Game Balance Suggestions

[Lecic]

Penalize ships for running out of power! If a ship's drops to 0 power and attempts to draw additional power, it should suffer a power re-gen penalty or a "complete power failure" cooldown of 0 power output duration proportional to reactor size/number of power blocks. Even if it were brief, this would provide disincentive to pushing your ship to the limit, and would provide a niche for EMP effect modules. A ship could disable a combatant without destroying by using EMP to trigger the Power Failure debuff, and using STOP to immobilize them.

You know do know EMP is already extremely effective at causing a complete power failure and fully immobilizing a ship, right?

 

[Ghent96]

Ditto that. Emp is very good as is. Let's focus on getting core parts of the game working before we tweak stats. An "empDisables" Boolean value in the config might not be a bad idea, to enable server admins to, further customize gameplay, but that's it for now.

 

[wizardoftrash]

You know do know EMP is already extremely effective at causing a complete power failure and fully immobilizing a ship, right?

To my knowledge, EMP has no effect on a ship that still has shields up. It seems on practice to be ineffective

 

[Lecic]

To my knowledge, EMP has no effect on a ship that still has shields up. It seems on practice to be ineffective

To my knowledge, you've clearly never tested EMP.

 

[Equalest]

Decay Config Option for Generated structures, aka changing the Tag to automatically be false or true
Sorry, i dislike the new system for it and find it a poor idea for balance, please forgive me.
Just doesn't really make sense, the point of scrapping is to reuse parts, breaking the part to use it doesn't really happen.

 

[Mortiferum]

To my knowledge, EMP has no effect on a ship that still has shields up. It seems on practice to be ineffective

Then you arent too knowledgeable, are you?

 

[diremage]

Let damage pulse primary ignore shields -- swords can be a viable tactic, especially with small cloaking ships. Damage pulse/beam should be 3km, shield-piercing beam with a duty cycle of 1/10; damage pulse/missile should be a dumbfire, shield-piercing missile, and damage/pulse cannon should be a medium-range, moderate damage cannon with a long duty cycle. Pulse bare and pulse/pulse should retain the current effect, but ignore shields.

Pulse/cannon should rightly be feared by modern titans as they can potentially one-shot delicate internal systems even in the presence of massive amounts of shields; this will spur the addition of armor to the current build meta and decrease the reliance on shields; however, weapons that do damage shields should keep a range and damage advantage that keep them relevant, while shield-piercing effects should be relegated to near-range and close-quarters combat.

This will also enable a combat role for bombers and fighters as they can now be a threat to any ship if they get close enough.

Damage beam / Missile and Cannon / Missile should have lock-on effects (cannon should lead the target but not maneuver in flight) at a cost of 25% reduction in damage.

 

[DrTarDIS]

Let damage pulse primary ignore shields -- swords can be a viable tactic, especially with small cloaking ships. ... however, weapons that do damage shields should keep a range and damage advantage that keep them relevant, while shield-piercing effects should be relegated to near-range and close-quarters combat.

This will also enable a combat role for bombers and fighters as they can now be a threat to any ship if they get close enough.

would be fun
would make fleet of cloaking drones scary-op without automated sensors though.

Damage beam / Missile and Cannon / Missile should have lock-on effects (cannon should lead the target but not maneuver in flight) at a cost of 25% reduction in damage.

this i like. outright.

 

[Mortiferum]

Let damage pulse primary ignore shields -- swords can be a viable tactic, especially with small cloaking ships. Damage pulse/beam should be 3km, shield-piercing beam with a duty cycle of 1/10; damage pulse/missile should be a dumbfire, shield-piercing missile, and damage/pulse cannon should be a medium-range, moderate damage cannon with a long duty cycle. Pulse bare and pulse/pulse should retain the current effect, but ignore shields.

Pulse/cannon should rightly be feared by modern titans as they can potentially one-shot delicate internal systems even in the presence of massive amounts of shields; this will spur the addition of armor to the current build meta and decrease the reliance on shields; however, weapons that do damage shields should keep a range and damage advantage that keep them relevant, while shield-piercing effects should be relegated to near-range and close-quarters combat.

This will also enable a combat role for bombers and fighters as they can now be a threat to any ship if they get close enough.

Damage beam / Missile and Cannon / Missile should have lock-on effects (cannon should lead the target but not maneuver in flight) at a cost of 25% reduction in damage.

No

I will simply make cannon/pulse with "shield bypass", put it onto a logic computer so I can use 200 outputs and blast the front of your ship off in a single volley.

I will calculate it so that it would exactly be one shot to destroy 1 advance armor block as well to minimize power usage and nullify all protection given by armor. It enables nothing except absolute lunacy.

 

[Matt_Bradock]

Let damage pulse primary ignore shields -- swords can be a viable tactic, especially with small cloaking ships. Damage pulse/beam should be 3km, shield-piercing beam with a duty cycle of 1/10; damage pulse/missile should be a dumbfire, shield-piercing missile, and damage/pulse cannon should be a medium-range, moderate damage cannon with a long duty cycle. Pulse bare and pulse/pulse should retain the current effect, but ignore shields.

Pulse/cannon should rightly be feared by modern titans as they can potentially one-shot delicate internal systems even in the presence of massive amounts of shields; this will spur the addition of armor to the current build meta and decrease the reliance on shields; however, weapons that do damage shields should keep a range and damage advantage that keep them relevant, while shield-piercing effects should be relegated to near-range and close-quarters combat.

This will also enable a combat role for bombers and fighters as they can now be a threat to any ship if they get close enough.

Damage beam / Missile and Cannon / Missile should have lock-on effects (cannon should lead the target but not maneuver in flight) at a cost of 25% reduction in damage.

General rule of a sandbox game with PvP elements, based on my experience in Starmade, Empyrion, Rust, Reign of Kings and ARK: Whatever can be abused and exploited to make completely broken overpowered contraptions, WILL ALWAYS BE abused and exploited to make completely broken overpowered contraptions. The idea isn't bad as long as it's used as intended for a normal average player. But it will also be used by min-maxing players who passionately try to break every possible system in the game. That's who you need to balance the systems in Starmade for, minimizing the possible abuses and loopholes allowing broken, busted designs.

 

[Malacodor]

General rule of a sandbox game with PvP elements, based on my experience in Starmade, Empyrion, Rust, Reign of Kings and ARK: Whatever can be abused and exploited to make completely broken overpowered contraptions, WILL ALWAYS BE abused and exploited to make completely broken overpowered contraptions.

Everything that can be abused and exploited to gain any kind of advantage in any situation, be it in a video game or in the real world, will always be abused and exploited.

 

[diremage]

No

I will simply make cannon/pulse with "shield bypass", put it onto a logic computer so I can use 200 outputs and blast the front of your ship off in a single volley.

I will calculate it so that it would exactly be one shot to destroy 1 advance armor block as well to minimize power usage and nullify all protection given by armor. It enables nothing except absolute lunacy.

The idea is, if you can get close enough to do this, you deserve it. If the other guy can stay at range and pummel you with traditional weapons, your "uber gun" is going to be absolutely worthless. And if the other guy also has a shield breaker, he probably also has enough advanced armor to take a few hits.

Spoiler

General rule of a sandbox game with PvP elements, based on my experience in Starmade, Empyrion, Rust, Reign of Kings and ARK: Whatever can be abused and exploited to make completely broken overpowered contraptions, WILL ALWAYS BE abused and exploited to make completely broken overpowered contraptions. The idea isn't bad as long as it's used as intended for a normal average player. But it will also be used by min-maxing players who passionately try to break every possible system in the game. That's who you need to balance the systems in Starmade for, minimizing the possible abuses and loopholes allowing broken, busted designs.

If you have to rely on Trump to make your argument, you probably don't have a very good argument. And you haven't actually come up with an abuse or a loophole.

Everything that can be abused and exploited to gain any kind of advantage in any situation, be it in a video game or in the real world, will always be abused and exploited.

Again, saying "It could be abused" is very different from saying "It can be abused by doing x, y and z."

 

[Matt_Bradock]

If you have to rely on Trump to make your argument, you probably don't have a very good argument. And you haven't actually come up with an abuse or a loophole.

1. I'm European. I look at the entire last US elections and Trump's presidency as a (terrible) joke. So if I can use a Trump meme (he really makes it easy to make those) I might as well do so. Especially if it fits the current situation. I don't need Trump to support my argument, but I find it hilarious. (Hillaryous, even)

2. I indeed haven't come up with a loophole. Anyone really into that, will, tho. Trident, Aegis, Vaygr, anyone already known for bringing the theoretically possible maximum of any viable weapon system. Mortiferum just mentioned he already has ideas how to abuse the living crap out of any weapon that bypasses shields. Hell, warhead cloakers were already abused a couple times, because warheads bypass shields. Imagine the nerdgasms all the griefers will get when they have a shield-bypass weapon that doesn't actually blow itself up when fired.

 

[Lecic]

Let damage pulse primary ignore shields -- swords can be a viable tactic, especially with small cloaking ships. Damage pulse/beam should be 3km, shield-piercing beam with a duty cycle of 1/10; damage pulse/missile should be a dumbfire, shield-piercing missile, and damage/pulse cannon should be a medium-range, moderate damage cannon with a long duty cycle. Pulse bare and pulse/pulse should retain the current effect, but ignore shields.

Besides the fact that shield piercing weapons like this are a terrible idea for balance that will make shields entirely worthless, do you not understand how the master/slave system even WORKS? Primary is always the projectile type, and secondary is a modifier on that projectile. You have the secondary determining projectile type. Why? That's the opposite of how the system is supposed to be working.

But sure, shield pierce. Great idea. I can't wait to build cloakers that gut entire ships of any size in a single shot.

 

[diremage]

Besides the fact that shield piercing weapons like this are a terrible idea for balance that will make shields entirely worthless, do you not understand how the master/slave system even WORKS? Primary is always the projectile type, and secondary is a modifier on that projectile. You have the secondary determining projectile type. Why? That's the opposite of how the system is supposed to be working.

Pulse is, barring some rare and exotic niche uses, entirely useless. Against a shielded object, pulse is worse than useless because it's taking up space, mass, and energy that could be used for a useful weapon.

But sure, shield pierce. Great idea. I can't wait to build cloakers that gut entire ships of any size in a single shot.

If that was something people could do, they would already be doing it with warheads.

 

[Lord_Greyscale]

If that was something people could do, they would already be doing it with warheads.

On all of the servers where Warheads are modified to be "not shit-tier", they do exactly this to butt-fuck anything they don't like.

hell, I've done it, and I've even done it on a few servers where warheads aren't modified. It just takes longer, and/or a specialized poker.

 

[boomchacle]

I feel like warheads should be very expensive and very powerful, instead of being super cheap and easy, but pointless

it would add a new way for a small ship to take out larger ships, and it would also make larger ships have to focus on anti missile point defense.

however, missile point defense would have to be more powerful, and I feel like using missile+cannon could be useful if they had a bit of flak detonation on them.

 

[Dire Venom]

I feel like warheads should be very expensive and very powerful, instead of being super cheap and easy, but pointless

it would add a new way for a small ship to take out larger ships, and it would also make larger ships have to focus on anti missile point defense.

however, missile point defense would have to be more powerful, and I feel like using missile+cannon could be useful if they had a bit of flak detonation on them.

I would personally go with Cannon-Missile as that variant isn't used and is awaiting a rework :3

 

[Skwidz]

I wish the mine layer weapon wasn't cancelled. Those artillery guns shown in the old weapons chart seemed pretty cool.

 

[YamiHikari]

Complex/manufactured blocks are worth more than the total worth of the materials required to create them. It would a) reignite a reliance on manufacturing instead of immediately selling raw resources, b) prevent the player from immediately obtaining all necessary resources for massive ships super early in the game, and c) draw attention to the manufacturing mechanics, leading to more suggestions for reworking any flaws or issues in them.