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- Dec 31, 2013
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My cockpit for a fighter may be 1 block wide and 2-3 blocks long.
But "good Shuttles" already require 5-7 blocks wide and 5-7 blocks long cockpits and double-wall or slabs and heavy shuttles have even more space for crew along that bigger cockpit and considerable more cargo capacity of 1/2 that volume usually.
Best CC example is here: https://starmadedock.net/content/puddle-jumper-fat.1238/
For reference, it's rear is 9 long, door 3m, cockpig 5m before and 2-3m after glass font
Totals in 11+6 width, about 21 length and 8 height. 28 weapon blocks and about 200+ hull mass.
Classified a 17-8-21 craft ((btw still outdated power system but free license))
For all I build beyond, they are either out-of-scale or use this multiplied by 2,3,5,8,13 when we want to honour PHI and 2,4,6,8,12 when we want to honour other scales:
This shuttle being 200+ mass with almostly std.armor would be aproximately 200k mass if it were 200m long. This is why 12/13 means an end to any sort of mass production.
Flagships may well use 16/21 scale, titans go to 32/34, dreadnoughts to 48/55/64.
But I really don't expect them to use scale for other things as to get an easy shape to build around.
______Examples of small ship sizes_______
7x7x11 "small minimal size" = 98+4*63 hull blocks = 350 hull blocks = about 12/50/75 mass.
11-7-15m "small container size" = 570 blocks = 28/85/142 mass (basic, standard, adv.).
17x9x25 "small optimal size" = 738 hull blocks (one layer) = about 37/110/185 mass.
23x15x31 "small hangar size" = almost 2700 hull blocks (one layer) = about 135/405/675 mass.
.
Full volume basic makes roughly 30 /60 /190 /535 mass and 5x that if it's heavy armor - in reality the mass is expected to be less. Perhaps hull-box weight plus half to twice of that.
I mostly use hull, coat it in standard armor and either slab a bit extra hull on it for deco, make a second standard layer, or if I really need hp, only then I put advanced armor on it where I can reason it.
___ which craft you may expect to come up from me ___
The "small minimal size" is for all craft that exceeds power and thrust slabbed to a core.
Most light variants of ships will be build for 9-7-15 and 11-8-15, rarely up to 11-9-25.
Usual variants will be mostly within 17x9x25. Some parts can extend to a 19x11x27 box.
Heavy small crafts will be 23x15x31 and not extend further.
Containers will be 11-7-15 and 23-15-31. Rails will be in low x-centre for 11-7-15 version, USD/rails 3m away from box-edge and 23-15-31 duplicates rails.
Small hangars will be 23-15-31 or bigger.
______Examples of medium ship sizes________
Bigger ships repeat it that for 2x, 3x, 4x, 6x, 8x size, but then with an 2x2x2 or 3x3x3 armor equivalent.
2x uses 2x2x2 armor and no hangar.
3x uses 2x2x2 armor and has small hangars with 23-15-31 size. Amount depends, but they should be equally strong/heavy as 8 small craft, not 27 and utilize a more free shape instead.
Usual ship sizes I set my goal to are 35-19-51 and 51-27-75.
______Goals for future large ship sizes_________
(( 69-37-101+ will probably fit few small hangars only and I'll build the shape with 4x4x4 copied cubes before polishing. I don't plan to use that scale. ))
A shape exactly 85-45-125 will have huge advantages in how it's build and designed.
It's like going from SpaceEngineer's small blocks to big blocks.
It can be built 1/5 sized and if happy, built big with a hologram of itself on a table within.
There will be armor classes between 0.5, 0.8, and 1.3 mass per square metre, consisting of 1 basic layer for decoration and (5 basic, 3 standard) for scavengers, (5 standard, 3 advanced) for industrial and (5 advanced) for military.
Makeshift-things will mostly use "basic deco over 1x, 2x std or 1x adv" when they are experimental depending on what funding that research organisation has.
WIP: My current build is 60-65 inner, 80-90 outer radius with 220 length and uses "basic over standard" for being a fragile scafold of 11m thickness - mostly fitting a small ship.
______Goals for Headquarter ships__________
8x8x8 is a perfect scale for these. Fitting both 1-2-4-8 and 1-2-3-5-8.
It's not just about PHI. But building ships at 1x1x1 scale with 1 armor block, at 3x scale with 2, at 5x scale with 3-4, freedom increases.
At 8x scale, there is a break-point, like having to decide what u want: Scavenger, Industrial or Military.
Industrial designs use 1.4 to 1.6 mass in 7+1 to 8+3 standard + basic deco blocks.
Scavengers stick to a lower 0.65 mass in 4+1 standard + basic deco blocks.
Military would use 2.3 to 3.7 mass in 8+2 to 13+3 adv + std deco blocks.
Typcial masses would be 102'400 mass for something like an 8x scale puddle jumper shell and upward.
______Where Flagships, Titans, Dreadnoughts and Motherships reeign______
13x, 16x or 21x scale for Flagships/Titans = 400k / 800k / 1600k mass.
32x, 34x or 35x scale for bigger Titans / smaller Dreadnoughts = 3-4m mass.
55x to 64x scale (first is 34+21, second a power of 2) for DNs/Motherships/Deathstars = 12-32m+ mass.
______Idea: PHI-build-modules______
If you build rooms for PHI-ships, you will get sizes of 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34.
If a small ship has 3x5, the next bigger has 5x8, then 8x13, ...
You could simply rotate rooms, place 2 next to each other and get 8-10 with a neat 3x8 corridor.
But the biggest gain is to get something different to cubes. Starting with 5 heigh for floors, 8 heigh for industrial or hangar space with 2m internal floor and 13 heigh for hangar rooms it often gives what you need.
If a 5m heigh object goes into a 8 heigh room, you get 3m for floor, ceiling and slab decoration.
With 8m objects in a 13 room, 5 blocks can be double-floor, double-ceiling and even rail-addons on top.
With 13m objects in a 21 room, you can make 2m floor/ceiling, 1m rails and got 3m extra creativity space.
21m objects in 34m rooms lets you even make elevated dock places with some decorative cargo crates underneath.
I can only know if it is desireable when I try some builds with it.
Current WIP-build
But "good Shuttles" already require 5-7 blocks wide and 5-7 blocks long cockpits and double-wall or slabs and heavy shuttles have even more space for crew along that bigger cockpit and considerable more cargo capacity of 1/2 that volume usually.
Best CC example is here: https://starmadedock.net/content/puddle-jumper-fat.1238/
For reference, it's rear is 9 long, door 3m, cockpig 5m before and 2-3m after glass font
Totals in 11+6 width, about 21 length and 8 height. 28 weapon blocks and about 200+ hull mass.
Classified a 17-8-21 craft ((btw still outdated power system but free license))
For all I build beyond, they are either out-of-scale or use this multiplied by 2,3,5,8,13 when we want to honour PHI and 2,4,6,8,12 when we want to honour other scales:
This shuttle being 200+ mass with almostly std.armor would be aproximately 200k mass if it were 200m long. This is why 12/13 means an end to any sort of mass production.
Flagships may well use 16/21 scale, titans go to 32/34, dreadnoughts to 48/55/64.
But I really don't expect them to use scale for other things as to get an easy shape to build around.
______Examples of small ship sizes_______
7x7x11 "small minimal size" = 98+4*63 hull blocks = 350 hull blocks = about 12/50/75 mass.
11-7-15m "small container size" = 570 blocks = 28/85/142 mass (basic, standard, adv.).
17x9x25 "small optimal size" = 738 hull blocks (one layer) = about 37/110/185 mass.
23x15x31 "small hangar size" = almost 2700 hull blocks (one layer) = about 135/405/675 mass.
.
Full volume basic makes roughly 30 /60 /190 /535 mass and 5x that if it's heavy armor - in reality the mass is expected to be less. Perhaps hull-box weight plus half to twice of that.
I mostly use hull, coat it in standard armor and either slab a bit extra hull on it for deco, make a second standard layer, or if I really need hp, only then I put advanced armor on it where I can reason it.
___ which craft you may expect to come up from me ___
The "small minimal size" is for all craft that exceeds power and thrust slabbed to a core.
Most light variants of ships will be build for 9-7-15 and 11-8-15, rarely up to 11-9-25.
Usual variants will be mostly within 17x9x25. Some parts can extend to a 19x11x27 box.
Heavy small crafts will be 23x15x31 and not extend further.
Containers will be 11-7-15 and 23-15-31. Rails will be in low x-centre for 11-7-15 version, USD/rails 3m away from box-edge and 23-15-31 duplicates rails.
Small hangars will be 23-15-31 or bigger.
______Examples of medium ship sizes________
Bigger ships repeat it that for 2x, 3x, 4x, 6x, 8x size, but then with an 2x2x2 or 3x3x3 armor equivalent.
2x uses 2x2x2 armor and no hangar.
3x uses 2x2x2 armor and has small hangars with 23-15-31 size. Amount depends, but they should be equally strong/heavy as 8 small craft, not 27 and utilize a more free shape instead.
Usual ship sizes I set my goal to are 35-19-51 and 51-27-75.
______Goals for future large ship sizes_________
(( 69-37-101+ will probably fit few small hangars only and I'll build the shape with 4x4x4 copied cubes before polishing. I don't plan to use that scale. ))
A shape exactly 85-45-125 will have huge advantages in how it's build and designed.
It's like going from SpaceEngineer's small blocks to big blocks.
It can be built 1/5 sized and if happy, built big with a hologram of itself on a table within.
There will be armor classes between 0.5, 0.8, and 1.3 mass per square metre, consisting of 1 basic layer for decoration and (5 basic, 3 standard) for scavengers, (5 standard, 3 advanced) for industrial and (5 advanced) for military.
Makeshift-things will mostly use "basic deco over 1x, 2x std or 1x adv" when they are experimental depending on what funding that research organisation has.
WIP: My current build is 60-65 inner, 80-90 outer radius with 220 length and uses "basic over standard" for being a fragile scafold of 11m thickness - mostly fitting a small ship.
______Goals for Headquarter ships__________
8x8x8 is a perfect scale for these. Fitting both 1-2-4-8 and 1-2-3-5-8.
It's not just about PHI. But building ships at 1x1x1 scale with 1 armor block, at 3x scale with 2, at 5x scale with 3-4, freedom increases.
At 8x scale, there is a break-point, like having to decide what u want: Scavenger, Industrial or Military.
Industrial designs use 1.4 to 1.6 mass in 7+1 to 8+3 standard + basic deco blocks.
Scavengers stick to a lower 0.65 mass in 4+1 standard + basic deco blocks.
Military would use 2.3 to 3.7 mass in 8+2 to 13+3 adv + std deco blocks.
Typcial masses would be 102'400 mass for something like an 8x scale puddle jumper shell and upward.
______Where Flagships, Titans, Dreadnoughts and Motherships reeign______
13x, 16x or 21x scale for Flagships/Titans = 400k / 800k / 1600k mass.
32x, 34x or 35x scale for bigger Titans / smaller Dreadnoughts = 3-4m mass.
55x to 64x scale (first is 34+21, second a power of 2) for DNs/Motherships/Deathstars = 12-32m+ mass.
______Idea: PHI-build-modules______
If you build rooms for PHI-ships, you will get sizes of 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34.
If a small ship has 3x5, the next bigger has 5x8, then 8x13, ...
You could simply rotate rooms, place 2 next to each other and get 8-10 with a neat 3x8 corridor.
But the biggest gain is to get something different to cubes. Starting with 5 heigh for floors, 8 heigh for industrial or hangar space with 2m internal floor and 13 heigh for hangar rooms it often gives what you need.
If a 5m heigh object goes into a 8 heigh room, you get 3m for floor, ceiling and slab decoration.
With 8m objects in a 13 room, 5 blocks can be double-floor, double-ceiling and even rail-addons on top.
With 13m objects in a 21 room, you can make 2m floor/ceiling, 1m rails and got 3m extra creativity space.
21m objects in 34m rooms lets you even make elevated dock places with some decorative cargo crates underneath.
I can only know if it is desireable when I try some builds with it.
Current WIP-build
