Build Block & Ship Spawn "Exploits"

    Vas

    Joined
    Jun 27, 2013
    Messages
    57
    Reaction score
    0
    • Legacy Citizen 2
    • Legacy Citizen
    Yes, I know you whiney people who like using these "exploits" will bash me and claim it's not an exploit when it really is. So lets see about how to fix it shall we?

    1. Ship Spawning - To evade ship limits.
    People often call it farming, they go to single player and fill a ship with a bunch of a block they want and then import that ship in multiplayer when the shop is out of that item. This is a CHEAT. Doesn't matter if you have to 'pay for it'. It's still cheating, to evade the fact that the shop is OUT OF THAT ITEM. I know that this one would be hard to fix. So lets give a few ideas towards fixing it shall we?

    One thing you can do, is make it require that the shop has all of the blocks needed to build the ship. This poses problems though with large ship builds. So lets continue on to a suggestion to fix this suggestion!

    A ship fix feature. The ability to pay credits to repair damaged blocks on your ship, at half cost to normal price for blocks and the ability to replace missing blocks on your ship by paying full price for missing blocks. How is this done you say? Just load the ship's schematic while inside the ship, it will scan your ship and move mis-placed blocks for free, replace missing blocks for full block cost, and repair damaged blocks for half block price.

    How does this fit in with earlier method of ridding shop exploit? When importing a large ship, or even a small one without enough shop blocks in inventory, simply give the person their ship but missing all the blocks that the shop didn't have and drain the shop of the blocks it used to build that ship, giving them at least ONE thruster so they can move their ship, even if the shop is out of thrusters. Then they can fly to the next shop and use the repair tool to add more missing blocks, so on so forth. It should also probably ask the player if they wish to use blocks from their inventory, free of charge.

    Reason I suggest this fix? It cuts out the need for people to build factories or go exploring or really do anything at all for that matter. They don't even need to play the game. Just build a massive mining ship, go destroy the nearest 10 massive objects to farm credits or steal other peoples things to make credits, then import everything they want.

    How does all of that sound? Please let me know on my idea for fixing ship spawn exploit.


    2. Build Block - Mining planets and stations out
    This is an issue, a nice big issue. You're supposed to actually use SALVAGE BEAMS people! Not stick a build block on a planet and just mine the whole .... thing out with the Ctrl method. Seriously? I went to several great planets in my new home sector, and they all had a crap load of square shaped holes in them, making them hidiously ugly with almost no chance of repair at all. It's sad when somene flies through and destroys every planet in the game with a build block just cause it's easier than using a mining beam.

    Fix? Well.. This one is complicated. One idea, is to make build block advanced remove tool only remove man made blocks such as hulls, power cores, etc, while attached to a planet. This would mean that no one can Ctrl 10x10x10 remove bits of planet and mine the whole thing in under 5 minutes with a series of rapid right clicking.

    A further fix could be to make the build block not be able to effect the planet at all, allowing people to build on top of the planet attaching blocks and such, but unable to remove any natural part of the planet. Though I rather like the earlier idea of just making the advanced control ignore blocks, natural to the planet.


    You're welcome to voice your opinions, not your trolling. Please give valid input on these 2 ideas, trolling posts will be reported. This is supposed to be a game, not an infinite lego set.
     
    Joined
    Dec 30, 2012
    Messages
    790
    Reaction score
    1
    • Legacy Citizen 4
    About issue 1, maybe I should start be worried that I brought up that idea on the official( and by then, the only) StarMade server in the first place... it just seemed practical... and I was like, \"Why didn\'t somebody think of this?\" Then it was each time more used.



    Issue 2, you are totally right, that\'s wrong, but it\'s not worse than idea solution to block the build block for planets, no matter which way, there would still need to be terraforming(this also denis solution 1), and extra constructions on it that require symmetry.

    No limitations to how much people can work on a planet/station can work.

    THE only solution I find here is actually making the removal of each block on a natural planet/station actually cost money (either a constant ammount no matter the block type, or to actually detect the block recovered and remove the value of it from your money), in a way that it won\'t be efficient for \"mining\", but those who want to \"terraform\" on planets, can still do it (without losing the blocks you debuild since you may need to use them for rebuilding), at a cost which seems just reasonable to cost you do such major thing as terraform, it does costs in those web games, why not here ? You better be rich enough to have a planetary base ! Else go have a space dock till you get the money :D
     
    Joined
    Jul 3, 2013
    Messages
    220
    Reaction score
    34
    I can\'t really comment on the catalogue. Currently shops almost never respawn their inventory (And the trading guild is as useful as you\'d expect from an AI); making attempts to make anything sizeable from hardened hull require hours of going from shop to shop getting 30-60 hardened hull each. God forbid if anyone else is attempting the same.

    At most, I suggest making it a server option, credits vs blocks.

    As for the build block thing, I think the simplest thing to do is make it cost more. The server I\'m on bumped it to 50 million credits; it also affects people attempting to buy a build block ship. The only problem is pirate loot...
     
    Joined
    Aug 2, 2013
    Messages
    64
    Reaction score
    2
    or you can just not get the blocks you pick up in build mode. just don\'t mess up....
     
    Joined
    Dec 30, 2012
    Messages
    790
    Reaction score
    1
    • Legacy Citizen 4
    With just 1 build block you can get infinite billions though.



    Pirate loot is not a problem since you got 2 options in the config for lowering the quantity per item/stack and/or the stacks ammount (like, instead of a chest with 30 different items, 10, or less, meaning less chance for L5s)
     
    Joined
    Dec 30, 2012
    Messages
    790
    Reaction score
    1
    • Legacy Citizen 4
    That actually brings up the issue I mentioned... then you would have to hunt for grass/dirt/stone/tree parts around dozens of shops to rebuild the planet / it\'s surface, this is not only anti build block debuilding, it doesn\'t have to be a game breaking option.
     
    Joined
    Aug 15, 2013
    Messages
    143
    Reaction score
    2
    I dont think this are good Ideas at all.Okay I agree spawning ships with infinite types of 1 block is cheating but the problem is that without a sector map or actual Navigation forcing the player to search shops is unfair aswell...

    Also balancing these things is just a waste of time because the totally broken loot system screws everything.
    I got like 300 faction blocks from some pirate ships and the boxes in pirate stations always include 10K of pretty much anything excluding the station itself.

    An fixing feature would be nice though



    To the planet removal thingie... There will always be exploiters and limiting the buildmode will only offend honest players.Just look at minecraft servers: A lot of spawn maps are completely mined out or blown up even though it isnt easy and/or requires money.

    Hiding the ores inside the planets and rounding the edges would make mining out planets much harder or atleast less interesting.
     
    Joined
    Jul 3, 2013
    Messages
    220
    Reaction score
    34
    Pirate loot is an option and can be increased or decreased in the server.cfg file...
     
    Joined
    Aug 15, 2013
    Messages
    143
    Reaction score
    2
    My point was that endless searching for new shops is just an poor try to cover the fact that you will get infinite money anyway.

    The highly available money is making the game so unchallenging that everyone thinks covering it up by making something overfluently complex actually helps.

    Giving the shops limited credits also doesnt help at all it just makes it even more overfluently



    A good start to fix the whole money thing could be done by making all natural blocks worthless which would make crafting important at the same time.Also pirates should not drop anything but cheap hull blocks and some other ship blocks.

    Pirate stations might include some alien \"food\".

    Shops should posses unlimited stocks but different prices which will raise expondentially if they are overused.
     
    Joined
    Aug 2, 2013
    Messages
    132
    Reaction score
    0
    • Legacy Citizen 2
    • Legacy Citizen
    To your first post I actually uploaded a bunch of \"BLOCK SHIPS\".

    BLOCKS_HARDENED_HULL_GRAY

    BLOCKS_SHIELDS

    Repeat for another 10 useful blocks or so.

    I do this INTENTIONALLY because the shops always being out of stock is ridiculous. No one wants to go begging for materials all the time. However these 10 \"ships\" are the only allowed uploads (max catalog slots is 0 so you cant upload your own). This works GREAT. Earn money, buy materialis from catalog instead of horrible shops always out of stuff.

    This is not a bug. Do what I do, disable imports, but as admin upload \"material ships\". Now people can build what they want, and dare not lose them because there is no insta spawn.
     
    Joined
    Sep 7, 2013
    Messages
    427
    Reaction score
    4
    for once i agree with you...

    anyways, i dont care if you consider it a exploit, it is in the game as an intended feature so im just going to use it

    hilariously i dont even make my own ships. i...

    go to the projects forum...

    find a ship i really like...

    click the download link...

    and BAM battlecruiser baby!
     

    Vas

    Joined
    Jun 27, 2013
    Messages
    57
    Reaction score
    0
    • Legacy Citizen 2
    • Legacy Citizen
    You all seem to be forgetting the fact that (though currently it\'s a very ugly system) there is a factory system. You don\'t need to buy your hulls, you can MAKE them. Just 7 of some object will make a bunch of hulls. I don\'t remember the exact info as I was messing with it 2 days ago and I\'m currently tired. Basically it\'ll cost you less than 70 credits to make 10,000 credits worth of hulls. All this material spawn crap does is let people avoid making a factory at all so they don\'t have to do complex work on figuring it out.

    I know that the factory system is currently trash though, so right now it\'s not that great of an idea till the dev(s) fix the factory system. I actually like it better the way it used to be... Only slightly. I haven\'t gotten much experience with either of them, and currently there doesn\'t appear to be any way to learn about the Factory system other than people who already know somehow.

    As for build block planets. I think money would be one good method, a rather great method actually. It would probably completely and totally eliminate people doing this crap to planets causing ugly square hole filled planets all throughout every sector they come across. I can\'t think of anything better really.

    Shops should have infinite stock storage (though not infinite items stored in them obviously, except the core items). This would allow players to stock the shops easily without being told \"Hey, we can\'t hold any more of this item. Sorry.\"
     
    Joined
    Dec 30, 2012
    Messages
    790
    Reaction score
    1
    • Legacy Citizen 4
    Yeah, here we get to some common sense ^^



    The solution to build block debuilding/griefing/etc just got simple, and the shops idea can also work.