Ship interiors (Feeling Skylord Luke's pain)

    CyberTao

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    The best you can do is compromise and make spartan-interiors which are as small as possible, and be happy that the HP system is supposedly going to give ships with interior the armor advantage over ships with just pure system interiors (hopefully it is a somewhat large one).
    I'm pretty sure that same bonus will come from multi-layered outer hull as well. I assume the buff is coming from hull anyways (Interiors are known for including lots of hull, or used to at least), but regardless of what it is, there will always be ways to capitalize on it, or incorporate it into any ship.
     
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    I'm pretty sure that same bonus will come from multi-layered outer hull as well. I assume the buff is coming from hull anyways (Interiors are known for including lots of hull, or used to at least), but regardless of what it is, there will always be ways to capitalize on it, or incorporate it into any ship.
    Thing is though, from a relative standpoint ships with an interior are gaining an advantage from traditionally built ships with single layer hulls while the old method is gaining nothing. So now we'll hopefully end up with ships that have an interior ideally (and I stress ideally very strongly) depending on how they're built able to occupy a middle ground of defense and combat power compared to the powerhouse ships with thin armor today and multi-layered armored ships which are useless for the most part today which will be what players will be able to take advantage of.

    All speculation of course depending on how much of a change and impact this new coming soon™ armor HP system works. I'd really like to see that kind of outcome at least.
     

    Snk

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    I thoroughly enjoy watching ship reviews from Luke and Saber for the jaw-dropping beauty and to find some inspiration for my own ships. A recent top 5 from Luke kind of brought to the surface an issue within this Starmade universe. He made mention of the lack of creativity of ship interiors lately. I see his point and also have a feeling as to why this is.

    Everyone loves to play on servers that have something different for a challenge and most of us want to play on the more populated servers as well. A large chunk of these servers use custom pirates in custom ships with the challenge being honestly one dimensional -- make em bigger threats. You, as a new player , go into one of these servers and very quickly discover defending yourself against npc pirates , real players aside, may require a ship with 2 million shields. This forces the new player to ramp up quickly and not worry about "non-essential" things like having actual rooms in his ship beyond a core room. It doesn't enhance his ability to survive. So he builds system ships not realistic ships.

    That's the issue. There is no benefit from realistic interiors. It actually penalizes by adding size to the ship. The new players experiencing Starmade are rarely playing a vanilla version once they get out of single player and they experience a scenario similar to what I mentioned. They don't build rooms on their early ships and when they start working on larger ships they may not even know where to begin on interior design.

    I don't have a solution to this, but it does feel like an issue that I hope can be resolved in a manner to give benefit to ships that are built as well on the interior as the exterior.
    You may find this interesting: http://starmadedock.net/threads/a-manifesto-on-crewability.4329/

    f you came from a game like X3 or EvE, you don't get to see the interior, it's all exterior and stats, so whats wrong with building a ship as it's intended to be flown? Wasting time making an interior that you will never even look at seems kinda pointless.
    That's an appeal to improper authority, this isn't EvE or X3. A large part of this game is shipbuilding and roleplay, and both of those things benefit from interiors.
     

    CyberTao

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    That's an appeal to improper authority, this isn't EvE or X3. A large part of this game is shipbuilding and roleplay, and both of those things benefit from interiors.
    Only if you want them to. Unless you're saying that you can't roleplay a game like X3 or EvE, where the focus is on the political/relations side of things, cause then I would have to laugh. For the 'average' RP on SM though, interiors would probably help ya, yes, mind you I have no real interest in that kind of RP.
     

    Snk

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    Only if you want them to. Unless you're saying that you can't roleplay a game like X3 or EvE, where the focus is on the political/relations side of things, cause then I would have to laugh. For the 'average' RP on SM though, interiors would probably help ya, yes, mind you I have no real interest in that kind of RP.
    I've never played X3 or EvE, so I wouldn't know. It differs from server to server, but I have found that the roleplay in Star Made is all encompassing, from a couple of dudes on a ship to inter galactic wars. So yes, interiors here have use.

    And maybe you don't, but that doesn't really contribute to this thread. I feel we are getting off topic.
     

    CyberTao

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    And maybe you don't, but that doesn't really contribute to this thread. I feel we are getting off topic.
    The topic is interiors basically, you're the one who said that interiors were almost key to RP. Don't quote people and then expect them to not respond.

    The point was that even in RP, interiors are not required, and that still stands. Some forms of RP benefit, but others do not.
     
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    Im sure ship interiors will start to sky rocket once actual gameplay elements start being introduced. things to do while in "dave mode". currently development is still being focused on ship building, as that is this games greatest strength. (still alot of things to be done, like the fabled HP system, thruster revamp, and possibly another weapons overhaul, oh and did i say RAILS!) however once ship building is basically done, we are going to get a slew of "survival updates" things like mobs, requirements for dave (food, water, air ECT) craftable weapons and body armor/power suits, and probably a whole plethora of survival elements that will surely make interiors a necessity to some extent.

    so interiors are coming! (TM)

    also as a side note ill be making a new "interior design" episode from my building cities series. ill post the link here when im done (might be a few days) ill be going over different things i have been doing and have learned in under taking the daunting task of giving interiors to all the buildings in my city. my of them should be easily applicable to ship interiors.
     
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    I think the bottom line here is choice. Why do you care so much if I build a ship with or without interior. It is essentially the same argument as ships are better with orange hull or all engines should have ice. In a sandbox game like this, these are choices that every player has the right to make.

    The bottom line... if you like interiors or orange hull or ice then by all means use them, but please stop judging other peoples play styles and let them play how they want.
     

    Ithirahad

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    I think the bottom line here is choice. Why do you care so much if I build a ship with or without interior. It is essentially the same argument as ships are better with orange hull or all engines should have ice. In a sandbox game like this, these are choices that every player has the right to make.

    The bottom line... if you like interiors or orange hull or ice then by all means use them, but please stop judging other peoples play styles and let them play how they want.
    That's not the problem... The problem is that the game's current setup heavily punishes interiors. If having interiors was a good idea (Say, because of AI crew mechanics and boarding along with the collective armor bonus stuff Cal was talking about a while ago.) but there was also an option to not use interiors, then nobody would really care whether or not you had an actual ship interior.
     

    Mered4

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    I build functional aesthetic ships. I settled on the Imperial wedge as a good balance between the two and went from there.

    Interiors are something I install in all my ships, but they are almost never more than 3-4 rooms. Even the Executor has a relatively tiny interior compared to similarly sized vessels. There's just no reason for me to waste my time - unless it's a hangar bay.

    That said, I enjoy making a good interior. It takes some serious creativity and experience to make it look half-decent, much less stellar. I'm really tired of reviewers passing that off as just *fluff* in videos. Interiors are a BITCH to make - recognize effort where it is due and quit whining. If you don't want simplistic interiors, make your own ship. It's not a "problem" like god-level turret AI is a problem. It's a personal preference and should be treated as such.
     
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    A typical conversation with my friends:
    "I finally finished this ship. I think it looks amazing, come check it out!"
    "...wow, you did a lot of work, looks great."
    "You should see the interior - I laid out the bridge controls, working elevators, automated doors, the works."
    "I see that, great job."
    "You don't want to come over and see the inside?"
    "I already did, I'm looking in build-mode."
    "Oh..."
     

    Ithirahad

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    A typical conversation with my friends:
    "I finally finished this ship. I think it looks amazing, come check it out!"
    "...wow, you did a lot of work, looks great."
    "You should see the interior - I laid out the bridge controls, working elevators, automated doors, the works."
    "I see that, great job."
    "You don't want to come over and see the inside?"
    "I already did, I'm looking in build-mode."
    "Oh..."
    This is actually a balance issue and should be fixed. Going through non-docked entities in build mode shouldn't be possible. That said, once shipyards are implemented we won't have to worry because you'll need a shipyard to use build mode anyway.
     

    CyberTao

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    This is actually a balance issue and should be fixed. Going through non-docked entities in build mode shouldn't be possible. That said, once shipyards are implemented we won't have to worry because you'll need a shipyard to use build mode anyway.
    I'll need to ask how it is a "Balance" problem, you gain basically no advantage in poking around interiors unless you are trying to line up a shot to core drill a unmanned ship.

    And Build mode was not set to be solely limited to shipyards. Some features will, and the non-shipyard version will be heavily restricted in comparion, but Build mode camera would still probably be there. Building your first ships by hand so you can collect the resources to make the shipyard in the first place sounds like a horrible idea.
     
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    Not really a "balance" issue, but you can kinda abuse it to get some intel on enemy ships depending on how they are build, like say the classic core room with all weapon computers, you can get some idea of what weapons this ship has at its disposal.
     

    Ithirahad

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    I'll need to ask how it is a "Balance" problem, you gain basically no advantage in poking around interiors unless you are trying to line up a shot to core drill a unmanned ship.
    ...Or unless you want to efficiently and easily remove a faction module from a station. Or shoot out any other specific system I can think of.
    And Build mode was not set to be solely limited to shipyards. Some features will, and the non-shipyard version will be heavily restricted in comparion, but Build mode camera would still probably be there. Building your first ships by hand so you can collect the resources to make the shipyard in the first place sounds like a horrible idea.
    ...Is it? Trading guild stations, the spawn shop/all NPC-containing shops, and maybe other pre-generated locales could (and should) have smallish shipyards. And building a fighter-sized one on a planet shouldn't be too hard anyway. The way I see it, having your own shipyard should be something of a milestone, not an immediate necessity.
     
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    CyberTao

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    ...Or unless you want to efficiently and easily remove a faction module from a station. Or shoot out any other specific system I can think of.
    Block are invisible when they are covered up on all sides, it takes about 3% effort to place the faction module in the wall behind a crystal. It would still require the ship to be standing still when you scout it, and it's hard to pinpoint with anything when it's moving, so
    unless you are trying to line up a shot to core drill a unmanned ship.
     

    Ithirahad

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    Block are invisible when they are covered up on all sides, it takes about 3% effort to place the faction module in the wall behind a crystal.
    People usually put faction modules where they're accessible in my experience...
     

    CyberTao

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    People usually put faction modules where they're accessible in my experience...
    I dont see why, you only ever have to access it once; when it's spawned. So anyone who has the blueprints should know where it is at. "Above the core" isn't all that different from "Under the captain's pillow", except that one of them is easily found by everyone.