Yes, but shields should still regen, even during combat. I think they should keep the idea that if your shields hit 0, they stop regenerating for the x time (meaning once you hit 0, you are probably not going get your shields back up, as they will regen a little, get hit back to 0, and restart the timer), but they should regenerate until hitting 0. If the regeneration rate is too high, then tone it down. I\'d rather wait longer outside of battle for my shields, then - for some mysterious reason - shut down my shield generators right when I need them the most.
Please make shields stronger
- Thread starter Jolly Roger
- Start date
Maybe the recharge rate should work this way: The less shield level is the lower a recharge rate is. Then small ships doing small damage cannot penetrate the shield of huge ship, but another huge ship with powerful gun can easly deplete more shield at once making recharge rate low enough to consequently decrease level of shield (and still lower the recharge rate).
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\"AMCs do way too much damage. Yes I know that DPS decreases as you get more, but when each shot from a 250 block array can kill hardened hull in a single shot there is an issue. 64 block arrays can kill hardened hull in two shots.\"
I think it is okay that if you have a 250 block array, it can kill hardened hull in a single shot.
\"How does raising the amount of shield HP not cause this same issue? If people want to take your shields out faster, they would increase their DPS (more amc arrays vs bigger ones), just like lowering AMC damage.... The difference is lowering AMC damage would ALSO make hull worthwhile.\"
I think the shields should be taking the majority of the damage before it gets down to hull. If 2 ships are moving, and you have layers of hardened hull or even shield blocks surrounding your core, it is not that easy to take out someone\'s core. You have to hit the same spot more than once, and when they are moving around, that doesn\'t happen easily.
\"What? The point of hull is to prevent damage to internal parts. With the current AMCs, they cut through hull like butter and make it worthless for anything other than looks.
So 4 250 block arrays can kill almost 40 hardened hull blocks per second... That is ridiculous. Once shields are down, the ship is cored instantly.\"
I think hardened hull is good for protecting internals when it comes to smaller ship attacks, however, when something huge with a huge weapons system attacks, and your shields are gone I don\'t see why it can\'t burn through 1 hardened hull per shot. Even if a block is damaged instead of gone, you would still need to go looking for it on your entire ship. It just takes forever. What\'s the difference between that and putting a block in a hole? we should on fight on my server sometime, I can show you what a well designed ship can do with layers of hardened hull and other blocks around the inside surrounding the core. You will see that when I spawn them as pirates, and I fight them with the same ship, they have significant damage on the outside before the shots ever land on the core. The wrecks look really cool. Even without shields ships can take a beating before being destroyed completely. It\'s going to get messed up, but it\'s not instantly cored.
I think we disagree on the function of hull. I see it as a last resort, while you want it to more in the forefront of primary protection. I think shields should be the main protection, and we should prevent things from hitting the hull altogether so we don\'t need to repair and look for damage every time we get in a fight.
Another thing is, let\'s say we don\'t nerf the AMCs, throw a volley of lock on missiles at the thing, and it\'s going to do the same thing, and it will more likely \"core\" the ship than trying to kill it with AMCs.
I think it is okay that if you have a 250 block array, it can kill hardened hull in a single shot.
\"How does raising the amount of shield HP not cause this same issue? If people want to take your shields out faster, they would increase their DPS (more amc arrays vs bigger ones), just like lowering AMC damage.... The difference is lowering AMC damage would ALSO make hull worthwhile.\"
I think the shields should be taking the majority of the damage before it gets down to hull. If 2 ships are moving, and you have layers of hardened hull or even shield blocks surrounding your core, it is not that easy to take out someone\'s core. You have to hit the same spot more than once, and when they are moving around, that doesn\'t happen easily.
\"What? The point of hull is to prevent damage to internal parts. With the current AMCs, they cut through hull like butter and make it worthless for anything other than looks.
So 4 250 block arrays can kill almost 40 hardened hull blocks per second... That is ridiculous. Once shields are down, the ship is cored instantly.\"
I think hardened hull is good for protecting internals when it comes to smaller ship attacks, however, when something huge with a huge weapons system attacks, and your shields are gone I don\'t see why it can\'t burn through 1 hardened hull per shot. Even if a block is damaged instead of gone, you would still need to go looking for it on your entire ship. It just takes forever. What\'s the difference between that and putting a block in a hole? we should on fight on my server sometime, I can show you what a well designed ship can do with layers of hardened hull and other blocks around the inside surrounding the core. You will see that when I spawn them as pirates, and I fight them with the same ship, they have significant damage on the outside before the shots ever land on the core. The wrecks look really cool. Even without shields ships can take a beating before being destroyed completely. It\'s going to get messed up, but it\'s not instantly cored.
I think we disagree on the function of hull. I see it as a last resort, while you want it to more in the forefront of primary protection. I think shields should be the main protection, and we should prevent things from hitting the hull altogether so we don\'t need to repair and look for damage every time we get in a fight.
Another thing is, let\'s say we don\'t nerf the AMCs, throw a volley of lock on missiles at the thing, and it\'s going to do the same thing, and it will more likely \"core\" the ship than trying to kill it with AMCs.
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Hull should be an alternative to shields. There\'s plenty of sci-fi worlds where shields don\'t even exist, and ships rely on thick, durable hulls to resist damage. Hull should be an extremely effective means of resisting damage, as should shields. If a player wants to invest in a strong hull then they should not be penalised for having little to no shields; they should have the choice. As it stands, a ship without shields is a ship that can\'t win an engagement with an Isanth.
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I can show you what a well designed ship can do with layers of hardened hull and shields around the inside.
Those layers aren\'t doing jack. Might as well just put more shields since they will both be destroyed in the same amount of time, but at least the shields help boost your initial shield capacity a little. Or heck just replace them with AMCs instead and kill even faster than you are now. Hardened hull has 0 purpose at this time, it dies just as fast as any other block, so all its good for is weighing ships down and looks.
Those layers aren\'t doing jack. Might as well just put more shields since they will both be destroyed in the same amount of time, but at least the shields help boost your initial shield capacity a little. Or heck just replace them with AMCs instead and kill even faster than you are now. Hardened hull has 0 purpose at this time, it dies just as fast as any other block, so all its good for is weighing ships down and looks.
I agree with almost everything you said - except slowing down AMC fire rate. It\'s fine to have shots that destroy a hull in a single shot, but when those shots get FASTER as you add more damage, that\'s a little silly. That\'d be like in wargame, if the shotgun reloaded faster than the pistol, shot faster than the pistol, had further range than the pistol, and carried more ammo than the pistol just because it\'s better than the pistol. That\'s not how it\'s supposed to work. Just because something may be \"better\", it usually means situationally, not in every single stat possible.
How dumb would it be if the sniper, because it\'s the strongest weapon with the most range, also fire the fastest, aimed the fastest, had the biggest magazine, had the fastest moving bullets, and had armor peircing rounds? Yeah, a little silly.
How dumb would it be if the sniper, because it\'s the strongest weapon with the most range, also fire the fastest, aimed the fastest, had the biggest magazine, had the fastest moving bullets, and had armor peircing rounds? Yeah, a little silly.
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I think things in this game either have a function or they don\'t. Why would you have 2 things that do the same exact thing?
Who would choose hull over shields when one repairs itself?
Who would choose hull over shields when one repairs itself?
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Because hull is supposed to be armor, yet it doesn\'t help at all against AMCs (which are already shield destroyers)
Why use missiles when you can just use AMCs instead? No need to wait for cooldowns, or lock on targets, they are faster and stronger.
Why use missiles when you can just use AMCs instead? No need to wait for cooldowns, or lock on targets, they are faster and stronger.
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What function does hull have, then? In its current state hull serves the same function as a thick layer of paint. And if hull was comparable in strength to shields then it\'s obvious what purpose it would serve; protection of the ship without having to expend energy on shields.
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\"Those layers aren\'t doing jack. Might as well just put more shields since they will both be destroyed in the same amount of time, but at least the shields help boost your initial shield capacity a little. Or heck just replace them with AMCs instead and kill even faster than you are now. Hardened hull has 0 purpose at this time, it dies just as fast as any other block, so all its good for is weighing ships down and looks.\"
Those blocks totally are doing something. I\'ve been testing this for 3 weeks. Have you even tried building a big ship with a large weapons system? Do you know the limit of such a weapons system? It\'s limited by power, which requires massive amounts of power storage. My ship can shoot 15 seconds at full power while moving, and 1/3 the volume is filled with power storage. The 1,000,000 cap on power without diminishing returns prevents me from building a more powerful weapon. I have 48 AMCs in the center spread out in a checkerboard pattern, each doing damage of a little over 400, which is just enough to take out a hardended hull in a single shot. Do you know how hard it is to kill that ship with the same ship? It has 4 layers of hardened hull in the front, and that almost never gets fully taken out. The shields lining the inside don\'t just dissappear in an instant. It takes forever! I can be in a fight for 5- 10 minutes fighting the same ship trying to kill it.
if your weapons get damaged with this 400 damage, it won\'t shoot as powerfully and suddenly takes twice as much time to destroy a hardened hull.
Those blocks totally are doing something. I\'ve been testing this for 3 weeks. Have you even tried building a big ship with a large weapons system? Do you know the limit of such a weapons system? It\'s limited by power, which requires massive amounts of power storage. My ship can shoot 15 seconds at full power while moving, and 1/3 the volume is filled with power storage. The 1,000,000 cap on power without diminishing returns prevents me from building a more powerful weapon. I have 48 AMCs in the center spread out in a checkerboard pattern, each doing damage of a little over 400, which is just enough to take out a hardended hull in a single shot. Do you know how hard it is to kill that ship with the same ship? It has 4 layers of hardened hull in the front, and that almost never gets fully taken out. The shields lining the inside don\'t just dissappear in an instant. It takes forever! I can be in a fight for 5- 10 minutes fighting the same ship trying to kill it.
if your weapons get damaged with this 400 damage, it won\'t shoot as powerfully and suddenly takes twice as much time to destroy a hardened hull.
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With the number of missiles I have on that thing, they serve a purpose. They will follow the core, where the AMC goes in a straight line. Because the missiles travel in a group, the first one opens a path for the 2nd. It\'s not so easy as kill them with AMCs as it is to do so with missiles when shields are down.
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48 arrays of 250 blocks (400 damage) will use 1,194,029.85 power per second and will fire a total of 477.6 seperate shots a second. Since each of those can kill any block I fail to see how you are having any issue gutting a ship unless you are having problems hitting it to begin with.
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If schema ups shields, how will mobs ever kill anyone?
See what I did there?
Mobs can\'t kill anyone now because they have terrible ships.
Please explain how your 5 layers of hardened hull is a better use of mass / space than any other useful block (power gen, shields, power tank, missiles, amcs, etc). They all die in 1 shot, so why use hardened hull besides for looks?
See what I did there?
Mobs can\'t kill anyone now because they have terrible ships.
Please explain how your 5 layers of hardened hull is a better use of mass / space than any other useful block (power gen, shields, power tank, missiles, amcs, etc). They all die in 1 shot, so why use hardened hull besides for looks?
Have Hardened Hull share damage with other Hardened Hull (90%), so large bulkheads act like an HP pool before indivudual blocks start falling - once they do, blocks will fall fairly fast, but you\'ll no longer be able to just \"ha ha ha drill to da core!\" like the currents fights play out. Then it\'s not all about stuffing your ship with shields, as they will no longer be the ONLY defense a ship has (at least, not the big ones).
AMCs should be better at destroying shields, anyway, and if their fire rate is significantly slowed, then given AoE based on equal output blocks, and shields are given a small amount of dmg absorb, you\'ll end up with small turrets are effective against small ships, and big turrets will be effective against large ships, but not both. You\'ll have to actually think when building a ship, not just googling \"MAX DPS STARMADE\"
AMCs should be better at destroying shields, anyway, and if their fire rate is significantly slowed, then given AoE based on equal output blocks, and shields are given a small amount of dmg absorb, you\'ll end up with small turrets are effective against small ships, and big turrets will be effective against large ships, but not both. You\'ll have to actually think when building a ship, not just googling \"MAX DPS STARMADE\"
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When your weapons are damaged hardened hull takes 2 shots instead of 1 to burn through. Therefore it serves a purpose. Also protects against missiles. Mobs will kill you if you don\'t have shields. Simple.
I do think Terramort is going somewhere with his first idea. After all, the big gripe I have right now is when shields go down in no time flat and then it takes forever to fix your hull. even if you fight for a minute. The way I see it If the hull is not completely intact or very close, id rather buy a new ship, than to try and fix it back to the way it was. I still wouldn\'t want the fight to drag out anymore as it is hard enough to kill already.
Some sort of buildable repair station that automatically fills in the missing blocks would be nice too.
I do think Terramort is going somewhere with his first idea. After all, the big gripe I have right now is when shields go down in no time flat and then it takes forever to fix your hull. even if you fight for a minute. The way I see it If the hull is not completely intact or very close, id rather buy a new ship, than to try and fix it back to the way it was. I still wouldn\'t want the fight to drag out anymore as it is hard enough to kill already.
Some sort of buildable repair station that automatically fills in the missing blocks would be nice too.
And with the sharing damage in bulkheads, even if you take a fair amount of damage, a heal beam should restore the health of of every block withing a bulkhead (so Reinforced Hulls share healing as well as damage). Meaning after battle, so long as it wasn\'t too nasty, you should just have to repair the big outer plates on you ship, maybe some internal damage, but not the horrible, horrible pockmarks that happen now (slowing down AMC fire rate also will help this, as you won\'t have 199 rounds/second punching random holes in a cap ship)
A repair foundry would be awsome as well, something that if you own the blueprint for a ship, can repair you ship at something like, 3x the cost of buying+placing the block directly.
A repair foundry would be awsome as well, something that if you own the blueprint for a ship, can repair you ship at something like, 3x the cost of buying+placing the block directly.
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Keep in mind slowing down AMC fire does not prevent more holes in the ship. It slows it down for everyone. It only serves to drag out the fight. You\'ll have the same number of holes or even more...
Not if you have Reinforced Hull share 90% of incoming damage with all connected Reinforced Hull... then you\'ll have literal chunks of armor that might get smashed up, and a few holes from big direct shots/missile volleys, but the repairs will go much faster, as a heal beam will heal the whole bulkhead at once, and there would be far fewer blocks knocked out (because of damage sharing).