Station Vulnerability Timers: An alternative to Standard and Reverse FP configs

[Shaker]

the OP put a topic up so we are debating its use, thats what the suggestions subforum is for.

my guess is Jasper1991 is one of the griefers looking to steamroll, my suggestion to him, go make a server with no homebase protection as it can currently be done by turning it off in the config file.
I guarantee that the server will be dead in a month, reduced to 1 titan rolling around to anyone who claims a sector or forgets to make a station name that looks like a NPC spawn.

to answer your questions/confusion

"Stations currently cant protect themselves from ships that are built for taking them on"
That all depends on how the station is build, if you are able to get decent defenses on your station and some decent shields then stations are more than capable of defending themselves.

you can build as much point defense as you want, its still going to fail against ships built purely for taking out a station. i can guarantee that larger players/factions will exploit this and no matter how small of a window you give them, players are going to get rolled.
If you want to test this, turn your HB invul off whenever you play for the next month, and announce it everytime you turn it off.

"veteran players will easily put big holes in newer players cauing repairs even if they are defending"
"Noob stations" as stated in this suggestion will have a much smaller time that they are vulnerable for, and this timer can be set for when a noob faction is able to be online and defend (e.g if their faction has a certain time that they are active during the day/week/whatever then they can set the timer to account for this)

same again, the size of the window doesnt matter, as soon as the time is figured out, everything is going to have a go at it. the server veterans who have the resource pools, are going to use it to force newer players to feed them or die. this in turn forces players to go further and further away from the main galaxy or to hide in the void. or join the biggest faction and keep the cycle of stomping.

"Reverse FP is a good idea, but it needs a reason for gaining FP."
Reverse FP configs currently provide a reason to gain RP, so I am confused by this statement

that doesnt answer my question, what can i do with it when ive got 130,000 FP? there is only 1 reason to gain FP, to keep the HB invul, once you have so much of it then what? it serves no purpose once in surplus.
Panpiper 's idea of maintenance (even tho i hate the idea) does give a purpose to FP, i do like the idea of using it to upgrade/hire NPCs tho.

"Anyways i think reverse FP is coming as there is noway those NPC factions can take that many systems of the galaxy"
I think a dev blog mentioned something about NPC factions being able to expand, additionally reverse FP is already here, its not coming, once again I am confused by your reply

FP can be changed in the config to allow reverse FP, some servers have already done so. id guess that your a player, not an admin so hopefully that fixes your confusion.
I havent checked if HB invul can have a cost, if it can combined with reverse FP and having to control 2-3 sectors to maintain FP for invul protection could work, it would at least give that griefer some work to do before he can just shred players off the server.

 

[Jasper1991]

the OP put a topic up so we are debating its use, thats what the suggestions subforum is for.

my guess is Jasper1991 is one of the griefers looking to steamroll, my suggestion to him, go make a server with no homebase protection as it can currently be done by turning it off in the config file.
I guarantee that the server will be dead in a month, reduced to 1 titan rolling around to anyone who claims a sector or forgets to make a station name that looks like a NPC spawn.

to answer your questions/confusion


you can build as much point defense as you want, its still going to fail against ships built purely for taking out a station. i can guarantee that larger players/factions will exploit this and no matter how small of a window you give them, players are going to get rolled.
If you want to test this, turn your HB invul off whenever you play for the next month, and announce it everytime you turn it off.



same again, the size of the window doesnt matter, as soon as the time is figured out, everything is going to have a go at it. the server veterans who have the resource pools, are going to use it to force newer players to feed them or die. this in turn forces players to go further and further away from the main galaxy or to hide in the void. or join the biggest faction and keep the cycle of stomping.



that doesnt answer my question, what can i do with it when ive got 130,000 FP? there is only 1 reason to gain FP, to keep the HB invul, once you have so much of it then what? it serves no purpose once in surplus.
Panpiper 's idea of maintenance (even tho i hate the idea) does give a purpose to FP, i do like the idea of using it to upgrade/hire NPCs tho.



FP can be changed in the config to allow reverse FP, some servers have already done so. id guess that your a player, not an admin so hopefully that fixes your confusion.
I havent checked if HB invul can have a cost, if it can combined with reverse FP and having to control 2-3 sectors to maintain FP for invul protection could work, it would at least give that griefer some work to do before he can just shred players off the server.

Thank you for your clarifacations

As to counter your points I will firstly say that it seems you are confusing the word "griefier" with a "person who actively participates in PvP" now like I have said several times, this, like all other configs is opt in, if a server does not want/like the gameplay this system encourages then the admin is under no obligation to implement it into their server. As for the player, if they want to play on a server that uses the system I am proposing they they at should know what they are getting into, I think that is the job of the server admins putting an MOTD saying "Hey, we use [insert config playstyle here] on this server, please understand that this is what you are getting into by joining this server and this is the kind of gameplay we encourage"

If a player knows what they are getting into and they are destroyed by a PvP faction (which can be avoided until said player is able to take on that PvP faction) then that is the fault of the player who knowingly chose to enter the server where that gameplay is encouraged by the server owners/admins, not the fault of the gameplay said owners/admins encourage.

If they did not know that this was the system they were getting into then that is the fault of the server owners/admins who did not communicate with their players about what kind of gameplay they encourage, not the fault of the gameplay they encourage.


Now I know very well that not *every single server* will use this config, so if a player wants reverse fp or turtling gameplay over STVS gameplay then they are more than able to simply join a server that encourages the gameplay they want, if people want STVS gameplay then let they can join a server that encourages that kind of gameplay.

I can quote a Schine dev stating in a dev blog that the idea behind StarMade is to customize your server configs to make your own experience.

Keep in mind that this suggestion is aimed at people who want this kind of gameplay, reverse fp and turtling gameplay have their problems and so does STVS, people should be allowed to pick what gameplay they want to get involved in by joining a server the aligns with the players gameplay choices. I have no intention of changing that.

 

[Shaker]

as long as its an option, craftau will definitely have it turned off as we welcome new players and try our best to not limit players ability to play multiple styles.

 

[jijiji]

Great idea! Can't wait to see it ingame. It's borrow to be unable to attack enemy station, because most of them have only one invulnerable station!

I think that this idea + this idea = great balanced change which will make this game a lot more fun.

Cause you can avoid any enemy attack inside your homebase. And you can't attack enemy home too. You have to waste time to find undocked enemy ship. It's borrow!

 

[Panpiper]

Great idea! Can't wait to see it ingame. It's borrow to be unable to attack enemy station, because most of them have only one invulnerable station!

I think that this idea + this idea = great balanced change which will make this game a lot more fun.

Cause you can avoid any enemy attack inside your homebase. And you can't attack enemy home too. You have to waste time to find undocked enemy ship. It's borrow!

You are a family person, you have a life. You can play a few hours a week. You have a miner, a 50K mass cruiser, and a station. You've spent lots of time lovingly constructing this, planning to someday soon build a 100K mass ship.

I have no life. I play 12 hours a day, mostly mining and piling together a 500K mass titan sized newb cube. I Rule! To prove I rule I come visit your station during your vulnerability window and blow everything you have built to smitherines. I Rule! Clearly you do not know how to play the game.

 

[philthy mcnasty]

You are a family person, you have a life. You can play a few hours a week. You have a miner, a 50K mass cruiser, and a station. You've spent lots of time lovingly constructing this, planning to someday soon build a 100K mass ship.

I have no life. I play 12 hours a day, mostly mining and piling together a 500K mass titan sized newb cube. I Rule! To prove I rule I come visit your station during your vulnerability window and blow everything you have built to smitherines. I Rule! Clearly you do not know how to play the game.

Here is another one: I am a griefer, i hate everyone because i am a ginger. Griefing is in my blood. My ancestors griefed the Romans so hard that the built a wall to keep them out. I MUST grief, it is in my genes, so i giref in videogames. Today's grief, I use a stealth ship and a welder to break into your faction's station, break your faction blocks, and steal your station from you. I then build anti astronaut turrets in my new station, to keep you out. I planed this out for weeks, i know when everyone is busy in the real world with life, and i am doing this because i can.


Every faction needs an indestructible base. A safe anti griefer place.


The issue here, is that OP and others need to brush up on their naval warfare. If a target is hiding in a safe harbor, then you blockade them in. We have the fleet AI that makes this possible: you make small cheap fighter fleets, and you tell them to defensively idle around a station away from sniper missiles. I think this is very possible now, as i have noticed that in the recent updates that the pirates are using the cloakers on their ships.


I think that what we need to push, and what the devs already have on their big list of things to do, is smarter AI. We need to be able to tell a fleet to blockade a station, or to hunt down a "faction most wanted" ship.

The problem with writing game AI, is that it is going to be complicated. They are going to have to understand what players do in the game, and this changes as features and balance updates come out.

 

[jijiji]

You are a family person, you have a life. You can play a few hours a week. You have a miner, a 50K mass cruiser, and a station. You've spent lots of time lovingly constructing this, planning to someday soon build a 100K mass ship.

I have no life. I play 12 hours a day, mostly mining and piling together a 500K mass titan sized newb cube. I Rule! To prove I rule I come visit your station during your vulnerability window and blow everything you have built to smitherines. I Rule! Clearly you do not know how to play the game.

Here is another one: I am a griefer, i hate everyone because i am a ginger. Griefing is in my blood. My ancestors griefed the Romans so hard that the built a wall to keep them out. I MUST grief, it is in my genes, so i giref in videogames. Today's grief, I use a stealth ship and a welder to break into your faction's station, break your faction blocks, and steal your station from you. I then build anti astronaut turrets in my new station, to keep you out. I planed this out for weeks, i know when everyone is busy in the real world with life, and i am doing this because i can.


Every faction needs an indestructible base. A safe anti griefer place.


The issue here, is that OP and others need to brush up on their naval warfare. If a target is hiding in a safe harbor, then you blockade them in. We have the fleet AI that makes this possible: you make small cheap fighter fleets, and you tell them to defensively idle around a station away from sniper missiles. I think this is very possible now, as i have noticed that in the recent updates that the pirates are using the cloakers on their ships.


I think that what we need to push, and what the devs already have on their big list of things to do, is smarter AI. We need to be able to tell a fleet to blockade a station, or to hunt down a "faction most wanted" ship.

The problem with writing game AI, is that it is going to be complicated. They are going to have to understand what players do in the game, and this changes as features and balance updates come out.

Relax, I understand this things. But inv home is borrow for me, cause you have to waste time to pvp. I am not a pirat and won't attack everybody. I want to find only my enemies. When you're a pirat, it is much easier. But I am not.

I can suggest new way to make it fun for anybody:

• Players can choose invulnerability of station.
• If they want it to be unvulnerable, station's properties will fall down. For example, penalty of power 90%. Or may be disabling turrets.
• If they want station to be vulnerable, it's properties will raise. Power softcap will start at 30m. Shield and armor will be 5x stronger. Or may be resource bonus. It must to depend on time of vulnerability (15 min - 24 hours). Vulnerability must to be encouraged.

So everybody will get what he want.

I want to make my station vulnerable for 1 hour per day, or 2 hours per 2 days and receive some bonus. But now it's impossible.

 

[philthy mcnasty]

If there was say, a massive hub station at 2,2,2 that every player spawned at, i would not mind this. It would also be nice if there was a "star bank" with the traders guild, and you can put emergency money in it to make sure your ship is ok. If we had those, then making stations destroy able would be an acceptable option.

As it stands i am reminded of too many games like this one, where griefers destroyed the online scene before the game could take off.