StarMade 0.1836 New Tutorial and loads of fixes

[Crimson-Artist]

sry folks but i couldn't resist

 

[Lecic]

sry folks but i couldn't resist

It's more of a 25:50:25 is the new 34/33/33

 

[FunnyBunny14]

We don't know that it is a bug.

It was reported and excepted as a bug in the bug tracker, so yes, it was.[DOUBLEPOST=1416673534,1416673393][/DOUBLEPOST]

It's more of a 25:50:25 is the new 34/33/33

You do realise you could have said this: 2:4:2 is the new 3:3:3. The percentages at least are all 100%.

To everyone else, for the last time: you don't need more space! You just need more slave modules and less effect and master modules, but the total amount of modules remains the same.

 

[NuclearFun]

There's still a huge amount of incentive to use the slave system. Most people don't want to just use normal cannons, which old ships have.

Systems still need to have the same number of blocks, those just need be a rearranged.

A 1000:000:000 set up and a 500:500:000 set up have the same DPS. A 250:500:250 set up will have the same DPS as those two, not counting for certain effect bonuses.

Take your total system block count, divide it by two, and then divide it by two again. The first number you get is the amount of support blocks you need. The second one is the amount of blocks the master and effect need. So,

1000/2 = 500 (slave modules needed)/2 = 250 (amount of modules needed for the master, and the same amount is needed for effect)

If you don't have an effect, you can still build perfectly fine at a 1:1 ratio.

I think this is completely counter intuitive, you lose so much (changing between different effect systems with different sizes, using effect systems both as defensive and offensive...) and gain nothing except for a small "bugfix" (which certainly can be fixed differently).
There will be a lot of changes in the future (as there should be, alpha state and all) but i will criticize every change which i see as negative and this is one of them.

 

[SchnellBier]

sry folks but i couldn't resist

made my day

 

[FunnyBunny14]

I do understand why people are complaining. Something like this would have been better:
Damage multiplier = 1 + slave/master + effect/master
Total damage = damage master x damage multiplier

And slave, master and effect both are the amount of modules of the slave, master and effect.

That should be a simple (?) way of fixing it. And if I'm not mistaken, that's how it was meant to be.

Edit:
And: Damage per shot = total damage x slave value.

 

[Incap]

This fix is a lot better for starting a new game. Instead of 100 : 100 : 100 players now only need 75 : 150 : 75. This means that you need less efect blocks for the same result, and anyone who has used the crafting system will tell you that they are extremely expensive.

It's scary that you're being serious.

 

[Malacodor]

*Sigh* The amount of butthurtness in this thread is epic.

What it comes down to is that I'm simply not wasting the time in redoing systems again and again for multiple ships. They'll change again before release I'm sure. Multiple times most likely.

You don't say!

I can't just mass delete with a huge brush and I can't just use the filter because multiple systems in that area use the same types of blocks.

That's why clever people keep separate systems spatially divided.

Which is something I don't feel like wasting on doing it again (See my post about spending about a weeks worth of time on a single ship) I had time off so I did the work to get everything on the ship right and the next day I'm pretty much at square one again. Now with both work and university picking up I can't be bothered. Especially if I would have to do it again after another update. Quite honestly it's just sapped the enthusiasm out of me for playing with weapons systems.

That's exactly why my titan is still as hollow as many poster's arguments. Your job as alpha tester is to report bugs, give feedback, make suggestions. If you aren't willing to refit your ships from time to time you're pretty wrong here. Get a gameboy and play Pokémon, no significant changes there in 18 years.

Why bother with redoing them again and again when I can just use my shields and speed and stop effect turrets to fly right through a hostile area without a care in the world? It doesn't require a refit of any ships and it doesn't eat up all of my free time doing monotonous block replacing.

I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but the overpowered stop effect and the broken momentum protection from passive explosive effects were fixed as well.

Stop with this "still an alpha" bs, that is no shield to guard against criticism.

I have a hard time finding any critisism here, all I see is whining. Cheese?

there has to be a different and better solution for that stupid DPS miscalculation.

Hollow words, unless you come up with a better idea.

People that like the change have asked, "Why should 300:300:300 be better than 900:0:0?" and for me, the answer is simple: The first one is ENHANCED by EFFECT MODULES and SLAVE SYSTEMS. The second one's just a bigger gun. There's no reason why that SHOULDN'T be better - it's essentially more advanced technology.

Schema wants each combination to be viable. The way it was before combinations without effects were discouraged. There's no reason why effects should practically be mandatory.

You are so funny guys. You really expect a game in alpha to not change the balance? Most of you are acting like spoiled brats. You can be glad that blueprints don´t break every patch. Most games in alpha stage are resetting progress all the time and you are "hurr durr don´t wanna refit". Pathetic.

Can we please get an "Epic Agree" button in addition to the normal one?

I understand the thrust changes

Afaik the thrust mechanics will be changed again soon. Note to self: Buy more cheese.

Replace tool doesn't have a filter based on linked systems.

Why is that so? Perhaps because people like you prefer whining to wrtiting a proper suggestion post?

And it's not uncommon to have identical support systems for different weapons next to one another.

Just because it's common it doesn't mean it's intelligent. According to my experience the opposite is true horrifyingly often.

I am confused... completely... I enjoyed putting thousands of amcs on my ship back before thanksgiving last year... now your saying that all the old ships with no supporting systems are just as good as all the new ships with all the advanced systems and expensive effects? so you removed most of the incentive to use the slave system? so now is the time for 1000:0:1000 arrays since there is no bonus other than using more power for amcs? its easier... loads easier. or was the damage increase from effects removed? ... so confused// can hard numbers be posted.. need to know what all the math is... what the addition of each block equals.

Slave and effect systems were never meant to give an absolute DPS boost. They are modifications, not upgrades. Their advantages come with disadvantages. If you don't understand the benefits of higher fire rates or greater ranges you better play Battleship.

but what your also saying is that the systems don't need to be changed.. the pre 1836 arranged weapons are the same dps as post 1836 arranged weapons?

Weapons with secondary and tertiary systems have less DPS now, since they had a too high damage bonus before. But they also need less energy now.

sry folks but i couldn't resist

No it wasn't a balance change, it was a BUGFIX.

 

[Drakkart]

ihave a lockon missile 4/4/0 which got 100% effect of the secondary system means great range
i got a 100/100/100 AMC/Beam/Ion Gun which now has it's range bonus at 50%. Why does slave give 100% without effect and 50% with effect?

 

[Malacodor]

ihave a lockon missile 4/4/0 which got 100% effect of the secondary system means great range
i got a 100/100/100 AMC/Beam/Ion Gun which now has it's range bonus at 50%. Why does slave give 100% without effect and 50% with effect?

The secondary system is compared with the primary plus the tertiary system. In other words: For 100% bonus you need as much slave blocks as you have master and effect blocks combined.

 

[DivineEvil]

ihave a lockon missile 4/4/0 which got 100% effect of the secondary system means great range
i got a 100/100/100 AMC/Beam/Ion Gun which now has it's range bonus at 50%. Why does slave give 100% without effect and 50% with effect?

Because Master and Effect combined is counted as a primary weapon component, so you need a slave system equivalent to that summ to have 100% modified weapon aspect. If you have no effect modules, then 1:1 ratio works on 100%.

Random example is, you want to add a 600 block plasma cannon, so you take 150 AMC master system and route 150 Explosive Effect system to it. To amplify it's damage, you add 300 Damage Pulse slave to them.

 

[Lecic]

ihave a lockon missile 4/4/0 which got 100% effect of the secondary system means great range
i got a 100/100/100 AMC/Beam/Ion Gun which now has it's range bonus at 50%. Why does slave give 100% without effect and 50% with effect?

Primary + Effect = Secondary

If you want a 300 block weapon system, make it 75:150:75.

 

[DivineEvil]

Primary + Effect = Secondary

If you want a 300 block weapon system, make it 75:150:75.

Which also means, that you need much less Effect blocks and more Weapon blocks to produce the same weapon. It also means, that instead of packing weapon clusters together and placing effect cluster seperately, you have incentive to stack equal amount of weapon and effect blocks together and adding slave weapon afterwards, which makes managing weapons easier.

Overall, I don't really care about the change or about the wimps, who don't understand the terms by which they play Starmade completely for free.

First, I don't mind buidling new ships, because new ship is inherently better, than the old design, whether it is obsolete or not. Each new design process yields new ideas, that make the next one easier and more sophisticated.

Second, I don't build Titans left and right if I don't see a use for one, and I also not gonna build a Titan until I have two working variants for Fighters, Corvettes, Frigates, Cruisers, Battleships and Juggernauts. Anyone who thinks it's supposed to be easy to manage them lacks common sense.

Third, I use an extremely complex development process for all my ships, which I've came up with over time. My ships has specific set maximum dimensions based on Fibonacci sequence numbers, relative block count (mass) index based on volume efficiency ratio, predetermined modular locations for weapons or modules and preset naming standards. Stats for all my ships are documented in an Excel tables, automatically calculating energy consumption, relative mass ratio for all systems and weapons, thus I can retroengineer these values to build a new ship with any stats or capabilities I want to, and fiddle with them to make a ship with a specific role. What did it took to make such a table? One day!

 

[Leanson]

Which also means, that you need much less Effect blocks and more Weapon blocks to produce the same weapon. It also means, that instead of packing weapon clusters together and placing effect cluster seperately, you have incentive to stack equal amount of weapon and effect blocks together and adding slave weapon afterwards, which makes managing weapons easier.

Overall, I don't really care about the change or about the wimps, who don't understand the terms by which they play Starmade completely for free.

First, I don't mind buidling new ships, because new ship is inherently better, than the old design, whether it is obsolete or not. Each new design process yields new ideas, that make the next one easier and more sophisticated.

Second, I don't build Titans left and right if I don't see a use for one, and I also not gonna build a Titan until I have two working variants for Fighters, Corvettes, Frigates, Cruisers, Battleships and Juggernauts. Anyone who thinks it's supposed to be easy to manage them lacks common sense.

Third, I use an extremely complex development process for all my ships, which I've came up with over time. My ships has specific set maximum dimensions based on Fibonacci sequence numbers, relative block count (mass) index based on volume efficiency ratio, predetermined modular locations for weapons or modules and preset naming standards. Stats for all my ships are documented in an Excel tables, automatically calculating energy consumption, relative mass ratio for all systems and weapons, thus I can retroengineer these values to build a new ship with any stats or capabilities I want to, and fiddle with them to make a ship with a specific role. What did it took to make such a table? One day!

Sounds like you just made a nerd doom cube and out it on excel. I would like to see your ship tho, to see what you have came up with, and to possible confirm my doom cube guess.

 

[GalactusX]

hi schema, thanks again for another great update...I have to communicate an error

1º All "paint capsules" can not be crafting on her factory module
2º When you are playing on a server or SP.. the FPS rate down and up all time
3º Sometimes.. galaxy map dont show stations and planets and cant be fixed w a server restart

the game gives me this error when the FPS rate low

Spoiler

 

[DivineEvil]

Sounds like you just made a nerd doom cube and out it on excel. I would like to see your ship tho, to see what you have came up with, and to possible confirm my doom cube guess.

Sintet "Sheen" Heavy Fighter.

Sintet "Glyph" Patrol Corvette

Sintet "Savant" Salvage Corvette

These are prototypes made using said Excel database. I'm currently irritated by how chubby they all look, and also stats for Juggernauts and Titans were too extreme. Because of that, I've changed volume efficiency ratio for all ships and planning to build new lighter designs with better visual fidelity using only Z-symmetry, when I'm done with a first Frigate that already uses those changes.

 

[GalactusX]

Great ships look DivineEvil

here some screenshot of my "cargo ship" inspired on Homeworld game series, i must rebuild all weapon system for the new update...

Spoiler

and w the cargo doors open

and other screenshots of my home base
https://imgur.com/a/RNb4S#0

 

[Drakkart]

Thank you guys for clarification. But the point is, If i would be new to this game and my weapon suddenly gets weaker when i add effects because my secondary system kinda starts failing.. i am wondering what kind of stupid game that is. Where something applies in one situation but does not in another.

I liked the simplicity of 1:1:1 sure if stuff goes off well it needs fixing (i preferably would like to combine different secondarys up to the 100% but that might just be me)
The point is, If you have to recalculate stuff you should still keep it simple. we as testers might know why and how these numbers came up for we read all the patchnotes n such but to a new players this is an unnecessary obstacle. So i'd vote for reverting to 1:1:1 for 100% slave and turn some other screws instead to fix the damage balance.

 

[Malacodor]

Thank you guys for clarification. But the point is, If i would be new to this game and my weapon suddenly gets weaker when i add effects because my secondary system kinda starts failing.. i am wondering what kind of stupid game that is. Where something applies in one situation but does not in another.

I liked the simplicity of 1:1:1 sure if stuff goes off well it needs fixing (i preferably would like to combine different secondarys up to the 100% but that might just be me)
The point is, If you have to recalculate stuff you should still keep it simple. we as testers might know why and how these numbers came up for we read all the patchnotes n such but to a new players this is an unnecessary obstacle. So i'd vote for reverting to 1:1:1 for 100% slave and turn some other screws instead to fix the damage balance.

Yes, a ratio of 1:1:1 would really be more intuitive.

 

[Leanson]

Sintet "Sheen" Heavy Fighter.

Sintet "Glyph" Patrol Corvette

Sintet "Savant" Salvage Corvette

These are prototypes made using said Excel database. I'm currently irritated by how chubby they all look, and also stats for Juggernauts and Titans were too extreme. Because of that, I've changed volume efficiency ratio for all ships and planning to build new lighter designs with better visual fidelity using only Z-symmetry, when I'm done with a first Frigate that already uses those changes.

I like them but they do look very similar I would want to see what you can do with a longer looking ship. My faction could use someone like yourself that can get to the numbers and knows how to build.