Just gonna leave this here...

[Neon_42]

Under what circumstances would I ever want weaker systems?

Maybe you want more than one kind of system, instead of one super powerful system?

 

[Jarraff]

Embrace your future!

I don't want to live in a universe where everyone flies a shake weight. I don't think anyone does.

 

[Zoolimar]

Maybe you want more than one kind of system, instead of one super powerful system?

How does having only half the power helps to have more systems? It's actually the other way around. If I have 2x power I can power 2 times more systems.

 

[Neon_42]

How does having only half the power helps to have more systems? It's actually the other way around. If I have 2x power I can power 2 times more systems.

not if you have half as many blocks. If you pay attention to Ithrad and my post you'd notice that the availability of blocks goes down in the long and narrow case by about 1/3. supposing that you don't build outside the box of course. 2100 available vs 3300 available

 

[Snowtiger256]

Some of the build mode stats do still display errant data (as of dev .213).

Especially dimensions are shown incorrectly (the ship core is counted as 3x3x3, while all other blocks are 1x1x1, despite all blocks being physically the same size) and shield data is not consistent across the UI(the build info panel shows "new values", while build cursor tool tip and focus mode info panel are still showing "old values"). These are minor quibbles though, since they're not going to affect math that much.

I think these would be easily remedied, but there has been no fix for these for at least twenty builds back.

 

[therimmer96]

Embrace your future!

The USS double ended didlo!

 

[aceface]

View attachment 46561

 

[Code North]

It aint easy to come up with a system that makes people build pretty ships with dedicated subsystems, balances pvp
and makes sense.

so while i cant completly understand the thinking behind THIS system.. I can think of worse.
They already got my money (should have stuck to the demo, properbly) so i can only wait, see and prey they find
the holy grail before star citizen releases..

 

[JinM]

How the hell is this desirable?

EDIT: Volume/surface area calculations inaccurate due to dev build bug. Point still stands.

I get your point. But did you get the point of the update?

The goal was, that two comparable ship shapes can have some space inside them. So you don't have to stuff a ship up to the brim to make it equally good with a pvp oriented ship that has the same shape. The goal was not having two ships of the same mass or volume being equal. Shape. Dimenions. Not just volume. Take all into account.

If two ships now have the same dimensions, it's very likely, that they are matching in power and strength. And still they could be not equal, because one ship has other chamber and weapons specialisations.

An intersting question that just came to my mind is, how two ships with an equal power output can be the most unequal in combat. Not in an very inefficient way.

Where I want to go is, that maybe in the future we are not matching same mass or length sized ships against each other, but equally power outputting ships. But it might be most likely, that we are going to match same lengths (longest axis) as common denominator for matchups against each other.

 

[Comradecolonel]

I get your point. But did you get the point of the update?

I feel like you really don't get his point though. No matter what role I build a ship for I always want as much power as I can get. More power equals more damage, more shields, more thrust. I build a ship that doesn't maximize the stabilizer distance I will inherently have a bigger, heavier ship. Even if it is negligible (which it tends to not be) I still know I'm flying around in a ship that could be better.

The fact that we don't need to fill the entire hull with systems means that now the only limiting factor on systems is power. Everything starts with that.

I don't understand how this is so obvious to some but evades understanding by others. This is not a good system and worst case scenario I'd rather just have power 1.0 back for the time being. I realize that won't happen but that's my take.

 

[Calhoun]

So you don't have to stuff a ship up to the brim to make it equally good with a pvp oriented ship that has the same shape.

New power does absolutely jack all to prevent that.

 

[Lecic]

supposing that you don't build outside the box of course

Ah, the classic "if you follow my flawed hypothetical that only my idea would work in then my idea works perfectly!" strategy.

The box is unnecessary. It can 100% be ignored.

 

[DoomCarrot]

I don't really get why we need a new power system to begin with? Never before in my time playing have I sat back and said "wow the power system really sucks I wish it worked differently."

And I have never seen any other players say that in-game either.

Now all old ships will be obsolete, everyone is going to have to learn a new system, and it just makes less overall sense in general...

Meanwhile planets, homebase, npc factions, faction conflict, quests, etc seem to not really be developed upon, which are things that would actually make the game more fun if perfected.

I can be educated, I am but a simple noob. Someone please do so lol

 

[JinM]

So you don't have to stuff a ship up to the brim to make it equally good with a pvp oriented ship that has the same shape.

New power does absolutely jack all to prevent that.

How does the new power prevent, that two ships of the same dimensions (having the same length on the longest axis), one built for pvp, and the other with rp intend with a bit of interior, prevent that? And when you explain it to me, you can or maybe don't have to, take away docked stuff, so it's easier to make it comprehensible to me.

I mean I can build for rp, and still aim for the maximum power now. Because now my rp ship being just as long as the pvp-ship of my opponent, can do so. That was not possible with the old power...

 

[Lecic]

So you don't have to stuff a ship up to the brim to make it equally good with a pvp oriented ship that has the same shape.

I don't know why RPers continue to push this meme.

Dimensions mean nothing.

Balance should be based off mass and build costs. Why would you want to balance off of dimensions when there is so much variation in the size and shape of ships? A ship that weighs half as much as another ship with identical dimensions SHOULD BE WEAKER. It has fewer systems. This makes perfect logical sense to anyone who isn't trying to justify that their RP boat that's mostly empty space should be as good as a well designed PvP ship, except that those RPers don't realize that what's good for the goose is good for the gander, and you will end up with even more powerful PvP ships, because they can spread their dimensions out as far as they want because a continuous hull doesn't matter. And now you've got a delicious spaghetti and meatball dinner flying around.

 

[Dire Venom]

I don't know why RPers continue to push this meme.

Dimensions mean nothing.

Balance should be based off mass and build costs. Why would you want to balance off of dimensions when there is so much variation in the size and shape of ships? A ship that weighs half as much as another ship with identical dimensions SHOULD BE WEAKER. It has fewer systems. This makes perfect logical sense to anyone who isn't trying to justify that their RP boat that's mostly empty space should be as good as a well designed PvP ship, except that those RPers don't realize that what's good for the goose is good for the gander, and you will end up with even more powerful PvP ships, because they can spread their dimensions out as far as they want because a continuous hull doesn't matter. And now you've got a delicious spaghetti and meatball dinner flying around.

So true.
The only cost of large ships (multi servers) simply seems to be how long you can put up with watching paint dry mining.
There seems to be 0 reason to try and make anything smaller (until drone swarms become easier to handel, and even then they take a lot more effort). Also, working on from what you've said just about every pvp ship could have decour and interiors added on at very little performance cost. The only reason that "RP" ships are not compedative is because they choose not to be, or simply don't care for that function (which is perfectly fine).

The new charging mechanic still doesn't work for me, I felt the power gen/storage synergized much better and worked well as a game mechanic (other than the subsaquent chain docking which became standed practice).
I dislike how a ships dimesions are still somewhat dictated by stabilizors, they only serve to annoy builders in my view.

 

[JinM]

I don't know why RPers continue to push this meme.

Dimensions mean nothing.

Balance should be based off mass and build costs. Why would you want to balance off of dimensions when there is so much variation in the size and shape of ships? A ship that weighs half as much as another ship with identical dimensions SHOULD BE WEAKER. It has fewer systems. This makes perfect logical sense to anyone who isn't trying to justify that their RP boat that's mostly empty space should be as good as a well designed PvP ship, except that those RPers don't realize that what's good for the goose is good for the gander, and you will end up with even more powerful PvP ships, because they can spread their dimensions out as far as they want because a continuous hull doesn't matter. And now you've got a delicious spaghetti and meatball dinner flying around.

A ship that weighs half as much as another ship with identical dimensions SHOULD BE WEAKER. It has fewer systems.
Yeah I think that's just logical. The new system allows this.

Balance should be based off mass and build costs. (Dimensions mean nothing)
So you are okay with fighting any dimension, and shape of ship, as long as it has the same mass or build cost? You tell me, that you enjoy fighting against any ship regardless of any stupid shape and size you can think of? For example doom bricks, spagetti and long ass sticks?

 

[Lecic]

So you are okay with fighting any dimension, and shape of ship, as long as it has the same mass or build cost? You tell me, that you enjoy fighting against any ship regardless of any stupid shape and size you can think of?

Yes? Why would I care if my opponent's ship has a weird shape as long as it's balanced?

doom bricks,

Not even remotely good since the HP update. Huge flat surface area means they take huge damage from explosions, and cubes are only slightly more efficient in turn speed while have no other advantages. I realize you're trying to make a "WELL THESE THINGS ARE OVERPOWERED SO WE NEED TO BALANCE BY DIMENSIONS" argument, but that kind of falls flat when you post an example that isn't even remotely op.

spagetti, and long ass sticks?

Spaghetti is unbalanced because it is extremely strong for its mass. If spaghetti ships were exactly as strong as a normal ship on a per mass basis, I don't think it would matter very much if they looked like that. But they're not balanced.

 

[Calhoun]

So you are okay with fighting any dimension, and shape of ship, as long as it has the same mass or build cost?

I mean, if I'm fighting it I'm trying to literally melt the face off it, so uhhh

 

[JinM]

Yes? Why would I care if my opponent's ship has a weird shape as long as it's balanced?

Well I rather fight with style.

edit: do we really have to do this funny rating stuff? Feels kinda like you don't want to talk.