Steady framerate loss with each update.

    Winterhome

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    Basic relevant hardware rundown:

    Intel Xeon L5420 2.5GHz
    Intel Xeon L5420 2.5GHz
    16gb DDR2 RAM
    500gb SSD
    Nvidia GT 520


    For the past several updates, running back to even before the Thruster Plume and frame buffer update, I've been steadily losing framerate with each patch - including during patches where no tweaks to the render code have been listed in the changelog.

    Until fairly recently, it's been livable. The NPC update, however, has severely slashed my framerate while looking at ships. Where I was able to once get 24 FPS looking at a 500 meter, 200k mass ship, in this update, I'm getting only 10.

    An empty shell of a station with a handful of empty ship shells that shouldn't be this hard on my GPU is also causing me to render at 5FPS, where I would easily have gotten 20 just a couple patches ago.

    I already have texture quality set to 64x64, have framebuffer and AA turned off, and am running at 1280x720. Any ideas on how to make Starmade even remotely playable again?
     
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    Can you replace your video card? The GT520 was a weak card even when released 5 years ago.
     

    Winterhome

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    Can you replace your video card? The GT520 was a weak card even when released 5 years ago.
    Not an option. What I'm trying to figure out is why my performance has gotten so weak over the past several months, despite very few updates that had anything to do with rendering whatsoever.

    It's at the point where some Intel chips from several years ago are about to start outperforming me.
     

    Sachys

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    I already have texture quality set to 64x64, have framebuffer and AA turned off, and am running at 1280x720. Any ideas on how to make Starmade even remotely playable again?
    Whats your view distance / block rendering setting (forget the correct term) - try adjusting it a little and see how you go.
     
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    What is your CPUs load ? ... especially single core ... when running SM.
    because the CPU isnt that new either .. 8 years old now.
     
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    I've noticed this issue too with an Intel i7 2600 CPU and a Radeon HD 6450 GPU, with 8 GB of DDR3 RAM. My FPS passed the point of unplayability about a month ago, after the latest optimization pass (the irony, right?).
     
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    Did you alt-tab out at any point? I notice if I alt-tab out of the game to do something with a web browser, the game's FPS permanently drops to 1 - 5 when it regains focus and I have to restart the game.
     
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    Intel Xeon L5420 2.5GHz
    16gb DDR2 RAM
    500gb SSD
    Nvidia GT 520
    Your hardware is fine and should give you more than enough fps. The only weak point is the GT 520 which can not display some of StarMades more enhanced graphics. You should run the game with as little eye candy as possible.

    Try playing with shadows off. And set asteroids to be small in the server.cfg Use basic textures and not any other texture option.

    server.cfg

    ASTEROID_RADIUS_MAX = 1 //Asteroid max radius in blocks (from -x to +x)

    Intel Xeon L5420 is a quad core cpu set this line to use 3 cores if the machine only has to deal with StarMade.

    CHUNK_REQUEST_THREAD_POOL_SIZE_CPU = 3 //Available threads of total for CPU generation. WARNING: too high can cause cpu spikes. About the amount of available cores minus one is best

    What is missing here is some background info on how you play the game leading to gues work.

    Is this playing as a single player?
    If so.
    Do you play an old map that has been updated with every new patch?
    If so.
    Did you try starting a fresh new map?
    If so.
    What are the server.cfg settings? "this applies even if you play single as single is just a local server"
     

    Winterhome

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    Your hardware is fine and should give you more than enough fps. The only weak point is the GT 520 which can not display some of StarMades more enhanced graphics. You should run the game with as little eye candy as possible.

    Try playing with shadows off. And set asteroids to be small in the server.cfg Use basic textures and not any other texture option.
    Shadows off.
    AA off.
    Normalmaps off.
    Framebuffer off.
    Vsync off.


    server.cfg

    ASTEROID_RADIUS_MAX = 1 //Asteroid max radius in blocks (from -x to +x)

    Intel Xeon L5420 is a quad core cpu set this line to use 3 cores if the machine only has to deal with StarMade.

    CHUNK_REQUEST_THREAD_POOL_SIZE_CPU = 3 //Available threads of total for CPU generation. WARNING: too high can cause cpu spikes. About the amount of available cores minus one is best
    What is missing here is some background info on how you play the game leading to gues work.

    Is this playing as a single player?
    If so.
    Do you play an old map that has been updated with every new patch?
    If so.
    Did you try starting a fresh new map?
    If so.
    What are the server.cfg settings? "this applies even if you play single as single is just a local server"
    Singleplayer and multiplayer, problem is the same in each.

    I have an old world that I update with each patch, but I have been using a new world with the NPC Factions this most recent patch.

    server.cfg is all default except for:
    Increased build area size (10 to 400)
    Sector size (default to 10km)



    What is your CPUs load ? ... especially single core ... when running SM.
    because the CPU isnt that new either .. 8 years old now.
    While looking at the entities in question:


    While looking into empty space:





    Anyhow, further updates: I've narrowed down the issue to a specific part of the architecture of the station and accompanying ships.
    The problem seems to be exclusively coming from empty cargo space.

    Why are we still rendering every single cargo block? We're looking at 12 tris per each block here, and every single one of them is rendered no matter what.
     
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    Sector size (default to 10km)
    The larger sector will be hard on the GT 520 from a render point. CPU wise since you even have eight cores it should not be an issue. The GT 520 does seam like an odd card to pair up to so much processor muscle. You dismissed Mr. Steam advice to update it. But even a cheap end graphic card like the GT 520 but with a more modern instruction set would help out.

    The problem seems to be exclusively coming from empty cargo space.
    I agree here. I am not at all happy how cargo exists in the game. The fact that you have to add real blocks to increase storage is the biggest headache. Why can this not be virtual? It is only a graphic gimmick and made all my stuff larger. Because of the amount of cargo blocks needed to expand my storage. The amount of cargo blocks that exist on a multiplayer map is staggering. If you come from a time when the same thing could be achieved with no added blocks then that feels wasteful.

    Server owners "you to" can get around this a bit by changing the Cargo Modules or Storage Chests to hold way more then the default block values.
     

    Winterhome

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    The larger sector will be hard on the GT 520 from a render point. CPU wise since you even have eight cores it should not be an issue. The GT 520 does seam like an odd card to pair up to so much processor muscle. You dismissed Mr. Steam advice to update it. But even a cheap end graphic card like the GT 520 but with a more modern instruction set would help out.
    I have a 750Ti lying around which won't work because I'm running a rack mount server. Apparently old Dell PowerEdge based systems don't have PCIe slots up to standard and are capped at 25W for any kind of card, though I'm not able to find anything about power caps in the manuals for any model.

    The GT 520 is pretty much the only thing I have available that I'm able to use, given the extreme limits on power availability.
     
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    Nvidia GT 730 specifications

    Nvidia has the GT 730 GDDR5 listed as max 25W. If it is to big for the slot then a GT 720 could be an option.

    I have a 750Ti lying around
    I am using the 750Ti myself because of it's low power use. But 60w is still to much for your 25w pci-e slot.

    If you are brave then there are posts about undervolting the 750Ti. If the systems boots with the card installed then you could give it a try. Just google for undervolt 750Ti. It is not without risks to the card though.
     
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    Winterhome

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    Nvidia GT 730 specifications

    Nvidia has the GT 730 GDDR5 listed as max 25W. If it is to big for the slot then a GT 720 could be an option.



    I am using the 750Ti myself because of it's low power use. But 60w is still to much for your 25w pci-e slot.

    If you are brave then there are posts about undervolting the 750Ti. If the systems boots with the card installed then you could give it a try. Just google for undervolt 750Ti. It is not without risks to the card though.

    Aye, the system boots with the card installed, but I only get a display on my monitor if I go through the motherboard's VGA output instead. I'll see if I can't try to get this thing down to 25W or so. Thanks for the suggestion - I had no idea it was even possible.
     

    kupu

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    Looks like you've got all the rights settings on the lowest, but have you turned texture compression on?
    I doubt it would be a wonder cure, but it will help.

    Code:
    G_TEXTURE_COMPRESSION_BLOCKS = true
    in the Settings.cfg file.
     

    Winterhome

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    Looks like you've got all the rights settings on the lowest, but have you turned texture compression on?
    I doubt it would be a wonder cure, but it will help.

    Code:
    G_TEXTURE_COMPRESSION_BLOCKS = true
    in the Settings.cfg file.
    Aye, I've got it on. SM always looked weird with it disabled.
     

    DukeofRealms

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    This isn't going to help and you're not going to want to hear this...

    But, you shouldn't even be able to run StarMade on a GT 520, it's nowhere near minimum requirements (and I mean not even close), let alone recommended requirements.

    Your CPU doesn't meet recommended requirements and its sort of on the line for minimum.

    There's not a lot that can be done for your system, especially as we focus on larger updates. It's one of the lower end systems I've ever heard someone playing on. Hopefully some optimisation rounds will help.
     

    Winterhome

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    But, you shouldn't even be able to run StarMade on a GT 520, it's nowhere near minimum requirements (and I mean not even close), let alone recommended requirements.

    This is very strange, I think, considering that I generally do just fine in battles between ships upwards of 1mil blocks, with around 3mil blocks total onscreen. It seems that it's mostly cargo blocks that are causing problems.

    But yeah, I suspect it's time I completely swap out my entire machine.
     
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    But, you shouldn't even be able to run StarMade on a GT 520, it's nowhere near minimum requirements (and I mean not even close), let alone recommended requirements.

    Your CPU doesn't meet recommended requirements and its sort of on the line for minimum.

    He could run a hefty StarMade server with his hardware. It is not about how much GHz a processor or graphicscard has. Two quad core Xeon processors are more than enough "overkill" for a single player game. I run StarMade on a AMD Athlon II X2 240E 45w processor with the 750Ti and get 60 fps "Vsync on". I even downgraded from an unlocked AMD Phenom II X3 720 Black Edition to save on the energy bill. StarMade will run on onboard graphics if the instruction set is up to date.

    StarMade does not run on the Intel HD onboard graphics and that is a real shame. It is mostly because of the game use of shaders that can not be turned off. Azereiah's GT 520 at least supports the shaders and therefore the game loads for him. You would be able to reach out to many more people if StarMade supported the Intel HD IGP.

    Right now i use a Core I5 laptop that would run StarMade flawless if not for the Intel HD Graphics. Laptops of this kind would make excellent servers because of the low power they consume. Not to mention there dirt cheap price second hand. Laptops that use anything other then the Intel IGP are rare or very expensive.

    My experience to date is that StarMade is all done on the CPU. The graphicscard is only used to color in the squares. Yes you get much more fps and more eye candy with a beefy graphicscard but it say its needed? No.
     

    DukeofRealms

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    He could run a hefty StarMade server with his hardware. It is not about how much GHz a processor or graphicscard has. Two quad core Xeon processors are more than enough "overkill" for a single player game. I run StarMade on a AMD Athlon II X2 240E 45w processor with the 750Ti and get 60 fps "Vsync on". I even downgraded from an unlocked AMD Phenom II X3 720 Black Edition to save on the energy bill. StarMade will run on onboard graphics if the instruction set is up to date.
    There's a lot of misconceptions about server grade hardware, particularly with processors. The difference between Xeons and desktop grade CPUs are that they are built to run 24/7, under stress without failure. They run at lower voltages and temperatures. Performance wise, they are almost always identical (where it matters for a desktop). Xeons are incredibly reliable, which is a necessity in servers. All StarMade sites run on server grade hardware, for example, caching services, search engines, web servers, content delivery networks and databases. All of these services are integral to StarMade online interaction; we need them available 24/7, and we don't want them to suddenly fail. This is why we use server grade hardware (as well as a number of other reasons, which are not relevant to this post). Similarly, if you were to run a StarMade server (not the client), you would generally opt for server grade hardware, as it's running 24/7. However, this isn't that important; I'd suggest desktop grade hardware if you're on a budget, as it will be cheaper and provide better performance for a lower price.

    That being said, server grade hardware is practically a waste of money for desktop usage particularly video games (there are instances where it makes sense, although that's not within the scope of this post). Desktops don't need to be running 24/7 (and being constantly used), they don't need (or use) the benefits this hardware provides. The price difference between server grade CPUs and the motherboards required to run them, compared to their desktop equivalents are quite large. The extra money spent on these components would be better spent on a better GPU, desktop grade CPU, motherboard, RAM, SSD and so on.

    Thank you for bringing up GHz, because this is another misconception. Additionally, while StarMade tries to utilise threads where it can, there is still major load on the main thread. What this means is you'll want a CPU with a high single thread performance, instead of just focusing on overall performance. StarMade singleplayer is just launching a local server and connecting to it, so this is also relevant for solo players. When selecting a CPU for StarMade, I suggest using this benchmark list PassMark CPU Benchmarks - Single Thread Performance

    Azereiah said:
    tbh most of schine doesn't know how the game works...See: DukeOfRealms telling me that my DUAL XEONS are below minimum recommended specs
    The recommended requirements CPU wise for StarMade is an Intel Core i7-2600 @ 3.4 GHz | AMD FX-8320 Eight-Core @ 3.5 GHz or equivalent. Yes, they are Xeons, which are simply a brand of microprocessors targeted for the server, workstation and embedded system market in production from 1998 to today. The title "Xeon" is no indication of the performance of the hardware.

    You can use the benchmark site I linked above to compare your specifications with the recommended requirements (higher rating, the better). How this value is calculated is described here: PassMark CPU Benchmarks - CPU Test Information

    Recommended requirements (CPU released in 2011)

    Your CPU (CPU released in 2008)

    Yes, you can run the game on lower specifications, you'll notice our minimum requirements are quite vague. However, the recommended requirements allow the player to experience StarMade as it was meant to be played. There are ways to get better performance out of lower-end hardware, for example, you can decrease a lot of CPU load by playing multiplayer instead of singleplayer.

    MINIMUM:
    • OS: Windows 7 - 64 bit
    • Processor: Intel Core i3 (2nd Generation and above) | AMD FX 6xxx or equivalent
    • Memory: 4 GB RAM
    • Graphics: Nvidia GeForce GTX 260, 275, 280, 460 SE, 550 Ti | AMD Radeon HD 4870, 5770, 4890, 5830, 6770, 6790 or equivalent with OpenGL 2.1
    • Network: Broadband Internet connection
    • Storage: 3 GB available space
    • Additional Notes: 2GB of memory must be available for StarMade. Lower specs may work by modifying graphics and other performance options. Try out our demo to get an indication for your system. System components such as Integrated Graphics cards may not be supported. Requirements may change in further updates.
    RECOMMENDED:
    • OS: Windows 7/8/10 - 64 bit
    • Processor: Intel Core i7-2600 @ 3.4 GHz | AMD FX-8320 Eight-Core @ 3.5 GHz or equivalent
    • Memory: 8 GB RAM
    • Graphics: Nvidia GeForce GTX 560, 650 Ti, 750 | AMD Radeon HD 5850, 6870, 7790 (or equivalent)
    • Network: Broadband Internet connection
    • Storage: 3 GB available space
    Now, for desktop, I'm not entirely sure how this works, but I'm fairly certain most applications (games) won't utilise more than one CPU, so your second Xeon provides no real benefit in that department. Even if a second CPU was being utilized, it would just be considered additional cores. As I mentioned above, StarMade's main thread deals with most of the load, so this also provides no (noticeable) benefit. If you're running web/backend services or a video editing workstation, the benefits server grade hardware and mutliple CPUs provide becomes apparent. Games aren't developed to provide these benefits.

    NB: If you’re running multiple processes, such as two StarMade servers, you’ll want to look at more cores and better mutli-core performance. However, that’s neither here nor there.

    For GPU benchmarking, PassMark also have this site: PassMark Software - Video Card (GPU) Benchmark Charts

    You can read how they calculate their video card benchmarks here: PassMark Software - Video Card Benchmarks - Video Card Test Information