The ultimate drone R&D thread

[Malacodor]

Skoomdrones, despite their small size, are extremely valuable though, because of the LARGE amount of computers contained in a mere 12 mass drone (there is a faction module, a bobby AI, 3 cannon computers, 2 push pulse computers and 2 defensive push effect computers.

What's a push pulse computer? I only know damage pulse and push effect.

 

[refirendum]

slowmoving nukes don't hit unless it's a basically stationary target, and drones are always good to have as filler craft to distract heatseekers, screen lockons, and screen incoming nukes. (anti-missle turrets and drones wil basically render a single nuke useless until you can get rid of all of them.

 

[Keptick]

The drones that cause spinning are working off a bug glitch in game, what happens to all that time to perfect a system that get a patch and renders them useless? An Ai will fire nuke faster than any drone system release hit the side of your vessel with a 72m damage and KO all the drones past the shields which is another "bug" "glich", heat seekers will KO a patch of drones. If my titan turret hits your ship first and you don't have well over 35 million shields kiss your ship goodbye, that just "one" Titan turret. Nobody says you can't imagine a battle I could also launch cruiser size vessels as my drones for your drone distraction? Counter -counter -counter warfare We all have our "toys" to play with,

My pack of Heavy Naval B-Wings will decimate your drones, shred them into cores in mere seconds, drones for drones.

Ahem... You don't know what my drones are mounted on.

If I deploy 1/4th your titan's mass in drones you can say bye bye, simple as that. But of course, a titan will destroy 20 small drones, lol. You're basing your argument on size difference. What happens if I use a carrier as big as your titan, hmmmm? (hint: Your ship, boom )

Oh, and those suuuuuper slow nukes? PD turrets.

Ps: the spinning is only a side effect of the drones. Having it fixed won't change much.

Edit: normal heat seekers can't do shit against 100 drones. Trust me, I tried (100 drones raped my 60k mass ship equipped with swarms)

 

[Thalanor]

Malacodor yes that was no typo, these things exist - push pulse computer/module (item ids: 344 and 345). Their name however is misleading; they do not really push, but actually work as a "disable thrust temporarily" stun pulse.

Also I'd go as far and say nukes are completely worthless againt any quarter skilled pilot who has some PD turret coverage. Now that nukes additonally lost 66% damage (due to previously wrong calculations or something) they are not even viable at all right now, actually.

 

[Loadout]

nukes are still viable as drone weapons, but larger ships cannot benefit as much. reasoning is quite simple, drones will fire them en masse which unless screening of missiles is equally impressive at least some will go through. G ranted though, many more interceptor missiles will go through the same screening and hurt shields far more.

From my test results, it seems fast missile-beam combos (interceptors) are more effective vs shields. But, against hulls nothing really beats nukes, they simply spread too much damage across a huge area to effectively manage.

tldr: drone nukes rock! ship nukes... scissors.

keptick titan class drone carrier now that is a scary ship to face off against.

other notes: whenever I get true internet back I'll share my prototype tube rack launcher as well as my new modular drone launcher. both of which have passed initial testing with flying colors.

 

[Thalanor]

drone nukes rock! ship nukes... scissors.

:D
very true.

I am too much of a fan of 100% beam supported missiles after the change. The triple speed is just... godlike. However, what concerns me is their reload time; a drone swarm is only more effective than turrets if most drones get to fire their stuff more than once - which is more likely with a 50% beam support or something like that. If all drones only get to fire once before they are destroyed, the swarming behavior does not carry any profit except a short therm chaff purpose - turrets would have accomplished the same damage, since initially drones are not well spread out either.

When designing drones, keep in mind that if most of them get to fire at least twice, the effective gain is much higher (because their second shot happens when they are well distributed) than putting too much emphasis on alpha damage drones. My newer research seems to point heavily towards rapidfire missile drones, or drones with a maximum of 50% beam support, or a combination (current best prototype uses two systems, a rapidfire at 100% support and an interceptor missile at 100% to have the best of two worlds - FAST alpha damage and constant damage dribble). Missiles still are and probably remain THE weapon of choice for assault drones though - cannons are just laughable on small entities, and beams... are awesome on turrets that are designed to draw power from the mothership (using overdrive), but suck on drones with their own power supply.

 

[Loadout]

:D
very true.

I am too much of a fan of 100% beam supported missiles after the change. The triple speed is just... godlike. However, what concerns me is their reload time; a drone swarm is only more effective than turrets if most drones get to fire their stuff more than once - which is more likely with a 50% beam support or something like that. If all drones only get to fire once before they are destroyed, the swarming behavior does not carry any profit except a short therm chaff purpose - turrets would have accomplished the same damage, since initially drones are not well spread out either.

When designing drones, keep in mind that if most of them get to fire at least twice, the effective gain is much higher (because their second shot happens when they are well distributed) than putting too much emphasis on alpha damage drones. My newer research seems to point heavily towards rapidfire missile drones, or drones with a maximum of 50% beam support, or a combination (current best prototype uses two systems, a rapidfire at 100% support and an interceptor missile at 100% to have the best of two worlds - FAST alpha damage and constant damage dribble). Missiles still are and probably remain THE weapon of choice for assault drones though - cannons are just laughable on small entities, and beams... are awesome on turrets that are designed to draw power from the mothership (using overdrive), but suck on drones with their own power supply.

Agreed on rapidfire, Dps is generally more effective with swarms than Alpha. This does explain why the early generations were pretty much all alpha and the later gen tech is now more Dps oriented. Hadn't considered that particular connection, more thought of it just as people beginning to try new things rather than pure optimizations honestly.

I disagree on the beam part though, but not because it isn't entirely true. It's more about the usage of beams particularly those with explosive effects. It does make them more expensive but the potential gain is monstrous. The area damage of said beams is quite respectable even on drones, the real drawback comes from less direct damage more than anything else. As I see it each weapon plays a specific role in the usual rock-paper-scissors way.

Cannons offer the best possible direct penetration of any weapon making them great for coring IF you can get them to have enough damage.

Missiles offer direct explosive area damage that currently is very powerful even after the aoe nerf.

Beams right now have the third best area damage(damage pulse wins if you can use it properly), and the third best direct damage, even though they are technically worse than either of the other weapons they have the best of both worlds and can be altered to perform admirably either way. A sort of jack of all trades master of none sort of thing. This does imply that they are considerably more expensive to produce on a regular basis though.

In other news....some pics of my new modular drone launcher are finally uploaded!

Spoiler

Overview

Picture showing the tubes underneath, these contain an area trigger for activation.

close up of the arm structures...

You may notice that it uses both Push AND Pull, the reason is that I can use fewer total blocks to achieve the same directional movement of the rack when launched, and additionally have the rack be more stable. It basically keeps the rack aligned regardless of movement and makes sure it will always launch it's payload.

This design has been fitted onto my newest WIP carrier and is completely modular with a new turret mounting and also new armor plating I am designing.

 

[Snk]

*Raises hand* Is a docked armor plate a drone?

 

[Keptick]

*Raises hand* Is a docked armor plate a drone?

Eh, not really. Unless you can detatch it and it does something unpleasant to the enemy of course :P

 

[Thalanor]

Snk keptick From the Encyclopaedia of Space, Colonial Fleet Edition, Volume 57, Part IV, page 852:

"A drone is a ship-entity with at minimum a faction module and an active Bobby AI module set to "Ship" and without a jump drive or interior designed to be deployed in large quantities. Drones may be fitted with defensive effects when linked to logic only. A drone needs to have at least one tactical purpose, which can range from weapon systems over support and speciality systems up to a mere presence (chaff) purpose. Primary and secondary tactical systems as well as propulsion can be controlled by the AI OR/AND logic. Drones exhibit a thrust rating of above or including zero up to roughly one unit of thrust per mass, with permissible surplus when doubling as fighters. Dimensions and crafting materials used are often geared towards functionality. Deployment of drones can take the form of exchangable racks or single docking, depending on desired number and intended purpose. A drone's influence on the tactical scenario typically peaks within the first minute of deployment. Drones are currently intended for single-use."

As such, a docked armor plate is not a drone; it would qualify as modular equipment.

 

[Keptick]

Snk keptick From the Encyclopaedia of Space, Colonial Fleet Edition, Volume 57, Part IV, page 852:

"A drone is a ship-entity with at minimum a faction module and an active Bobby AI module set to "Ship" and without a jump drive or interior designed to be deployed in large quantities. Drones may be fitted with defensive effects when linked to logic only. A drone needs to have at least one tactical purpose, which can range from weapon systems over support and speciality systems up to a mere presence (chaff) purpose. Primary and secondary tactical systems as well as propulsion can be controlled by the AI OR/AND logic. Drones exhibit a thrust rating of above or including zero up to roughly one unit of thrust per mass, with permissible surplus when doubling as fighters. Dimensions and crafting materials used are often geared towards functionality. Deployment of drones can take the form of exchangable racks or single docking, depending on desired number and intended purpose. A drone's influence on the tactical scenario typically peaks within the first minute of deployment. Drones are currently intended for single-use."

As such, a docked armor plate is not a drone; it would qualify as modular equipment.

I'm adding that to the OP

 

[Loadout]

so after some tweaking i have managed to get a tube launcher with working rack design that uses minimal logic.

terrible image im sure, but i can only upload so fast via phone...

it's pretty simple, works well, and is usable with some modifications as a int or hangar. the larger version i have is capable of launching a full sized double deep dish rack of heavy drones a fair distance from the main ship.

it relies on the build up of momentum while attached to the rack in order to keep the drones moving. in effect its a catapult/ballista/slingshot for drones.

 

[Snk]

An idea: Boarding drones. Swarms of drones armed with stop and shield dream beams so you can board a target

 

[Keptick]

An idea: Boarding drones. Swarms of drones armed with stop and shield dream beams so you can board a target

Arming drones with shield drain is actually a pretty good idea. Shield drain has really really really good drain per block, plus it gives some back to the drone. And the insanely small range downside just doesn't matter with drones :D

 

[Snk]

Would stop effect be viable?

 

[Loadout]

Would stop effect be viable?

until ai can actually use shield drain im gonna say this would only possibly work with a logic system. it is perhaps doable but itd be a hassle to setup given the random firing while the drone is moving. essentially a non fleet action drone. kinda like skoomdrone with shield drain.

stop effect is wonderful. if you get it to be potent enough, then you can totally lock down most turrets and ships. my kuwaga drones specifically use stop for that purpose.

 

[kiddan]

Eh, not really. Unless you can detatch it and it does something unpleasant to the enemy of course :p

Collision damage drones! :D NOTE: keptick was replying to Snk asking if a dock armor plate was a drone. Forgot to multiquote...
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Arming drones with shield drain is actually a pretty good idea. Shield drain has really really really good drain per block, plus it gives some back to the drone. And the insanely small range downside just doesn't matter with drones :D

And hey! You could combine the draining beam with a damage beam for range and add an EMP effect (if possible with draining beams) to create Shutdown Drones :P

 

[Loadout]

Collision damage drones! :D NOTE: keptick was replying to Snk asking if a dock armor plate was a drone. Forgot to multiquote...
[DOUBLEPOST=1418864824,1418864639][/DOUBLEPOST]
And hey! You could combine the draining beam with a damage beam for range and add an EMP effect (if possible with draining beams) to create Shutdown Drones :p

At that point the drone would become a little too complicated to mass produce. Generally speaking drones are also very cheap, so having around 3 computers is the limit, otherwise it's simply too expensive.

Also EMP is better off as a mega weapon attached to a larger ship, otherwise it'll simply be overridden by the ships reactors. In other words it'll be useless if it's not huge. In order to actually get emp to be viable I had to create 2 x 10k block arrays one for cannons and the other for emp, the end result was about 1,000,000 energy damage per second. That just barely happens to be enough to stop most ships, especially larger ones....

Come to think of it though, super titan class vessels are going to be more difficult to acquire now with the new crafting system locked in. So EMP should be more viable in smaller arrays, but how small exactly is going to be up for grabs in the coming months. At least until an average ship size to effort ratio is established, then we can more accurately determine what the requirements will be.

Of course I can pretty much guarantee drones simply won't be strong enough even with smaller ship sizes running about.

TLDR? Reactors are OP. EMP needs mega cannons to overcome them.

 

[Malacodor]

Reactors are OP.

Because you can't deplete the power of a titan with a handful of drones?

 

[Loadout]

Because you can't deplete the power of a titan with a handful of drones?

Given that the titan has a minimum of 1 mil power regen... not possible with any standard deployable swarm. A large swarm of 60 would take about... 17k energy damage per drone. Much too large to be achieved as is. You would actually need approximately 700 blocks of nothing but cannons and emps to be able to do that, on top of which you would need the energy to power it. No current drone is large enough to accommodate that, although I'm sure it could be done it would take a considerable amount of time (and resources) to build that swarm. So definitely not a cheap swarm by any means =( which is kinda sad..

It would actually be much cheaper and easier to build a similarly powerful weapon onto a ship itself. Saving the drones for other effects as well as cheaper direct damage.