Recognized Turrets system with Pictures - [ Poll]

[WaffulMann]

As the title says, this has already been suggested, but I think not a lot of people understand the concept, so I'm going to explain the whole thing with a picture. I like pictures.

Spoiler: Building process:

Here are some examples!

Spoiler: Examples

Suggestion 1: Also, please fix turrets firing sideways. Just make the turrets right click instead of left click, please. :D

 

[Lenier]

This would work perfectly if the docking system ran a check for collision instead of having a "dock zone"

This would also work well if the game mechanic was not "individual cores" but "individual groups of blocks". You could put three cannons onto a hinge block and then link it to a hinge dock block which then transfers the power/shields/etc. Aiming for a bobby-ai uses all possible means of mobility lower down in the docking chain.

 

[SkullCollector]

Yes. This. So much yes and so much this.

I elaborated on this a month or so ago in a very rough text outline of two-part turrets in some other thread, but your illustration just shows how much we'd gain from it. (Which I only just now noticed myself.)
This, among other things, allows for the docking port -- and thus the turret body -- to be underneath the hull surface. Therefore, turrets can be as powerful as they are now, but with smaller gun houses -- a major aesthetic aspect to me. Right now, you have to mash everything into it, shields, effects, weapons, and so it gets larger and larger, sometimes so clunky it diverts attention to itself and distracts from the actual ship.
Or going in the opposite direction, small turrets are essentially worthless other than to deter pesky fighters.

So once again, yes, I'm a major advocate of this idea. Not only for aesthetics reasons, like clipping and the aforementioned clunkiness, but also for the frowned-upon authenticism.

 

[Lecic]

I was a major supporter of this back on the old forums, even made some crappy doodles in paint. I'm glad to see this idea is still kicking around. I continue to like to see this in game.

 

[Firrion]

Ye. A pretty schematic ye got there.
Given that this would make turrets deadly instead of just useful, you got my support. So did anyone who posted this the first (boy, that was a while ago). Also for mostly aesthetic reasons, make turret AI always use only right mouse button fire. It's annoying when the shots don't go in a straight line from the barrel. Plus not much point in fully rotating otherwise.

 

[WaffulMann]

Ye. A pretty schematic ye got there.
Given that this would make turrets deadly instead of just useful, you got my support. So did anyone who posted this the first (boy, that was a while ago). Also for mostly aesthetic reasons, make turret AI always use only right mouse button fire. It's annoying when the shots don't go in a straight line from the barrel. Plus not much point in fully rotating otherwise.

That is something I have not thought of, an easy solution to all our turret-firing-broadside-go-home-you're-drunk problems.

 

[Firrion]

Should've made a suggestion thread, huh. Ah well. Yeah, it could solve a few problems. Would also make broadside static turrets impossible, but then again i've never seen anyone use those.

 

[XxDanclarke96xX]

As the title says, this has already been suggested, but I think not a lot of people understand the concept, so I'm going to explain the whole thing with a picture. I like pictures.
Will add more details (tracking, turret mainframes...)

Suggestion 1: Also, please fix turrets firing sideways. Just make the turrets right click instead of left click, please. :D

:D Aww yiss son! i believe you're referring to my "Dan's Big ol list o ideas" thread, in which i couldnt be arsed to make pics, thank you for getting the point across better than I.

 

[jayman38]

Should've made a suggestion thread, huh. Ah well. Yeah, it could solve a few problems. Would also make broadside static turrets impossible, but then again i've never seen anyone use those.

Static lateral guns aren't really useful in space combat. Generally, vessels are moving too quickly and are too far away for that one lucky shot, even if the guns have ~30 degree swivel off the axis. With the exception of neat "Roboteching* Missiles", effective lateral fire is limited to slow, scripted environments like TV and movies, where the filmmakers frequently hail back to old warships of the sea when setting up their combat scenes. Even in the original "Elite" video game, the lateral lasers went underutilized.

* http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Roboteching

 

[ltmauve]

As long as they share shields. I don't want the base getting wrecked.

 

[WaffulMann]

Update:

A few ideas and corrections:

 

[Firrion]

A single connector block (core like) or a few depending on the barrel size itself? Some barrels can be quite big.

 

[WaffulMann]

A single connector block (core like) or a few depending on the barrel size itself? Some barrels can be quite big.

Well a connector block CAN be placed wherever one wants, it just limits the rotation to a. collision and b. a plane. So in theory all it needs is one connector block as the rotation only needs one center of rotation; more and it gets stuck.

Although it might be a good idea to put 2 on one axis, since it doesn't get shot off that easily.

 

[Firrion]

Well a connector block CAN be placed wherever one wants, it just limits the rotation to a. collision and b. a plane. So in theory all it needs is one connector block as the rotation only needs one center of rotation; more and it gets stuck.

Although it might be a good idea to put 2 on one axis, since it doesn't get shot off that easily.

Makes sense. I imagined barrels would use a connector block instead of a core and attach in a same way turrets do to a ship. Except that their rotation is limited to vertical. Better yet to make turret also use a connector block instead of a core, except that one can only rotate horizontally. Then the same rules apply as they do on cores, and you can't place more than one on a barrel/turret base and it needs to be on the very bottom of it all (or at the back end in the case of barrel). Hope you understand what i mean.

 

[WaffulMann]

Makes sense. I imagined barrels would use a connector block instead of a core and attach in a same way turrets do to a ship. Except that their rotation is limited to vertical. Better yet to make turret also use a connector block instead of a core, except that one can only rotate horizontally. Then the same rules apply as they do on cores, and you can't place more than one on a barrel/turret base and it needs to be on the very bottom of it all (or at the back end in the case of barrel). Hope you understand what i mean.

I'm working on another picture.
EDIT: Here you go.

 

[Coke McCain]

I've been hoping for something like this to be implemented and this does a good job of illustrating the concept so nice work.

I think a good related change that could be made would be the ability to slave turrets to the main reticle while limiting all weapons to only firing strait ahead. Just making the change to turrets would feel inconsistent but it's definitely necessary for them to avoid those goofy sideways shooting moments.

 

[ltmauve]

Wait, do only connector blocks ignore collision? The entire barrel should ignore collisions. It's not like it would be any more powerful than turrets already are, and a small amount of clipping (IMO) should make a difference.

 

[Lenier]

Does the entire barrel really need to ignore collision? Actually, does the connector even need to? Just put the hinge at least one block above the turret base, or better yet, no need for a base at all!

On a different note:

Imagine this connected to logic, an opening hatch, and a long-armed piston. "Deploying short-range defense grid! Close blast doors!"
I love this

 

[WaffulMann]

Does the entire barrel really need to ignore collision? Actually, does the connector even need to? Just put the hinge at least one block above the turret base, or better yet, no need for a base at all!

On a different note:

Imagine this connected to logic, an opening hatch, and a long-armed piston. "Deploying short-range defense grid! Close blast doors!"
I love this

I'd imagine only the connector needs to?

Wait, do only connector blocks ignore collision? The entire barrel should ignore collisions. It's not like it would be any more powerful than turrets already are, and a small amount of clipping (IMO) should make a difference.

But then how are you going to calculate the angle limit in which the gun can elevate?

 

[ltmauve]

Maybe the size of your hinge determines how far it can rotate? I'd rather not have aesthetics limit a turret's field of fire. BTW, one hinge block should be enough for a small turret to rotate all the way up, while the Charon's main turret or anything of that scale would require a lot.