Disable Ion/overdrive effect for lock ons

[Jaaskinal]

My goal of this suggestion is longer and more tactical titan engagements, Take an example I had where I was blown up in less then 15 sec by a guy with another titan, I hardly had time to see him and lock onto him before he basically had my shields down.

If your suggestion or any other for that matter fixs the current oneshot shields down one more shot dead issue with titans I'll be willing to support it
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Cannons where useful for energy regen based ships, I.E Generator carriers.

It likely wouldn't be that extreme, but it would be a slight bit better. Right now all ships die over 50% structure HP, it's just that smaller ships die at something like 50.01% structure hp, and larger ships die at higher percentages. I've never particularly kept track of what percent certain size ships die at, but it can get to be fairly high.

That being said though, it sounds slightly like you may not have had the necessary defenses to deal with his attack. I can't be sure though, I don't know the ships at all.

 

[Zackey_TNT]

It likely wouldn't be that extreme, but it would be a slight bit better. Right now all ships die over 50% structure HP, it's just that smaller ships die at something like 50.01% structure hp, and larger ships die at higher percentages. I've never particularly kept track of what percent certain size ships die at, but it can get to be fairly high.

That being said though, it sounds slightly like you may not have had the necessary defenses to deal with his attack. I can't be sure though, I don't know the ships at all.

He was breaching the rules to have 2x the firepower over a limit ship via docked drones, And our shields can't repel firepower of that magnitude!.

But it makes the point, These 1 million block titans with shit tons of shields go down to easy, I feel like the death of a titan should be much more slow at least as slow as a fighter's death for god's sake.

Delay the death of the bigger ships, I'll be happy.

 

[Lecic]

My goal of this suggestion is longer and more tactical titan engagements, Take an example I had where I was blown up in less then 15 sec by a guy with another titan, I hardly had time to see him and lock onto him before he basically had my shields down.

But it makes the point, These 1 million block titans with shit tons of shields go down to easy, I feel like the death of a titan should be much more slow at least as slow as a fighter's death for god's sake.

Why are you complaining about missile/beam/ion? That's not even the best alpha shield weapon in the game.

How many shields are you talking about? I've see 1 million block titans all the way from 220 shields to 100mil+.

 

[Zackey_TNT]

Why are you complaining about missile/beam/ion? That's not even the best alpha shield weapon in the game.

How many shields are you talking about? I've see 1 million block titans all the way from 220 shields to 100mil+.

More then the other guy, He had less then normal. Missile beam ion is commonly used to shield targets and has a huge ahpla strike.

 

[Lecic]

More then the other guy, He had less then normal. Missile beam ion is commonly used to shield targets and has a huge ahpla strike.

Again- missile/beam/ion is possibly the worst choice of ion alpha. It has inferior alpha length compared to beam/pulse/ion, does piss-poor amounts of damage if it hits, say, an antenna, and can be shot down. Even assuming you're using a large number of outputs, you're wasting space on more power caps and are decreasing your total damage due to at least SOME of the missiles getting shot down. Even assuming you've got decoy swarmers, beam/pulse/ion is still a better choice.

 

[Zackey_TNT]

Again- missile/beam/ion is possibly the worst choice of ion alpha. It has inferior alpha length compared to beam/pulse/ion, does piss-poor amounts of damage if it hits, say, an antenna, and can be shot down. Even assuming you're using a large number of outputs, you're wasting space on more power caps and are decreasing your total damage due to at least SOME of the missiles getting shot down. Even assuming you've got decoy swarmers, beam/pulse/ion is still a better choice.

Missile beam goes 1100 m/s.. Pulse is 100% guaranteed to be shot down.

Also, WTF are you smoking? pulse takes more power is slower and does larger damage

 

[Kilim]

My suggestion is to start disabling certain combos, For example Missile plus beam can no longer use overdrive or Ion.

The reason for the suggested changes is that when you give a weapon that already has a nasty alpha strike such as missiles a 2x damage bonus to their base damage (in this case this would only be against shields since ion) the effect can effectively nullify shielding and its use on the battlefield.

And in other cases overdrive is used as a doomsday weapon able to shield and overheat a target in one shot (or volley) The aim of these changes would to delay combat to allow for more advanced and tactical play such as outflanking or rebinding of weapons mid combat.

This hopefully would promote more enjoyable combat with more focus on strategy rather than who fires first and who has the biggest weapons.

Currently the conflict ends so quickly due to high damage weapons that none of this play is possible.

I believe this to be the reason people enjoy lower end ships such as cruisers for pvp, Due to taking more time to kill one another the tactical side of things is likely to be there more as we have more time to out maneuver targets.

Without missiles as a primary method of shielding a target cannon plus cannon would take its place, However missiles still have one big advantage over cannons, They can hull (Overheat) targets faster than a cannon can. So missiles would turn into the go to choice for overheating someone once their shields are down.

Missile plus damage paulse would still have ion effect enabled leading to the advantage of massive alpha strike but its much more costly and is likely to be shot down by AMS.

These are just some of the many many many combinations that you can do in order to better balance combat and add more strategy.

But for this post I suggest missile plus beam no longer have access to ion. Possibly overdrive but this is less common.

Dude missiles are already shit enough with the way damage is neglected by the way they explode, let alone using ion effect, nerfing even more is completely unecessary because they can anyway be half of the time exploded by point defence. .

 

[Lecic]

Missile beam goes 1100 m/s.. Pulse is 100% guaranteed to be shot down.

Also, WTF are you smoking? pulse takes more power is slower and does larger damage

I wasn't aware you could shoot down beams.

 

[Zackey_TNT]

I wasn't aware you could shoot down beams.

I read you post as missile pulse. My apologies.

Still, Beam is range limited and doesn't aim correctly with ai it also does less damage to armor.

Missile ion does upfront damage like beam however we also take into account the fact that missile beam is a no aim required weapon.

Like i've already said if you have a better idea of how to extend combat for the larger ships let me know.

 

[Zekester81]

Maybe change your build to counter. And if you say he was breaching rules, you should take that up with the server owner. You could also create drones and seed your area in places with them to give you more warning.

 

[Nauvran]

I read you post as missile pulse. My apologies.

Still, Beam is range limited and doesn't aim correctly with ai it also does less damage to armor.

Missile ion does upfront damage like beam however we also take into account the fact that missile beam is a no aim required weapon.

Like i've already said if you have a better idea of how to extend combat for the larger ships let me know.

I thought this was about damage dealt to shields not armour. So beams as a weapon against shields should be fine with the penalty against armour.

Beams are hitscan, basically easier to hit with than lockon missiles, since the lockon tends to reset if another nav icon interferes.

 

[Zackey_TNT]

I thought this was about damage dealt to shields not armour. So beams as a weapon against shields should be fine with the penalty against armour.

Beams are hitscan, basically easier to hit with than lockon missiles, since the lockon tends to reset if another nav icon interferes.

I see.
Yeah, i'm parting starting to agree that there might be a better way of doing it.

As i've already mentioned shields went down pretty fast so we might consider buffing per cap block shield cap?
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Maybe change your build to counter. And if you say he was breaching rules, you should take that up with the server owner. You could also create drones and seed your area in places with them to give you more warning.

My build was set to counter him, I've already taken it to the owner and he has defined the rules better.

Its not the point of if I won or not or my ship is at fault its the point of, at least at higher tiered ships, shields go down faster then your hull does.

 

[Lecic]

it also does less damage to armor.

Yes, but we're discussing shield damage here, so that doesn't matter.

Missile/Beam requires just as much aiming as Beam/Pulse. They both need to be on your screen. And with beams being hitscan and the beam range issues being fixed, it's hard to miss.

Not saying Missile/Beam/Ion doesn't have its uses. Beam/Pulse/Ion is just way better for almost everything, is all. And if you think Missile/Beam/Ion should be removed, well, so should Beam/Pulse/Ion, according to your logic.

 

[Ithirahad]

I wonder if taking away the system size damage penalty would help with that. It probably wouldn't fix it, but it wouldn't impact small ships, but would extend the time that larger ships are not overheating.

It would definitely impact smaller ships trying to beat larger ships... Very very counterproductive.

 

[Zackey_TNT]

It would definitely impact smaller ships trying to beat larger ships... Very very counterproductive.

Why should a fighter be able to take down a titan? Why should a cruiser stand a chance against a battleship? While in real life they do have a chance this is space and its a block game, Just like any other block game its whoever has more blocks that wins

 

[Nauvran]

Why should a fighter be able to take down a titan? Why should a cruiser stand a chance against a battleship? While in real life they do have a chance this is space and its a block game, Just like any other block game its whoever has more blocks that wins

Specialized anti shield bombers maybe? would make sense.

On another not the other weapon combos can bring shields down just as well as missiles+beam can. No big difference really.

 

[Zackey_TNT]

Yes, but we're discussing shield damage here, so that doesn't matter.

Missile/Beam requires just as much aiming as Beam/Pulse. They both need to be on your screen. And with beams being hitscan and the beam range issues being fixed, it's hard to miss.

Not saying Missile/Beam/Ion doesn't have its uses. Beam/Pulse/Ion is just way better for almost everything, is all. And if you think Missile/Beam/Ion should be removed, well, so should Beam/Pulse/Ion, according to your logic.

I honestly, Don't think they should be removed anymore, due to the discussion we've had here.

I do believe however that high tier ship combat does not last long enough

 

[Ithirahad]

Why should a fighter be able to take down a titan? Why should a cruiser stand a chance against a battleship? While in real life they do have a chance this is space and its a block game, Just like any other block game its whoever has more blocks that wins

I never said a fighter. Without the HP system penalty thing, large ships would probably just outlast fighter wings and whatnot.

I still believe weapons should scale on a curve...

 

[Zackey_TNT]

Specialized anti shield bombers maybe? would make sense.

On another not the other weapon combos can bring shields down just as well as missiles+beam can. No big difference really.

So you are saying that a freaking 12K block ship should totally be able to go up against a titan, Sure if you had like 40 of them but one? no.

 

[Lecic]

As i've already mentioned shields went down pretty fast so we might consider buffing per cap block shield cap?

I think rather than increasing the cap, the downward curve on shield caps should be lowered. Not fully removed, as it has its balance purposes. Most small ships can't support enough power caps to power a properly powerful alpha weapon, without sacrificing on things like shields. Due to how caps work, though, it's much easier for big ships to mount bigger alpha weapons.