanced armor block with every shot even if the ship had full HP. That meant each shot had to do ~2500 damage. Doing that with a regular cannon/cannon would have taken 2500 blocks which would have been a much larger turret than I was happy with.

I am very good however with building power systems. I was able to squeeze an enormous quantity of power generation into a rather small amount of space 'inside' the confines of the turret and turret base itself, such that I could power a much smaller cannon/cannon/overdrive weapon that did similar damage with a much smaller quantity of blocks. The resulting turret did the job with a much smaller form factor than it would have taken if I did not use overdrive.

This was a special case. The turret was 100% self powering, it drew absolutely no power from the ship itself. In any case other than a self contained turret or a relatively small fighter, overdrive is very much not recommended.

 

[Scypio]

-Pulses.... never touch them.
-Never use overdrive as a tertiary effect.

Pulses can be used as secondary computer on on specific cases, like overdrive.

I would like to just add that self powering turrets is pretty good. If they got detached they'll still shoot at your ennemy and any loss of power won't make them stop.

 

[Keptick]

I have a 360° fov turret on my 1.28km long ship. However, even if nothing collides, I still get ~15fps while the turret moves around because of collision checks. And that's with a ship half the lenght of yours.

What you're asking for is possible in theory, but not in practice: Your computer could never handle a turret that size (on a ship that size) without exploding.

 

[ControlledAnger]

You are going to have a very hard time getting any of the veteran players to take you seriously. As others have said, a 3K ship is quite impossible for any server to handle. Moreover no multiplayer server would let you play with such a ship, not solely because you would crash the server, but because there is no way you could ever generate the materials needed to build it any other way than admin cheating. Finally, and there is no delicate way to put this, you frankly lack any credibility announcing with your very first post both that you intend to build the godliest of ships, and that you also don't have the first clue as to how it should actually be built.

Build something small. Really small. Then build a mining ship that can harvest asteroids effectively and also fend off pirates. That should be your biggest goal to start with. You can spend a year just perfecting how to do that. From there you can progress into maybe cruiser sized ships with a 500-1000K blocks. You will find those amply big enough to keep you occupied for a very long time making them both effective and something a server admin will let onto a roleplay server.

Before asking such advice, essentially asking people to write just for you, things that have already been written about over and over and over again, read first what has already been written. Spend time reading the Wiki, read that thread Kingreol suggested for instance.

First off, getting the mats to make a ship on a multiplayer server isn't impossible, its happening as we speak without any help from admins. It just takes time and patience as I'm already 60 million blocks in.
Second, I said to just disregard the size because that's not the point of this thread, it's about a weapon system to fill the needs listed above.
Finally, I never announced anywhere im building the "godliest of ships". My standards might just be higher than some. I don't know where you think you are getting that I don't have a clue, because that's definitely not the case. I have well tested all of the wep combo's on many many different scenarios so far, so don't take the broadness of the original post as a credential to how much I already know.

This isn't my first ship, I have already built roughly 25 give or take up until now ranging up to 400k mass, all of which were very viable ships.

Btw, a lot of the information on the Wiki is out of date, as I have found looking through some of the config file data.

Yeah dude, not to sound snarky, but you basically just said "I don't know what I'm doing, do all my design work for me".

That never flies.

You guys are taking the broadness of the original post the wrong way.
Step back a second and just look at what I am asking, but before you answer read the above posts carefully.

 

[Malacodor]

I suggest you make a 3km long brick of reactors and thrusters in creative mode and check your framerate when moving it around. If you want to actually use it on a multiplayer server, you should ask an admin for permission beforehand.

 

[Panpiper]

First off, getting the mats to make a ship on a multiplayer server isn't impossible, its happening as we speak without any help from admins.

Vote buying by granting insane block 'gifts' and increasing the mining yields by a factor of often ten, is "admin cheating" in my book. If a multiplayer server is happy to give you the means to destroy their server, and you most emphatically will if you attempt to build a three kilometer ship, that is their problem I guess.

Finally, I never announced anywhere im building the "godliest of ships". My standards might just be higher than some.

Right, you want to build a ship twice the length of the largest 'operational' titan ever fielded (Keptick's) and it's not meant to be the godliest of ships. You just have "higher standards" than everyone else.

 

[ControlledAnger]

If in doubt, add more missiles. Then add some more. And some more.
If your really feeling evil, then heat-seekers as well.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That being said, for turret options:
-Missiles are pretty much your solid all-rounder option. Fire off enough + some decoys and they'll always get through. Great alpha strike and auto-tracking plus huge AOE.
-Cannon-Cannon-Explosive is for when you want to juice up a ships insides. Give it enough power and it'll cut a ship in half and liquefy it's insides. Cannon + effect is also a very efficient combo and is good is every situation.
-Beams are substandard (with AI go cannons instead) Tend to be bad vs armour but still decent for taking down shields or as player fired weapons.
-Pulses.... never touch them.
-Never use overdrive as a tertiary effect.
-Keep your docking points & computers well hidden beneath the bulk of the turret + a few layers of armour.
-A few large turrets tend to be better than lots of really small ones.

-If your going for a very power heavy build then you may want to consider emp weapons. Suitably sized ones will lock 2e/s for every 1e/s you spend, thus if you dedicate half the power they regen/sec to emp you can completely lock down their ship (no shields, no thrust, no weapons, no warp, no anything XD). A different type of playstyle, but really difficult to counter and a large emp based ship will beable to decimate ships much larger than it. Main weakness is swarms.

-You can attach point defense turrets to other turrets, just create a separate entity to separate the turret top and the pds turret base first.

I was wandering about having a Missile-missile-X for a self fired option in case something goes horribly wrong with turrets during a fight.
The overdrive thing was something i figured out pretty early on, seeing as it was multiplying damage/power the same as other tertiary effects but lacking an actual effect.

On the emp topic, this was something I had some trouble testing. Someone said something about emp weps was nerfed but I couldn't find any real information on the mater. It's definitely something I had planned though since like you said it seems to be something overlooked (most don't have large emp defense systems from what I've seen.

Vote buying by granting insane block 'gifts' and increasing the mining yields by a factor of often ten, is "admin cheating" in my book. If a multiplayer server is happy to give you the means to destroy their server, and you most emphatically will if you attempt to build a three kilometer ship, that is their problem I guess.



Right, you want to build a ship twice the length of the largest 'operational' titan ever fielded (Keptic's) and it's not meant to be the godliest of ships. You just have "higher standards" than everyone else.

Not to be rude, but you are going way off topic and your not being of any help.
Refer to above post where I stated things I shouldn't have to again.

I suggest you make a 3km long brick of reactors and thrusters in creative mode and check your framerate when moving it around. If you want to actually use it on a multiplayer server, you should ask an admin for permission beforehand.

Yea It doesn't lag much at all at the moment, i've had the admin come check it out for lag multiple times throughout the build process, as well as other players. So far so good (had to change and remove a few things here and there).

All the items building it have been obtained through manually mining, and npc shop bouncing on the server completely legitimately, and only by those 2 methods but let me not go off topic.

 

[MrFURB]

On the emp topic, this was something I had some trouble testing. Someone said something about emp weps was nerfed but I couldn't find any real information on the mater. It's definitely something I had planned though since like you said it seems to be something overlooked (most don't have large emp defense systems from what I've seen.

EMP has the potential to be absolutely amazing, but to reach that potential you have to specialize in it.
A weapon with maximum EMP effect will deal twice the amount of energy damage to the enemy as it takes energy to fire, not counting the increase in energy used for multiple outputs. That is 200 energy drained per second per block. So a 50% EMP weapon will do half it's normal damage, and then reduce the enemy's energy by the same amount as you spent to fire it.

The EMP defensive effect takes a large portion of your ship to field and goes up to 50% protection. This is enough to counter an EMP ship, but a regular ship will have a noticeable advantage against an anti-EMP ship.

 

[TheWendigo]

I don't know what wep/sec/ter combo you should use, but physical configuration should be a ring turret. A ring turret is when the turret primary axis is congruent with the ship's, and the secondary axis is perpendicular to the primary. Ifyour ship is a finger, the turret base is a ring and the turret barrel is a gem, or a pipe through the finger coming out both sides of the ring. This gives a turret with 360x360 coverage, but doesn't have to be floating . If you need a screenshot, I'll post one.

 

[kingreol]

one of these days im going to sit down and learn all the forum fun linking stuff. and get a damn picture :P