Universe Update Brainstorming

[OfficialCoding]

So I've been reading some rather old literature like this: Universe Update: Star Systems, Territory, and Space. Anyways, I've compiled my own list of things I would like to see (or see removed / not implemented) in The Universe Update. Feel free to add your own suggestions below

1) Remove Manual System Scanning. I don't like how you can just magically travel to 15 sectors and then have the whole system revealed. I think that scanning should only be able to be done with a Long Range Scanner Chamber.

2) DRASTICALLY reduce the number of stations that spawn in each system. Space just feels way to populated atm. I want maybe one or two NPC stations to spawn in each system.

3) Make systems spherical. This would kind of simulate IRL star systems.

4) Other obvious things like
• Better Planets,
• Fleets, AI, and Crew
• System / Galaxy Generation

Void Space between Star Systems

 

[Equilibrium21]

• Void Space between Star Systems

 

[SkylordLuke]

maximum height of galaxy: 2 systems
Reason: the current 8+ height is a mess and a clusterfu** to navigate ..Much easier to navigate the map screen with only max 2 height.
also.. when various factions start claiming territory,there will be a clear distinction of who owns what like in classical 2d space strategy games.

 

[OfficialCoding]

maximum height of galaxy: 2 systems
Reason: the current 8+ height is a mess and a clusterfu** to navigate ..Much easier to navigate the map screen with only max 2 height.
also.. when various factions start claiming territory,there will be a clear distinction of who owns what like in classical 2d space strategy games.

Maybe have a smaller ratio of Galaxy Width to Galaxy Height, but 2 systems is a bit short. Maybe make the galaxy 256 x 256 x 8 or something like that, and have cool things in the center of the galaxy

 

[jayman38]

If I had my way, I'd probably alter individual star systems like this:
Increase the system size to 32x32x32
Arrange planets, dwarf planets, moons, etc. into one or two planes (32x32) around the central star.
Replace 1 or 2 mid-range planets with a ring of asteroid sectors. Do the same at the outer-most orbit on the plane.
Place random asteroids randomly within each 4x4x4 block off the middle plane where the planets are.
Keep the middle of the star system above and below the star clear, with a 4x4 corridor running vertically through the star.
Place a trade station both at the top (zenith) and bottom (nadir) of this corridor if the system contains more than six planets.
Place a trade station near any earth-like planets with a 50% chance. (If it is earthlike, it will have a 50% chance of being colonized, with a trade station.)
On Earth-like planets with a station, place at least one random city and/or techno-pyramid.
On Earth-like planets without a station, place random creatures with a 50% chance. (About half of the uninhabited planets are uninhabited because of hostile natives.) Also have a 5% chance to place a random city or pyramid.
On other planets, 5% chance to place a station.
If not a station, then a 5% chance of a random creature.
If not a random creature or station, 15% chance of a pirate station.

Galaxies would be changed like this:
Each galaxy is 16 times as big on a side.
While each system is twice as big, place it randomly in a 4x4 "system-sized" area. This will "knock" each system out of the regular grid pattern enough to look a little more natural. This will also introduce more void between star systems. Maybe have the option in settings to allow more than 1 system in a 4x4 "area", depending on how close to the center of the galaxy that 4x4 area lies.
With these changes, each galaxy will be much bigger and have approximately 8x as many systems, due to having double the number of systems on each of its three axes.
Correction: I like the idea of a galaxy being only one or two systems (or in my case, 4x system sized areas, to allow exactly one system on the plane, but to be off the axis a little. At twice the system capacity on each side of the grid, each galaxy would have room for 4x as many systems on the galactic plane.
Every galaxy should have one (or two in a binary co-orbit) black hole(s) right in the center, with fun stuff like trade stations arranged just outside the "event horizon". This should probably be a starting point for a natural singularity-warp-gate system that travels all around the galaxy. This central area could be a focal point for several types of future options, events, and galactic features.
At the outer edge of the galaxy, beyond the edge systems, line the empty sectors surrounding a galaxy with a heavy pirate/threat presence. That way, each galaxy becomes an enclosed eco-system, encouraging players to remain in the galaxy, but allowing them out if they really, really want to. One can "punch out" of the galaxy to reach void space (again, Schine was planning something "fun" for deep void space at one point.) And if not "punch out", then run the blockade and out-run the pirates out into deep space. That could be fun too. Heck, blockade-running might become a new game type for some players.

 

[OfficialCoding]

If I had my way, I'd probably alter individual star systems like this:
Increase the system size to 32x32x32
Arrange planets, dwarf planets, moons, etc. into one or two planes (32x32) around the central star.
Replace 1 or 2 mid-range planets with a ring of asteroid sectors. Do the same at the outer-most orbit on the plane.
Place random asteroids randomly within each 4x4x4 block off the middle plane where the planets are.
Keep the middle of the star system above and below the star clear, with a 4x4 corridor running vertically through the star.
Place a trade station both at the top (zenith) and bottom (nadir) of this corridor if the system contains more than six planets.
Place a trade station near any earth-like planets with a 50% chance. (If it is earthlike, it will have a 50% chance of being colonized, with a trade station.)
On Earth-like planets with a station, place at least one random city and/or techno-pyramid.
On Earth-like planets without a station, place random creatures with a 50% chance. (About half of the uninhabited planets are uninhabited because of hostile natives.) Also have a 5% chance to place a random city or pyramid.
On other planets, 5% chance to place a station.
If not a station, then a 5% chance of a random creature.
If not a random creature or station, 15% chance of a pirate station.

Galaxies would be changed like this:
Each galaxy is 16 times as big on a side.
While each system is twice as big, place it randomly in a 4x4 "system-sized" area. This will "knock" each system out of the regular grid pattern enough to look a little more natural. This will also introduce more void between star systems. Maybe have the option in settings to allow more than 1 system in a 4x4 "area", depending on how close to the center of the galaxy that 4x4 area lies.
With these changes, each galaxy will be much bigger and have approximately 8x as many systems, due to having double the number of systems on each of its three axes.
Correction: I like the idea of a galaxy being only one or two systems (or in my case, 4x system sized areas, to allow exactly one system on the plane, but to be off the axis a little. At twice the system capacity on each side of the grid, each galaxy would have room for 4x as many systems on the galactic plane.
Every galaxy should have one (or two in a binary co-orbit) black hole(s) right in the center, with fun stuff like trade stations arranged just outside the "event horizon". This should probably be a starting point for a natural singularity-warp-gate system that travels all around the galaxy. This central area could be a focal point for several types of future options, events, and galactic features.
At the outer edge of the galaxy, beyond the edge systems, line the empty sectors surrounding a galaxy with a heavy pirate/threat presence. That way, each galaxy becomes an enclosed eco-system, encouraging players to remain in the galaxy, but allowing them out if they really, really want to. One can "punch out" of the galaxy to reach void space (again, Schine was planning something "fun" for deep void space at one point.) And if not "punch out", then run the blockade and out-run the pirates out into deep space. That could be fun too. Heck, blockade-running might become a new game type for some players.

Wow. This is fantastic. And to prevent people from just jumping past the pirates at the edge of the galaxy the pirates could utilize some sort of anti-jump or something to keep you from jumping to hyperspace.

 

[aceface]

last night happened to be having some thoughts of what could be good additions to the universe update.

i was thinking along these lines:
if you attack a player who your not at war with in npc system owned by an npc faction that despise criminal acts eg trading guild they will send a fleet to kill you. this fleet could be drastically buffed eg 10x damage, their weapons penetrate shields and armor also they could be straight up invulnerable - basically to enforce certain safe zones in a cooler way than straight up protected sectors.

you could then make it so these safe zones are not so economically viable eg theres little ore or bad paying missions. these more outward regions that are not dead centre in the galaxy where npcs usually are could have bigger mining bonus, better missions, better pirates to hunt with bigger bounties/ships (that obviously will yield more blocks when salvaged) - but you can be attacked. so carebear/roleplay/pve players can still play on the same server as hardcore pvp players but the people who want to pvp will get benefits for their hardcore attitude while the more carebear guys will get more of a peace of mind and focus more on building/roleplaying.

I also feel like there should be an emphasis on the first galaxy - to make player activity coincide more. The rest of the galaxies could lack most ore or necessary resources to survive and be haunted by some type of vicious alien race.

I think the galaxy should be smaller, I don't necessarily think there should be fewer systems in the galaxy, but I definitely think there should be way less systems that are profitable to own. eg max 50 systems not claimed by npcs that are very good, the rest are crap that you get barely any ore from.

i think that systems should not be able to be claimed by a homebase but some other mechanic that can be worked towards to make it not impossible to take over someones space (I don't mean someones homebase)

 

[OfficialCoding]

last night happened to be having some thoughts of what could be good additions to the universe update.

i was thinking along these lines:
if you attack a player who your not at war with in npc system owned by an npc faction that despise criminal acts eg trading guild they will send a fleet to kill you. this fleet could be drastically buffed eg 10x damage, their weapons penetrate shields and armor also they could be straight up invulnerable - basically to enforce certain safe zones in a cooler way than straight up protected sectors.

you could then make it so these safe zones are not so economically viable eg theres little ore or bad paying missions. these more outward regions that are not dead centre in the galaxy where npcs usually are could have bigger mining bonus, better missions, better pirates to hunt with bigger bounties/ships (that obviously will yield more blocks when salvaged) - but you can be attacked. so carebear/roleplay/pve players can still play on the same server as hardcore pvp players but the people who want to pvp will get benefits for their hardcore attitude while the more carebear guys will get more of a peace of mind and focus more on building/roleplaying.

I also feel like there should be an emphasis on the first galaxy - to make player activity coincide more. I don't necessarily think there should be fewer systems in the galaxy, but I definitely think there should be way less that are very profitable to own. eg max 50 systems not claimed by npcs that are very good, the rest are crap that you get barely any ore from.

i think that systems should not be able to be claimed by a homebase but some other mechanic that can be worked towards to make it not impossible to take over someones space (I don't mean someones homebase)

This is good. However, I don't know if i'd want the NPC ships sent to kill you to be invulnerable. Maybe they get a weapon and shield buff but they should still be killable.

 

[EricBlank]

3) Make systems spherical. This would kind of simulate IRL star systems.

• Void Space between Star Systems

• Use that space between the spherical star systems as "void space." Allow things like lost space stations/ships and rogue planets to rarely generate in these void sectors within and near to a galaxy, to be searched for by scanners.
• Make placement of those stars random in terms of what sector/"system" (the current cubes of 16^3 sectors) theyre placed in, like a gausian distribution would work, with their proximity to the center of the galaxy affecting density of stars placed (least dense at the outer edges, densest at the core). Then cull like 90% of stars generated between the "arms" of the galaxy. Irl, Sol, our system, is kinda between two arms of the milkyway iirc, and we arent alone here by any means, its just a lot less densely packed and flatter than the arms.
• Make the diameter of those spherical systems depend on two things: 1; the "mass" of the star its generated around (like a random number between 0 and 256 which is in solar masses where 0 is the minimum mass possible (like 79x jupiters mass or some shit, actually pretty small), 1 represents our suns mass and 256 is 256 times our suns mass which is pretty nuts tbh but maybe possible?, (this also determines what classes of star it could be, like you cant have a red supergiant half the mass of our sun)) and 2: its mass relative to the star nearest to it, such that two systems cannot share sectors, but its weighted towards the heavier object.

I know that could stack up to be a much longer galaxy generation process overall, but i, personally, feel a more complex galaxy would be more rewarding to explore. The fact that star systems would no longer be placed in a reliable, predictable grid or even size would make it more interesting to try and find those hidden by forces like nebulae or just not charted, especially if there are game mechanics that make them more desirable to find like extra resources in systems that have never been colonized. If you can find them too reliably just following the grid, the first guy on the server will go straight there and claim a bunch of them.
So, speaking of:

• Not all star systems in the galaxy should be inhabited or have things like shops and stations at the start of play. Systems closer to important npc factions should have higher density than average out of those that are inhabited.
• Systems that arent inhabited currently should have abandoned structures if they arent "virgin" territory.
• Some systems should be virgin territory with no signs of habitation, and fuller stocks of those resources available in them, because theyve never been mined.
• Some systems should be hidden by nebulae, or very small stars (less than 1 mass or otherwise very dim/dimmed by their own debris fields) should occasionally just go uncharted until found by a player.
• Systems with abandoned structures should have neat things left behind for us to find and take advantage of.
• Virgin systems could have a higher frequency of rare resources.
• Pirates should be generated near to systems which are inhabited, and never directly adjacent to any structures or planets that would be protected by law enforcement.

 

[Lone_Puppy]

I've had a few ideas over time that I would like to be involved in some way.
https://starmadedock.net/threads/starter-play-for-starmade-single-play-and-multi-player.29846/
https://starmadedock.net/threads/ai-offloading.29114/
https://starmadedock.net/threads/procedural-structure-generation.29969/
https://starmadedock.net/threads/seeing-cloaked-ships-while-cloaked.29820/
https://starmadedock.net/threads/creature-npc-spawn-block.29322/
https://starmadedock.net/threads/debris-entity.26199/

I would like more accurate navigation, where we can see as granular as down to the block of a sector.
Materialization at destination Warp Gates event hoirizon/opening rather than some random spot around the gate or in the sector. Seems weird have connected gates and the ship appears somewhere that's not the destination gate opening.

 

[aceface]

This is good. However, I don't know if i'd want the NPC ships sent to kill you to be invulnerable. Maybe they get a weapon and shield buff but they should still be killable.

I think they should, what I'm trying to get at is for a safe space for people, and instead of it being a boring protected sector or that your ship just magically explodes if you attack someone, it has a bit more sense in game. also gives the opportunity to kill someone in this protected space but you know you will die so have to make a choice.

 

[Skwidz]

I want space squids

 

[aceface]

Name checks out

 

[EricBlank]

I also want our crab monsters and space whales back tbh.

Actually what would be really amazing when we get around to having critters and stuff, is a creature entity programming modding utility. So we can make our own weird little monsters by drawing up and sticking together their body parts and joints (like even simple little rectangles and pyramids like the crab monster is made of) we can smack together and animate, and defining their behaviors. Like the spore creature creator, but for ugly space squares. :v

I feel like thats the most out there suggestion i can come up with tbh...

 

[OfficialCoding]

I also want our crab monsters and space whales back tbh.

Actually what would be really amazing when we get around to having critters and stuff, is a creature entity programming modding utility. So we can make our own weird little monsters by drawing up and sticking together their body parts and joints (like even simple little rectangles and pyramids like the crab monster is made of) we can smack together and animate, and defining their behaviors. Like the spore creature creator, but for ugly space squares. :v

I feel like thats the most out there suggestion i can come up with tbh...

Yay CHKN

 

[Lone_Puppy]

Bigger Galaxies would be another thing.
Player Spawning on a random planet in the Galaxy far away from other players.

 

[TheDerpGamerX]

I'm thinking that instead of having the galaxy be ordered in a grid space, have it be a 3d map with stars randomly generated in it, and you would select your destination based on what star system it was in. Once you entered a system, it would then be organized in a regular sector grid. Basically, if I wanted to go to a specific station in a specific star system, I would go to the map, select the star from the map (or a list) and then double click on it or something to open the sector view for it. The idea is to have a regular grid for sectors, but the systems that contain said sectors would not be in a grid, instead randomly placed throughout the galaxy. In order to compensate for having less stars, make the galaxy map a lot bigger but boost jump drive distance.

 

[Lone_Puppy]

With the space creatures, they could be NPC's that eat stuff and poop other stuff out that we can use.
Like maybe have them eat asteroids and poop out clusters of capsules.
Or their waste could be something completely different and rare depending on what they eat. Bringing rise to farming and different technologies.

 

[MacThule]

if you attack a player who your not at war with in npc system owned by an npc faction that despise criminal acts eg trading guild they will send a fleet to kill you. this fleet could be drastically buffed eg 10x damage, their weapons penetrate shields and armor also they could be straight up invulnerable - basically to enforce certain safe zones in a cooler way than straight up protected sectors.

Tradewars 2002 original style. Agreed; I've long wondered why this sort of thing isn't being used to protect and/or semi-protect regions of space rather than invulnerability. The same dynamic is how player-owned stations would be best buffed/protected as well - automated fleet response to attacks, as has been suggested by more than just me, IIRC.

Regarding OP:
1: Yes. It would be nice if there were even a higher level of LRS that could scan the system you are in as well as the 8 surrounding it. For recon craft.

2: Yes. I think that a random number from 0 to 5 stations, heavily weighted towards '1' per system would be ideal. Lots of empty and sparsely populated systems, and a handful of 'busy' trade hubs with 4-5 stations in them.

And yeah, as mentioned above by first respondent, void space between most systems would be nice.

Personally, I'm hoping they put some serious, serious planning into economics (i.e. eliminate credit sinks or devise a reasonable means of credit injection; make NPC traders actually charge for the value-added work of refinement and assembly rather than charging as much for a finished product as the sum of its raw materials... so players can participate in trade in a meaningful way). It would be nice if they shared their vision for the goal economic model and solicited general input; treat it as a core system rather than an afterthought, since a well-honed economy can seriously affect everything, including the value and cost of combat and various styles of combat.