Brainstorm This Controllable & Grouped Turrets

[Zackey_TNT]

Ah sorry, wasn't clear. The idea is that you put the computer in your hotbar, and right click to toggle the mouse-tracking on-off. When the mouse tracking is on, left-click fires everything.

Or there could be the option to have target designation using the computer as well, it's been brought up in the thread.

Reasonable.

 

[Xskyth]

Have a target painting computer block.
1. you can have many on one ship
2. you can link any number of bobby AIs to them
3. place computer on hot bar and name it
4. target enemy, activate computer
5. bobby AIs will attack until target is destroyed or target painting computer is turned off
say you have a ship with 6 turrets and 2 drones, you could have one computer for the drones, one for 4 of the turrets and another for the other 2 turrets. you could have all three groups fire at different targets or at the same target.

 

[Firrion]

Nice and useful for larger ships. Might also make them move less during combat.

Suppose by now this is one of them planned features...

 

[whooplaah]

Though I know that this thread is about Turrets, what we are really talking about is the general A.I. systems. We should keep in mind that if any suggestion is implemented it will probably also have to address concerns with quickly giving commands to NPC crew and to Drone ships in addition to Turrets.

1. A.I. Command Console (or Crew Command Console)
This console is not a quickbar computer, but allows the player to set the default priority of enemy ships. It is a list of all parameters that the game allows: missile, enemy shield down, friendly shield down, mass over 50k, speed under 75, distance less than 2k, etc.. The player will then take a set of options from the list and set them as priorities #1 - #5 (i think 5 checks is enough for a single turret unit). Any Bobby connected to this console will prioritize targets accordingly. If no target matches the priorities listed, it goes to a default standby mode.

For instance, I could have one set of A.I. programmed to assist and heal. These turrets/drones use shield supply and energy supply beams. The priorities would be:
(1) Ally shields down, (2) Ally power out, (3) Ally shield under 50%, (4) ally power under 50%, (5) nearest ally.
I could also set a cannon turret to be point defense and anti-fighter:
(1) Missile (distance < 500m), (2) Enemy mass under 2k, (3) missile (distance <1k), (4) nearest enemy
I could also set a missile turret to target slow moving ships and large ships:
(1) Speed under 10, (2) Speed under 30, (3) Mass over 10k, (4) Shield over 50k, (5) nearest enemy

---
Edit: To clarify, the module checks for any entity that meets Priority 1 and targets that entity. If nothing is found, it looks for something meeting Priority 2 instead, and so on down the list.
---

This could be as useful and versatile as the options provided for players to use when setting priorities. It might allow for different levels of AI complexity with some modules that allow 2 priorities, some that allow 5, some that allow more. Or perhaps different AI modules have different available priority options (some can check ship mass while others can't, some can check enemy weapon dps others can't). It could also be an NPC skill that is trained, more priorities with higher levels. I've read about the possible addition of targeting ship components, and this could also be used to have turrets target specific components of enemy ships (Priority 1: Shield generators, Priority 2: Energy Generators, Priority 3: Life Support, etc.) then go offline when the enemy is crippled rather than shoot to kill.

2. A.I. Command Override (or Crew Command Override)
This computer can be placed in the pilots quickbar. Any Bobby connected to this computer will have it's A.I. Command Console temporarily overriden when this is activated. This will allow a pilot to take control of a set of turrets to set a specific target or to use manually with the aiming cross-hairs. When the pilot is no longer using this module in the quickbar, or when the target assigned has been destroyed or moved out of range, the Bobby's revert to their A.I. Command Console priorities.
This would allow a pilot to quickly prioritize a specific target for a large group of turrets. Pilots can set targets for different groups of turrets, then go back to using primary weapons without having to worry about the turrets going dead when their current target gets away.
The Command Override could also be used by Player crew members to control groups of turrets, rather than just one at a time.
The Command Override can also be used to turn turrets on or off completely, in cases where pilots want to conserve power or stop using missile turrets, etc.

---
Modifying this for use with NPC crew would be as simple as changing the list of priorities available in the Crew Command - such as Eating, recreation, working, studying, sleeping. The player sets the general behavior in the Crew Command, then uses a Crew Command Override to declare battle station behaviors.

 

[SkullCollector]

Wow, I come back to check on the game and forums after half a year and this thread is on the first page with 18 agrees? Take a hint, devs.

Spoiler: Ramble ramble

1. A.I. Command Console (or Crew Command Console)

I like your elaboration as it provides a much nicer picture of what I meant by prioritising targets, as well as a first jab at how it could be done. Wouldn't it be easier to combine your AI Command Console into either the existing Bobby or into the proposed Turret Group Computer?

2. A.I. Command Override (or Crew Command Override)

Not to be blunt, but this is pretty much exactly what I meant with semi-auto mode. You combined it with your priorities idea, but I'd still want to have the option to basically shut down all my turrets when I want to, instead of them reverting to fully-engaged targeting after using them manually for a bit.

 

[whooplaah]

Wow, I come back to check on the game and forums after half a year and this thread is on the first page with 18 agrees? Take a hint, devs.

Spoiler: Ramble ramble

I like your elaboration as it provides a much nicer picture of what I meant by prioritising targets, as well as a first jab at how it could be done. Wouldn't it be easier to combine your AI Command Console into either the existing Bobby or into the proposed Turret Group Computer?



Not to be blunt, but this is pretty much exactly what I meant with semi-auto mode. You combined it with your priorities idea, but I'd still want to have the option to basically shut down all my turrets when I want to, instead of them reverting to fully-engaged targeting after using them manually for a bit.

You are right, what I said is not much different from what you proposed. My Command Console is the Turret Group Computer. I'd hate to have to set the same priorities in every Bobby of my fleet. It would be easier to set up 1 Command Console/Turret Group and slave the Bobby's to it. The Wireless Logic block proves that this can be accomplished in the engine.

I think that the Command Override could allow full control of turret groups. The Command Override has a Command Console slave which has multiple Bobby slaves. With Command Override in the quickbar you could:
(a) Press F to set a temporary target for the turret group. Turrets will not engage until the pilot changes quickbar and releases control of the group. When you change quickbar slots, the turrets continue targeting this entity, which shows up on the nav with a unique marker. Because the turrets are no longer selected as the weapon, pressing 'F' again works as normal.
(b) Left-Click to have turrets fire at the crosshairs. This is manual control.
(c) Right click to toggle turrets active or inactive. The quickbar displays a UI element to indicate to the pilot whether the turret system is on or off. (If we are using this system for drones, then we toggle between 3 states: off [docked], standby [undocked not shooting], active [attacking])

 

[jgames666]

I really like many of the ideas stated here but The idea that strikes me as the absolute best is "It could also be an NPC skill that is trained, more priorities with higher levels." from the message below. I really like this suggestion and tend to agree with the whole statement.

Though I know that this thread is about Turrets, what we are really talking about is the general A.I. systems. We should keep in mind that if any suggestion is implemented it will probably also have to address concerns with quickly giving commands to NPC crew and to Drone ships in addition to Turrets.

1. A.I. Command Console (or Crew Command Console)
This console is not a quickbar computer, but allows the player to set the default priority of enemy ships. It is a list of all parameters that the game allows: missile, enemy shield down, friendly shield down, mass over 50k, speed under 75, distance less than 2k, etc.. The player will then take a set of options from the list and set them as priorities #1 - #5 (i think 5 checks is enough for a single turret unit). Any Bobby connected to this console will prioritize targets accordingly. If no target matches the priorities listed, it goes to a default standby mode.

For instance, I could have one set of A.I. programmed to assist and heal. These turrets/drones use shield supply and energy supply beams. The priorities would be:
(1) Ally shields down, (2) Ally power out, (3) Ally shield under 50%, (4) ally power under 50%, (5) nearest ally.
I could also set a cannon turret to be point defense and anti-fighter:
(1) Missile (distance < 500m), (2) Enemy mass under 2k, (3) missile (distance <1k), (4) nearest enemy
I could also set a missile turret to target slow moving ships and large ships:
(1) Speed under 10, (2) Speed under 30, (3) Mass over 10k, (4) Shield over 50k, (5) nearest enemy

---
Edit: To clarify, the module checks for any entity that meets Priority 1 and targets that entity. If nothing is found, it looks for something meeting Priority 2 instead, and so on down the list.
---

This could be as useful and versatile as the options provided for players to use when setting priorities. It might allow for different levels of AI complexity with some modules that allow 2 priorities, some that allow 5, some that allow more. Or perhaps different AI modules have different available priority options (some can check ship mass while others can't, some can check enemy weapon dps others can't). It could also be an NPC skill that is trained, more priorities with higher levels. I've read about the possible addition of targeting ship components, and this could also be used to have turrets target specific components of enemy ships (Priority 1: Shield generators, Priority 2: Energy Generators, Priority 3: Life Support, etc.) then go offline when the enemy is crippled rather than shoot to kill.

2. A.I. Command Override (or Crew Command Override)
This computer can be placed in the pilots quickbar. Any Bobby connected to this computer will have it's A.I. Command Console temporarily overriden when this is activated. This will allow a pilot to take control of a set of turrets to set a specific target or to use manually with the aiming cross-hairs. When the pilot is no longer using this module in the quickbar, or when the target assigned has been destroyed or moved out of range, the Bobby's revert to their A.I. Command Console priorities.
This would allow a pilot to quickly prioritize a specific target for a large group of turrets. Pilots can set targets for different groups of turrets, then go back to using primary weapons without having to worry about the turrets going dead when their current target gets away.
The Command Override could also be used by Player crew members to control groups of turrets, rather than just one at a time.
The Command Override can also be used to turn turrets on or off completely, in cases where pilots want to conserve power or stop using missile turrets, etc.

---
Modifying this for use with NPC crew would be as simple as changing the list of priorities available in the Crew Command - such as Eating, recreation, working, studying, sleeping. The player sets the general behavior in the Crew Command, then uses a Crew Command Override to declare battle station behaviors.

 

[BlokeWithHat]

I've been looking through the forums for the past hours to find anything about turrets and how to help them become the centre piece I envision them to be.
This thread is amazing. OP has kicked off a great idea and the posts that followed made it better and better.

For me personally, combat feels ludicrous and frankly irritating. You want to train your entire ship on a target to be effective as it is, but anything approaching large sizes has a hard time turning. Rotational thrusters have been called for quite possibly partly to help ships get their main arrays to follow the target, while a solution could be much more... awesome. This one, namely.

The AI is useless. It does whatever and feels unfit for combat, let alone group manoeuvres. Adding parameters would help, but I'd much prefer the semi-auto option presented in the OP. I want to pick my targets, not hope that Bobby makes a good choice. Following my crosshair directly is icing on the cake. Leave PD to full-auto, that would be a hassle otherwise.

Frankly, I've never been a fan of super weapons. That might be just me and that's fine. But I would love to see turrets viable. There's a thread around that proposes damage buffs (and I chimed in with just buffing turret blocks before I found this thread), but I would go as far as saying that turrets only need to show their versatility. Big ships can finally defend themselves while standing still, with different players in different control stations even against a multitude of targets. We don't need extra damage, we need this. Trade massive damage for flexible arcs of fire, and to quote:

proper f'n broadsides

 

[Levarith]

I have a work around for this, I use wireless logic. On cannon turrets I give Bobby control of one output cannon/cannon/stop in the dead center then put my actual cannons around that and link them with wireless logic to the main ship that lets me do "bursts" on my own at my selected target but the ai handles aiming.

 

[Edymnion]

There's definitely plans for players to be able to control turrets through another means than having to run over to the core and jump in. Can't confirm exactly what this would look like just yet.

Didn't we hear a while back this was possibly going to be one of the uses for command chairs?