Implemented New Cargo System!

[Atheddall]

Even if it might look good. Dedicated space filling with blocks everytime you store items is performancewise not the best idea i guess.
What would happen if these blocks get hit? Will they just behave like normal ship blocks? What if someone unloads a huge chunk of blocks (10000) at once?
If every block would be represented by a singleblock it would be too much loading/unloading i guess.

Another much simpler system would be implementing a cargoblock/redesigning plex storages.
For every cargoblock (just a solid block/nothing fancy) you add, the ships inventory will increase its capacity by 10 mass.

Another approach would be that these cargo blocks would need to be linked to a computer to form an inventory. And you can access each inventory using each computer similar to the weapontab.

In any of the above suggested storagesystems it would make sense if:
...the inventory could be directly accessed from a ship tab and could be transferred to other ships (maybe using docking or another system).
...the player inventory would be limited heavily to maybe 100 mass = 1000 blocks or something.
...it would be possible to construct a ship directly from the inventory/cargo of a near ship.

Above numbers are just thrown in and could probably be fully configurable in the serverprops anyways.
Just some thoughts

Alright, I can see the confusion with the specifics you defined;
- The cargo blocks themselves would be a generic crate block, that's what I was trying to illustrate in the pictures, as I used one of the decoration blocks that looked closest to some sort of crate.
- When the blocks are shot they will destroy the stack to the farthest bottom left, the items being disintegrated by the weapon. When they are shot with a salvage beam when the shields are down, the beam will transfer the items directly into your own cargo hold.
- The reason we would want to have the blocks in this fashion and not just a cargo enhancement block, would be not only the fact that it would be harder to decide the block stack removed from a pool, but that you would visually be able to see an increase and decrease of items in your cargo hold instead of a static chunk of blocks.

Eventually, we could have beams that would transfer cargo from a designated "Transfer" Cargo Module to the receiving/sending ship. Therefore, you could easily hand off your most valuable materials in a time of crisis, or send the items into the cargo bay of a station/dry dock.

 

[StellarAmbition]

Well, unless you build a miner/freighter combo, but the bigger you get the more you'd want to seperate the two. Some way of remotely transferring cargo automagically between ships would be fair tho.

Maybe a single block that both players type a password into and it links them together and could show the two inventory tab that plex storages have but add a confirm button so players can view the offer then accept the trade. Might be a bit tedious for both players to confirm but it's a start.

 

[ltmauve]

Inventory stack sizes are planned to be limited tho, so say your max stack sizes are 100, you'll definately need a freighter to keep the materials coming in for your building project.

Also, on topic of the 1:1 scale storage of blocks, dont forget that a tiny 10x10x10 area already holds 1000 blocks, more than enough for a decent sized fighter. Now picture a regular dedicated freighter with 6 100x20x20 medium sized storage areas, good for a combined 240.000 blocks.

Basically, your freighters only need to be a little bigger than the ship you are building to transport all the required materials.

Well, that's a lot of lag for switching out the resources for your frigate in a reasonable amount of time. Also, storing things at bases would be a huge pain with a 1:1 storage ratio. Something like 100:1 or 500:1 would be much nicer simply because you don't need a 2 km station to hold everything.

That aside, I love this idea. This would definitely add flavor, variety, and balance to the game.

 

[Ithirahad]

I support this all the way. +1.

 

[Winterhome]

Let's go with stack sizes, but include not insignificant mass transfer from the cargo in the block inventories to the ship itself.

It'd be easy to ship 100,000 cubic meters of pillow stuffing, but near impossible to do it with, say, 100,000 cubic meters of Osmium (or equivalent). Vega Strike does this, in that ships have both cargo capacity and a listed percentage of ideal ship mass based on the thrusters, engines, etc. A Llama freighter can theoretically carry 500 cargo units of Alkali metals, but it ends up being loaded up to over 6,000% of its ideal mass, and moves like a slug on horse tranquilizers because of it.

Now, this isn't to say it should have a 1:1 ratio of cargo mass to effective ship mass - it could, by default, depending on if the balance seems good, but it would definitely need to be an option in server.cfg too.

 

[ltmauve]

So something like each block gets its own "packing density" in the block config file. So ship cores and computers and other such things would have a density of 10 (or thereabouts) because you don't use very many per ship. It isn't reasonable to be hauling around 1000 faction modules in the back of a shuttlepod. Other components (power, shields, thrusters, weapons) would have a density of maybe 100 or 1,000. Hull would have a density of 500-5,000. Dirt and rock would have very high densities, but minerals and other resources would have lower densities.

This would accomplish something similar to the properties above but in a different manner - you simply can't haul all that around.

 

[NeonSturm]

I don't know what you mean with density ltmauve
I think a stack can have 1 fac module, 1 hull, 10 computers... - do you mean that? Stack size?

Will an item in a storage area be a plex-store block?

Else I can see issues with using docked hull-containers as shield

 

[ltmauve]

The idea is that objects are stacked as "crates" with limited numbers of items in each. The "packing density" is how many of any one type you can fit into one crate. Not sure if putting multiple types of blocks in one crate would be allowed, hopefully it would allowed.

 

[NeonSturm]

But do you really want 500 hull in one block?

Personally I prefer ships to be build part by part, not having 10 other ships bigger than themselves packaged inside themselves.
Maybe just 2 times their size, as air does not count

 

[ltmauve]

I think that would be something that could be changed in server-config based on admin preferences. However, locking it in to 1:1 from the begining would be a problem

 

[schema]

This is a pretty cool idea. I'll definitely consider that

 

[Ced2]

This is a very nice idea, but i am not sure about the 1:1 scale. I think 1:2 would be way easier for everybody. Testing would be needed.

 

[ltmauve]

Well, it would be something that could be set in the block and server configs. Also, I'm thinking a system where each item has a "mass" that determines how much of crate it uses would be easier to use. I'm also thinking the "size" of crates (how much you can put inside them) would be something customizable in the server-config.

 

[Ithirahad]

This is a pretty cool idea. I'll definitely consider that

Judging from the fact that last time you said that, we suddenly got an announcement a week later that we were getting dodecahedron planets, I think that now is most likely a good time to go "YAY!"

 

[Leanson]

wow this is a good idea, I want cargo ships to mean something and be guarded. Lol nice thread!

 

[RedDragonflyxx]

I vote for:
*A storage system with blocks at 1/100 or smaller because of the limits 1/1 would impose.
*A salvage mechanic for this system where the cargo is taken out by salvage beams, maybe something like cargo spilling out when you pierce the hull and becoming markers on radar to salvage/pick up manually.
*Shields blocking theft of cargo.
*Ship to ship transfers through salvage beams/"mass transfer beams"(Bet EA copyrighted that ;D) ship to stations with cargo units as well.
*NO docking module system! Allowing greater creativity through a less... blunt system is very important for gameplay IMO. Maybe defining surfaces of irregular shapes with a build mode tool?
*A Player to player/NPC trade system.
*Trade routes, by making them advantageous to players or just NPC ones (Hyperspace Bypass?)
*Cargo ships becoming centerpoints of convoys in large factions/Trading Guild (varied loot)/Pirate fleets(High risk, high reward 90% of the time)
*A mass/density/volume system that affects performance, it just makes sense.
*Not adding 50 more *
Great ideas everyone! I hope *s don't do something weird, like bolding words.

 

[RedDragonflyxx]

This is a pretty cool idea. I'll definitely consider that

Yep, I've definitely seen that on the thread on dodecahedron planets... Thanks Schema! (Now where did you get those extra paws from :P)

 

[Visitor]

While I am not overly willing to talk numbers now, especialyl as those probably would have to be adjusted anyway, I am all for the idea. Aside from the cargo bays looking like actual cargo bays thanks to this idea and thus, cargo ships size and design being of certain worth, it would surely help me design both NPC ships and their loot. Though, on the other than, not making blocks which are the resources transported part of the design may be a wiser choice.

Either way, the idea as it is - is good.

 

[Vyor]

I...do not want this at all... suddenly those small miners that new players make are impossible. Just look at what this does to the early game... also... with stack sizes you already need a massive amount of plex storage blocks, so any addition this would have would be aesthetic and cause both lag and the need to play on a multiplayer server... which is usually a bad thing for sandboxes to force on you...



edit: Just thought of a solution. Make this system better for storing 1 type of block, like hull for instance, like allow it to hold 80 stacks in total of 1 item. Plex storage doesn't have that much space, but allows you to store more than 1 type of item at a time...think the barrels from the Factorization mod:
http://www.minecraftforum.net/topic/1351802-164-factorization-0834/

 

[RedDragonflyxx]

Good point, a basic cargo space would be a good solution though (Inventory style setup) Just making a cargo hold the best storage solution would be good too. (player inventory, ship inventory, plexstorage, cargo deck being the order of storage space per block) I'll get add any better ideas I have for early game...