Maps

[MacThule]

Is there a reason players wouldn't want individual map spreadsheets?

As in, should ALL players really be working off identical maps that show everything to everyone? Doesn't this kill exploration?

It certainly kills strategic planning since everyone can see everything you build from anywhere in the universe.

It also contributes to the reasons faction homebases currently have to be invulnerable.

 

[Megacrafter127]

Is there a reason players wouldn't want individual map spreadsheets?

As in, should ALL players really be working off identical maps that show everything to everyone? Doesn't this kill exploration?

It certainly kills strategic planning since everyone can see everything you build from anywhere in the universe.

It also contributes to the reasons faction homebases currently have to be invulnerable.

The easiest way to do that would be to attach a list of explored systems(not sectors) to each player-profile, and to only display the contents of the sectors within explored systems. Stars and wormholes should be excluded from that condition, and thus always be shown on the map.
Anything in an explored system will always be kept up to date, regardless of what the player is doing in what corner of the universe.

Another possibility would be to have the displayed map-data be clientsided, and the server only updating the info on the client, when the player is nearby/scanning/whatever is fit. However, the problem there is, that ingame trading of map-info might easily be impaired, due to the requirement of uploading the local info to the server, which then has the other client download it.

 

[BDLS]

I'd say server side maps saved by faction is the way to go. So all the people in the same faction share their discoveries.

 

[Andir]

I'd say server side maps saved by faction is the way to go. So all the people in the same faction share their discoveries.

And when you leave the faction you magically lose all your maps? Feels janky. I think client based maps with faction shared info is better.

 

[Ithirahad]

The easiest way to do that would be to attach a list of explored systems(not sectors) to each player-profile, and to only display the contents of the sectors within explored systems. Stars and wormholes should be excluded from that condition, and thus always be shown on the map.
Anything in an explored system will always be kept up to date, regardless of what the player is doing in what corner of the universe.

If this means that flying into a system instantly lets players find everything in a system, then we might as well stay with the current map system; this isn't much better.

Another possibility would be to have the displayed map-data be clientsided, and the server only updating the info on the client, when the player is nearby/scanning/whatever is fit. However, the problem there is, that ingame trading of map-info might easily be impaired, due to the requirement of uploading the local info to the server, which then has the other client download it.

It can't be that hard to create some kind of server-sided System Map block... Basically, a player can upload a file with only the data they discovered in a system, and other players could get it.

Other than that, this seems to be a good way to do it, unless it's practical to make all player discoveries server-side.

 

[BDLS]

Good point.

If you leave your faction you could have your faction's current map data saved as a personal one, as would be required for people without a faction.

 

[Tunk]

I would like it if stars were available, but you need to visit the system to get information on orbits.
Planets, stations and Asteroids (coloured dots for asteroids would be awesome) can be filled in via visiting the sectors.

This would encourage people to visit systems then explore individual sectors for more information.

A meta map item for exchange could be useful here as well, either a system, or individual sector map.
Factions are where things get tricky though.

 

[karkinosz]

A way to implement this. http://starmadedock.net/threads/starmade-mapping-a-response-to-macthules-maps.22015/ this thread isn't in suggestions so not really a good place to air my ideas.

 

[MacThule]

The easiest way to do that would be to attach a list of explored systems(not sectors) to each player-profile, and to only display the contents of the sectors within explored systems. Stars and wormholes should be excluded from that condition, and thus always be shown on the map.
Anything in an explored system will always be kept up to date, regardless of what the player is doing in what corner of the universe.

Another possibility would be to have the displayed map-data be clientsided, and the server only updating the info on the client, when the player is nearby/scanning/whatever is fit. However, the problem there is, that ingame trading of map-info might easily be impaired, due to the requirement of uploading the local info to the server, which then has the other client download it.

Thank you for the response.

The first option is definitely more straightforward, despite the drawbacks. The second option is far superior but I can see that it carries more coding problems to solve. IMO trading map data shouldn't determine the system. I think the main issue is allowing players to carry things out in secret if they're intelligent about selection of location. Space is so big - the omniscient map makes it feel quite small sometimes.
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I would like it if stars were available, but you need to visit the system to get information on orbits.
Planets, stations and Asteroids (coloured dots for asteroids would be awesome) can be filled in via visiting the sectors.

This would encourage people to visit systems then explore individual sectors for more information.

A meta map item for exchange could be useful here as well, either a system, or individual sector map.
Factions are where things get tricky though.

I definitely think stars & wormholes should be visible from everywhere. Possibly even planets, since even today's non-spacefaring scanner tech can detect planets quite far away. I could imagine a scanner sweep revealing all objects in a system, but leaving them "unidentified" until examined directly.

I like the idea of a meta map item. I'm not too worried about whether faction members would share maps and honestly if they do it should be permissions-based because I don't want every noob recruit knowing where my deep-space stash is before I've even vetted them.

 

[Megacrafter127]

unless it's practical to make all player discoveries server-side.

I fear that might make it hard. It is easy to make the map database explode, as every player's map storage will be fully different, meaning, that a ton of redundancy is easy to occur. In simple words, multiply a server's database size(excluding .smd2 files[as those store block-data], and those .ent files belonging to players and asteroids[as those don't influence the map]) by the amount of players the server has ever had. I deem it likely, that database size might explode.

 

[NeonSturm]

Made my response here : Starmade mapping - A response to MacThule's "maps"
I think map data should not store blueprints, but block-counts only or "outlines" / "block-heighmap-pictures" to avoid too much data client-side and copy+paste hacks.