StarMade News - November 9th 2015

[Criss]

When you say a "stack" do you mean a 1 cubic meter area of physical storage?

Stack as in what you can hold in each slot in your inventory. IIRC, the idea is that one cargo block would have a slot or multiple slots, just like your player inventory. Each slot can hold a stack of one particular block / material. There is a limit to the stack.

 

[GRHayes]

Summing this up leaves me with a question.

You plan on implementing a storage system attached to storage blocks. For each stack you will probably need one free space. So a 2x2x2 cube could store 8 stacks of material. That could be 8 stacks of 1 material or 8 stacks each different. Potentially that stack could be limited by mass or count from what has been said so far. The size of a storage could range in 3d space from 1x1x1 to XxXxX X being whatever size or limit you may put there.

That said each new cargo container that fills up that space will be a block and have mass. Thus now every single ship / space station ever made that has storage just became obsolete. Because now you have to account for the added block count and mass of the storage as well.

Don't get me wrong some aspects of this I like a great deal.

However this is going to mess with everything from power to shielding to you name it that relies or is tied to block count and mass.

Ships are going to have to be massive in a game that already is hard pressed for space because we don't have thin walls like in RL but here you are trying to add a feature into the game that in a way mimics RL to a moderate extent.

So my question would be what changes are we going to see to power, thrusters, shielding, Effects, jammers, cloaking... and all the other items that block count and mass is tied into to compensate for this change?

 

[therimmer96]

Summing this up leaves me with a question.

You plan on implementing a storage system attached to storage blocks. For each stack you will probably need one free space. So a 2x2x2 cube could store 8 stacks of material. That could be 8 stacks of 1 material or 8 stacks each different. Potentially that stack could be limited by mass or count from what has been said so far. The size of a storage could range in 3d space from 1x1x1 to XxXxX X being whatever size or limit you may put there.

That said each new cargo container that fills up that space will be a block and have mass. Thus now every single ship / space station ever made that has storage just became obsolete. Because now you have to account for the added block count and mass of the storage as well.

Don't get me wrong some aspects of this I like a great deal.

However this is going to mess with everything from power to shielding to you name it that relies or is tied to block count and mass.

Ships are going to have to be massive in a game that already is hard pressed for space because we don't have thin walls like in RL but here you are trying to add a feature into the game that in a way mimics RL to a moderate extent.

So my question would be what changes are we going to see to power, thrusters, shielding, Effects, jammers, cloaking... and all the other items that block count and mass is tied into to compensate for this change?

The idea of this system is to allow for dedicated freighters to have some value. A warship isn't a cargo ship, so changes to all that aren't needed. No single ship is supposed to be great at everything, and this is just a new way of increasing ship types, which is a good thing.

 

[GRHayes]

The idea of this system is to allow for dedicated freighters to have some value. A warship isn't a cargo ship, so changes to all that aren't needed. No single ship is supposed to be great at everything, and this is just a new way of increasing ship types, which is a good thing.

Even so it is still going to cause massive issues with those system even if you just create a freighter / cargo ship. The ship would end up so vulnerable it wouldn't be worth storing anything in without having an escort fleet with it. It would make single player impossible if they don't do something or did you forget there is supposed to be a single player side to this game also?

 

[Aynslei]

I have been very much looking forward to the cargo update. So I already have some concerns about the system on a larger scale.

Any changes to picking up loot clouds or stray items with a ship. (filling the players inventory will quickly become more of an issue)
Will shipyards get a reduced "deconstruct" rate and the ability to pause if they currently lack room? (Storing and sorting will be important here)
Will there be an option to have refineries linked directly to cargo areas? (Concerns about a packed refinery will lose items because of limited slots)

With cargo transfer planned to be implemented after the cargo implementation, I expect several issue to pop up in quality of life and broken designs until those options and functions are tied into cargo.

1) Rail based salvage systems will face issues when the designs don't have cargo space to facilitate a single cycle and will require far more player handling even when the designs have room to spare.
2) A lot of people want to build and use "crates" for loading and unloading cargo. However they will still need to wait another patch before finalizing designs on any type of shipping or trade containers and their docks.

It may just be me, but I would rather wait some extra weeks to get Cargo Transfer between rails along side the Cargo update, than just the Cargo update alone.

As far as anyone complaining about the coming needed changes. I am ECSTATIC that my 5*5*9 sorting area wont be able to move an ENTIRE home-base to a new location. As many have said, a war ship is not a cargo ship.

 

[BDLS]

150%-ish Starmade price increase? Hasn't growth already been slow? At least it seems like no new people in the community really pop up often.

That aside, the cargo system will be great. 216 gorillion Spaceshekel reward to whoever figures out how to item dupe via cargo first! Let's see that alchemy, starfriends!

 

[therimmer96]

150%-ish Starmade price increase? Hasn't growth already been slow? At least it seems like no new people in the community really pop up often.

It's only a 50% increase from $10 to $15.

However, wasn't $15 supposed to be the final price when we entered beta?

 

[godmars]

The ship would end up so vulnerable it wouldn't be worth storing anything in without having an escort fleet with it.

So like every freighter and cargo ship in science fiction ever?

 

[Ithirahad]

Summing this up leaves me with a question.

You plan on implementing a storage system attached to storage blocks. For each stack you will probably need one free space. So a 2x2x2 cube could store 8 stacks of material. That could be 8 stacks of 1 material or 8 stacks each different. Potentially that stack could be limited by mass or count from what has been said so far. The size of a storage could range in 3d space from 1x1x1 to XxXxX X being whatever size or limit you may put there.

That said each new cargo container that fills up that space will be a block and have mass. Thus now every single ship / space station ever made that has storage just became obsolete. Because now you have to account for the added block count and mass of the storage as well.

Don't get me wrong some aspects of this I like a great deal.

However this is going to mess with everything from power to shielding to you name it that relies or is tied to block count and mass.

Ships are going to have to be massive in a game that already is hard pressed for space because we don't have thin walls like in RL but here you are trying to add a feature into the game that in a way mimics RL to a moderate extent.

So my question would be what changes are we going to see to power, thrusters, shielding, Effects, jammers, cloaking... and all the other items that block count and mass is tied into to compensate for this change?

We won't. There's going to be a rough transition period for a few months, but with AI fleet control mechanics incoming it will be possible, in singleplayer or multiplayer, to have escort ships accompany and defend a cargo vessel. On a sidenote, I think this'll provide the main use for fighters ingame: Taking out larger non-mainline targets like support ships and freighters. That big, bad Power Drain vampire can pretty much freeze a larger ship, but good luck trying to take out a swarm of fighters flying all over the place.

 

[Krougal]

We won't. There's going to be a rough transition period for a few months, but with AI fleet control mechanics incoming it will be possible, in singleplayer or multiplayer, to have escort ships accompany and defend a cargo vessel. On a sidenote, I think this'll provide the main use for fighters ingame: Taking out larger non-mainline targets like support ships and freighters. That big, bad Power Drain vampire can pretty much freeze a larger ship, but good luck trying to take out a swarm of fighters flying all over the place.

Is that a given (fleet C&C) ? I admit I don't always keep up on what's going on. That would solve a lot of issues.

Why does everyone keep saying 1 stack per cargo cube? Devs haven't said that, stop giving them bad ideas. 1 stack is far too little (especially with size limits incoming). Also while they will take space, they don't need to have mass (nor should they really, since it's just reserving empty space....dunno why area triggers have mass either :p )

What ship systems take block count into consideration these days? I thought it was all about mass.

Yeah, loot pinatas....you guys really need to remove the invalid blocks (I'm looking at you 16 colors of useless dirt) from the loot tables with this update!

 

[GRHayes]

So like every freighter and cargo ship in science fiction ever?

Apparently you have a very limited exposure to science fiction.

 

[BDLS]

It's only a 50% increase from $10 to $15.

However, wasn't $15 supposed to be the final price when we entered beta?

DAWG you know i meant to say 150% of the current price.

FUKKEN FORUM CORRECTORS

edit: also its a pretty big jump

 

[godmars]

Apparently you have a very limited exposure to science fiction.

the ample and varied examples provided of said science fiction has utterly refuted me

 

[GRHayes]

We won't. There's going to be a rough transition period for a few months, but with AI fleet control mechanics incoming it will be possible, in singleplayer or multiplayer, to have escort ships accompany and defend a cargo vessel. On a sidenote, I think this'll provide the main use for fighters ingame: Taking out larger non-mainline targets like support ships and freighters. That big, bad Power Drain vampire can pretty much freeze a larger ship, but good luck trying to take out a swarm of fighters flying all over the place.

Even with fighter escort it wouldn't be putting crap in a ship that has no defense capability. It would need adequate shielding and hull protection and at a minimum point defense turrets for missiles. Other wise you are just going to let enemies shoot and destroy any cargo you have. These ships will be massive targets. Power is already a sorry system in this game.

You know what forget it. Simply I quit. I'm deleting game now I see no point in wasting a minute more on it.
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the ample and varied examples provided of said science fiction has utterly refuted me

Star Trek has countless a number of episodes with freighters with weapons.
X universe has them.
I could run down a list but why don't you do your own work or actually make sure you know something before making a stupid comment.

 

[godmars]

Star Trek has countless a number of episodes with freighters with weapons meant to shoot asteroids

X cargo ships can be killed by Fighters..without a ...gasp..escort!!

 

[ltmauve]

Good question, we'll go one way or the other. See what Schema thinks.

This is why using the "volume" idea has an advantage over this.
In addition to the other benefits.

 

[Lecic]

It would make single player impossible if they don't do something or did you forget there is supposed to be a single player side to this game also?

Other wise you are just going to let enemies shoot and destroy any cargo you have.

You do realize we're getting AI fleets, right? Order a couple corvettes and a half dozen fighters to defend you.

And I doubt people will just be wildly shooting at cargo ships, because then that cargo would be destroyed. My freighters are going to be equipped with a strong jump drive, overdrive, and a high T:W ratio. You are not catching it unless you've got a massive inhibitor array and a hell of a lot of stop weaponry.

 

[Bench]

Wow talk about speculation overload. All we've said is that it's coming up, so you'll need to allow for cargo space and how we'll be rolling out the transition between the current storage system and more limited storage per stack. We haven't spoken about specific numbers or any other specifics so everyone take a breath and relax a little.

If you have any major questions you can save it for the Q&A, if you have concerns you're more than welcome to message me about them. Otherwise you can speculate but remember that we're not designing a system to totally cripple every ship. Balancing will come with it as will other improvements to systems like thrusters etc. but we need systems that affect mass to go in first before finalising the thrust balance. Otherwise we'd be doing it twice.

This is why using the "volume" idea has an advantage over this.
In addition to the other benefits.

We haven't shared specifically about how stacks will be limited, whether by mass or by volume or some other arbitrary number.

 

[ltmauve]

We haven't shared specifically about how stacks will be limited, whether by mass or by volume or some other arbitrary number.

Oh, so it might not be a fixed number. Good, good.

 

[GRHayes]

Star Trek has countless a number of episodes with freighters with weapons meant to shoot asteroids

Asteroids? You navigate around asteroids and such. Or does that simple fact escape you. We do it with current craft we have sent out maybe you think ships with more advanced technology are going to be handicapped in some way. Firing at an asteroid would create high velocity particles in space some of which will fly back at you. Even something the size of a BB becomes seriously deadly.
My 14 year old son understands something this simple.

They were meant as a deterent against pirates or any other unfriendly.
http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Fortunate_Son_(episode)