The new update designed to somewhat nerf large shield systems is a good idea but the recharge rate is ridiculously slow. I propose that you change the way shields work, I think a good idea for shields is to change the way the SD Shield Disperser works. Instead of them regenerating on their own make a new block not sure what you could call it yet. Maybe SD shield regenerator? But it would be a very expensive item. The shields will still have a small amount of regeneration but only half a bar a second. So basically make the shields act like the power tanks and the SD shield regenerator act like the Power Block but the shields still have a low amount of regeneration.
Better Shield System Suggestion
- Thread starter lukavis
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Doing this will lead to the old problem again where regineration is a threashold limit of \'be this powerful to threaten me\' though I like the idea of a block effecting regeneration but lets tweak the idea a bit. What about a block that reduces the time it takes for regeneration to kick back in? Currently the larger the shield the longer time it needs to start regeneration.
I like that idea but half a bar regen a sec is far too slow. Its like they are rewording people for using i of smaller (usualy astheticly unpleseing) ships . I think there should be a limit to regen but not this drastic. Alsso this is going to bring in the idea of docking other smaller ships to a big ship just for the purpose of shielding the bigger ship. And i think that they are making larger ships less apealing becoz whats the point in having a larger,slower manoovering ship when you could hav a small ship with the same regen potential.
I tend to think that shields and power systems should have capacity blocks and generation blocks and let them be basically separate units. The power system is almost this way except for the default capacity of power on any ship. That way when placing blocks you can choose to up your total or up your rate but not both.
All effects that are based on numbers of blocks should have diminishing returns in large numbers (and probably already do?) It would be up to the designer to decide where these soft caps are. But basically at some point you need two more blocks to do what one more block used to do, then 3, 4, etc. This let\'s people build really big ships that don\'t directly scale in power. So a ship that\'s twice as large as another might only have 50% more shields and regen just as an example.
All effects that are based on numbers of blocks should have diminishing returns in large numbers (and probably already do?) It would be up to the designer to decide where these soft caps are. But basically at some point you need two more blocks to do what one more block used to do, then 3, 4, etc. This let\'s people build really big ships that don\'t directly scale in power. So a ship that\'s twice as large as another might only have 50% more shields and regen just as an example.
But the price is low visibility, and not being able to bring your main weapons to bear.
Honestly, I like the idea of making giant space stations required to be built out of parts to get the maximum shield efficiency.
half a bar a second is quite quick, and I\'d like it to be slower, if implemented, because everything that can get used in this game will be abused.
If 100 blocks made the shield regen go up by half a bar, you can bet someone will put 10,000 of the blocks into his ship.
What if we made it so it would drastically soft cap past the amount of shield capacitors you have?
So you always have more shield maximum than shield regen.
With 1 regen block to 1 shield block, it\'d boost the regeneration rate by 200% or more (so if you had 13k regen, you\'d have 39k per second)
Since the shields don\'t charge when under fire, it shouldn\'t become too unbalanced like it was.
Honestly, I like the idea of making giant space stations required to be built out of parts to get the maximum shield efficiency.
half a bar a second is quite quick, and I\'d like it to be slower, if implemented, because everything that can get used in this game will be abused.
If 100 blocks made the shield regen go up by half a bar, you can bet someone will put 10,000 of the blocks into his ship.
What if we made it so it would drastically soft cap past the amount of shield capacitors you have?
So you always have more shield maximum than shield regen.
With 1 regen block to 1 shield block, it\'d boost the regeneration rate by 200% or more (so if you had 13k regen, you\'d have 39k per second)
Since the shields don\'t charge when under fire, it shouldn\'t become too unbalanced like it was.
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What about being able to create groups of individual overlapping shields within the same ship? There could be Shield Emitter blocks which are to SD Shield Dispersers what Weapons Computers are to AntiMatter Cannons. Allow you to group a set of shields together to create an independent shield to protect part of the ship. That way its not an all or nothing situation for capital ships, if you third-right-flank shield starts to fail, you can turn the ship to direct fire onto another shield allowing it time to regenerate.
Yeah Hawk, I had thought of a system like this too. Something similar to the docking ports with enhancers except probably centered on the emitter and all the blocks within the borders are shielded. Hook these to independent shield generators and capacitors to determine their strength. Link multiple emitters to the same equipment to share the shield values between them, things like that.
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You start with a sheild controller, this would be the main computer controller of all the sheilds on the ship, you then have sheild generators, these would replace the dispersers and would be able to be placed anywhere on a ship or station and would not have a box dimension effect, the generators would then be linked to a sheild emitter which would have to be placed on the exterior layer of the ship or station, a sheild emitter would have enhancers to adjust the size just like the docking system. Each sheild emitter would have a protection zone and could be scaled by adding generators to it. The emitters would be vulnerable to hits based on the skill of a pilot, if you can hit the emitter you can knock it out, if you knock out enough of the emitters then a capital ship would be vulnerable to actual hull damage. The controller would come into play as a routing tool, if an emitter were knocked out, the controller would move the generators from that emitter to the adjacent emitters to compensate for the emitter that was knocked out.
The math on the sheilds would be pretty easy,
1. the emitter is placed as an exterior ship block,
2. behind the emitter would be the enhancer to adjust the size, 2 blocks in the direction the block is placed.
3. sheild generators linked to the emitter, any location on the ship, as they are linked the sheild strength/regen is increased based on the old style sheild dispensers.
4. sheild controller, optional, if you have a controller, if an emitter is knocked out, the controller would add the enhancers and generators to the adjacent emitters to increase the size of those emitters arrays to cover the space of the knocked out emitter.
This concept allows for all the tactic guys with the fighter type mentality to attack and not only damage but disable a capital ship, it also allows a capital ship to attack another capital ship and knock out the emitters. If your a good shot you can win if not you can run. This also makes planning and building a ship more intricate, you cant just put in a square block of dispensers and have the op sheilds, you have to actually plan your ship around emitters, enhancers and generators as well as the power requirements to keep them up.
The math on the sheilds would be pretty easy,
1. the emitter is placed as an exterior ship block,
2. behind the emitter would be the enhancer to adjust the size, 2 blocks in the direction the block is placed.
3. sheild generators linked to the emitter, any location on the ship, as they are linked the sheild strength/regen is increased based on the old style sheild dispensers.
4. sheild controller, optional, if you have a controller, if an emitter is knocked out, the controller would add the enhancers and generators to the adjacent emitters to increase the size of those emitters arrays to cover the space of the knocked out emitter.
This concept allows for all the tactic guys with the fighter type mentality to attack and not only damage but disable a capital ship, it also allows a capital ship to attack another capital ship and knock out the emitters. If your a good shot you can win if not you can run. This also makes planning and building a ship more intricate, you cant just put in a square block of dispensers and have the op sheilds, you have to actually plan your ship around emitters, enhancers and generators as well as the power requirements to keep them up.
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Hawk my friend you are a genius. This is exactly what this game needs, sectional shields. A lot of Sci-Fi seems to do it (star trek, star wars, etc) so having it here would not only be great balance-wise, it would let people do a lot more towards making realistic versions of ships from those various places. Also, as you said, it would add in a lot more tactical piloting to ship combat
Hawk & Littlebigstarmade,
Excellent idea. Maybe you guys should start a new topic, since this one is about something else.
Excellent idea. Maybe you guys should start a new topic, since this one is about something else.
People using small ships should be rewarded, they force themselves to restrain from building flying nuke cannons so they spray paint the side of your\'s with weak bolts. There\'s far too many suggestions for trying to make big ships more powerful when all they really need is an improved turret AI and more thought put into their design. Considering that shielding doesn\'t extend via turrets or docking, there\'s not going be this problem you see of people stacking their flying shield blocks onto their Planet with thrusters. Be realistic, large ships have MANY problems, and all the problems they suffer are those that come with being a SPACE FORTRESS.
For some good design tips on your next Buster Cannon, look at ships from Star Wars -- all of them HUGE, and all of them using HUNDREDS of tiny turrets to deal with the smaller ships, the main guns are for ships that rival your size and pose an immediate threat to your\'s.
On topic, I approve of the recent nerf, it\'s improved the value of having less shields and less mass -- another reward for people who chose to take risks.
For some good design tips on your next Buster Cannon, look at ships from Star Wars -- all of them HUGE, and all of them using HUNDREDS of tiny turrets to deal with the smaller ships, the main guns are for ships that rival your size and pose an immediate threat to your\'s.
On topic, I approve of the recent nerf, it\'s improved the value of having less shields and less mass -- another reward for people who chose to take risks.
Thats the entire point, you NEED to be xxx powerful to engage me. Massive ships should not be able to be engaged and killed by a small 200 block ship. Which they currently can be, easily.
Regen in combat is imperative, ships should have passive regen in battle. It\'s a completely broken game mechanic, how many games do you see where all battles/fights are bassed off of buffer, with no ability to heal or regen? Not many, becuase that is not ballanced, it\'s not logical.
Regen in combat is imperative, ships should have passive regen in battle. It\'s a completely broken game mechanic, how many games do you see where all battles/fights are bassed off of buffer, with no ability to heal or regen? Not many, becuase that is not ballanced, it\'s not logical.
Massive ships should not be able to be engaged and killed by a small 200 block ship.
They should because Schema wishes them to be.
Which they currently can be, easily.
Prove it with video evidence or STFU
how many games do you see where
Starmade isn\'t those games. What they do is their own business, not Starmade\'s.
Not many, becuase that is not ballanced.
-If- it is not balanced Schema will balance it until it is balanced for Starmade, not balanced in relation to other games.
They should because Schema wishes them to be.
Which they currently can be, easily.
Prove it with video evidence or STFU
how many games do you see where
Starmade isn\'t those games. What they do is their own business, not Starmade\'s.
Not many, becuase that is not ballanced.
-If- it is not balanced Schema will balance it until it is balanced for Starmade, not balanced in relation to other games.
Is the point of the suggestions forum to not suggest or discuss what should or should not be in the game?
There is no reason or need to prove that a large ship can be killed by a small one. Thats like proving that water is wet, or that what we breath is air. Shields do not regen when being shot, this means any and all damage dealing ships can destroy another ship regardless of it\'s size given a sufficent amount of time.
I am comparing it to other games, to reinforce the point, arguing that that has nothing to do with starmade. Ignoring all other games or inputs becuase you trust and rely on every decision the developer makes is tunnel vision. Thats what the forum is for, to bounce these off of each other, to discuss it, not to tell people with differant opinions than you to \"shut the fuck up\".
There is no reason or need to prove that a large ship can be killed by a small one. Thats like proving that water is wet, or that what we breath is air. Shields do not regen when being shot, this means any and all damage dealing ships can destroy another ship regardless of it\'s size given a sufficent amount of time.
I am comparing it to other games, to reinforce the point, arguing that that has nothing to do with starmade. Ignoring all other games or inputs becuase you trust and rely on every decision the developer makes is tunnel vision. Thats what the forum is for, to bounce these off of each other, to discuss it, not to tell people with differant opinions than you to \"shut the fuck up\".
Is the point of the suggestions forum to not suggest or discuss what should or should not be in the game?
There is no reason or need to prove that a large ship can be killed by a small one. Thats like proving that water is wet, or that what we breath is air. Shields do not regen when being shot, this means any and all damage dealing ships can destroy another ship regardless of it\'s size given a sufficent amount of time. There are many ways this can be accomplished, you can abuse bugs to undock ships and shoot it overnight. Abuse collisions and get inside the ship, build a small vessel and shoot it overnight. Find large ships that someone cannot dock (turrets and all, their lazyness) and shoot it with a small ship till it\'s dead. Crap, shoot it with a pistol, that will work to. You can abuse the collision problems to even do it while the owner is online, what I\'m saying is that with passive regen in battle the ship has a minimum recharge. With the nerf to recharge, that isn\'t a whole lot and is fairly easy to overcome. It would not make invincible monsters like what existed before the change.
I am comparing it to other games, to reinforce the point, arguing that that has nothing to do with starmade. Ignoring all other games or inputs becuase you trust and rely on every decision the developer makes is tunnel vision. Thats what the forum is for, to bounce these off of each other, to discuss it, not to tell people with differant opinions than you to \"shut the fuck up\".
There is no reason or need to prove that a large ship can be killed by a small one. Thats like proving that water is wet, or that what we breath is air. Shields do not regen when being shot, this means any and all damage dealing ships can destroy another ship regardless of it\'s size given a sufficent amount of time. There are many ways this can be accomplished, you can abuse bugs to undock ships and shoot it overnight. Abuse collisions and get inside the ship, build a small vessel and shoot it overnight. Find large ships that someone cannot dock (turrets and all, their lazyness) and shoot it with a small ship till it\'s dead. Crap, shoot it with a pistol, that will work to. You can abuse the collision problems to even do it while the owner is online, what I\'m saying is that with passive regen in battle the ship has a minimum recharge. With the nerf to recharge, that isn\'t a whole lot and is fairly easy to overcome. It would not make invincible monsters like what existed before the change.
I am comparing it to other games, to reinforce the point, arguing that that has nothing to do with starmade. Ignoring all other games or inputs becuase you trust and rely on every decision the developer makes is tunnel vision. Thats what the forum is for, to bounce these off of each other, to discuss it, not to tell people with differant opinions than you to \"shut the fuck up\".