Time to Revisit the Ban on Factories on Ships?

[Lecic]

Ahh yes Forgot to add that its likely they will make it so that factioned stations/HB stuff gets pulled out of the game (I.E unkillable) during times of low member count (Depending on how many players) So 20 player factions require 5 players to be on in order to be attackable.

So, exactly like I said, encourages people to NOT play the game. "Well, we know this faction is going to steamroll us if too many of us log in, so I guess we won't do that anymore." Does that sound like a fun experience?

Faction homebases being invincible is NOT a problem. The problem is that there's no reason to make more stations besides your HB.

As for lecic i'd love to remind him that GenXnova has 500K block ships and 5 million block station limits which allow for more dinamic gameplay since stations are very very hard to kill with a 500K block ship....

Congrats, that's not how the vanilla game works. That'd be like Mojang saying, "We're adding this new sword to Minecraft that does 90 damage a swing. This is balanced because of this mod with armor that blocks 87.5 damage."

 

[Zackey_TNT]

So, exactly like I said, encourages people to NOT play the game. "Well, we know this faction is going to steamroll us if too many of us log in, so I guess we won't do that anymore." Does that sound like a fun experience?

Faction homebases being invincible is NOT a problem. The problem is that there's no reason to make more stations besides your HB.



Congrats, that's not how the vanilla game works. That'd be like Mojang saying, "We're adding this new sword to Minecraft that does 90 damage a swing. This is balanced because of this mod with armor that blocks 87.5 damage."

This isn't a sword from minecraft this is a server config to switch between hardcore mode (attackable HB) and normal mode

Problem being here ya'll be PVEin with a liite pvp while others whom are hardcore PVP think that HB should be attackable and while thats all great and fine it needs to be a config option because like you are clearly demonstrating there are people whom dislike the idea thus servers can opt in or out depending on how they want to play the game.

There are still people who believe the old turret system was better and thats partly why there's a config for that too...

Anyways we are massivly off topic back onto the subject of factories on ships

 

[jorgekorke]

Anyways we are massivly off topic back onto the subject of factories on ships

Don't worry, I'll elaborate a thread.

 

[Zackey_TNT]

Don't worry, I'll elaborate a thread.

I suggest leaving that until the game matures and we get a clear picture of what direction the game is going in to start debating if we want attackable homebases.

 

[max stripe]

Not for long... Plans for the game will continue to evolve and i assure you homebase problems are being poofed at some point...

Besides that like i just said it confines that person to one point in the galaxy were everyone knows that person is going to be when not raiding thus blockading and assassination are possible.

are you telling me you acually park at your home base?
i never park at my base. i generaly park in the outer rim

 

[Zackey_TNT]

are you telling me you acually park at your home base?
i never park at my base. i generaly park in the outer rim

No, If i was a lone wolf (Im not i've got a faction to look after) i'd set my homebase at -999 -999 -999 or so with auto heatseeker spam so anyone attacking would be blown out da water and then set up at like 5665 4323 6543 as random as i could make it.

 

[max stripe]

No, If i was a lone wolf (Im not i've got a faction to look after) i'd set my homebase at -999 -999 -999 or so with auto heatseeker spam so anyone attacking would be blown out da water and then set up at like 5665 4323 6543 as random as i could make it.

even when im in a larger faction i park outside the faction base
helps alot in keeping classified things classified

 

[Zackey_TNT]

even when im in a larger faction i park outside the faction base
helps alot in keeping classified things classified

And you are the leader of this faction? no? Then you wont understand how important it is to teach new players every part of the game in the first 15 minutes before their attention is gone and they leave the game.

Besides that my homebase is where my factories are and i produce all the blocks people need to be building.

 

[max stripe]

And you are the leader of this faction? no? Then you wont understand how important it is to teach new players every part of the game in the first 15 minutes before their attention is gone and they leave the game.

Besides that my homebase is where my factories are and i produce all the blocks people need to be building.

interesting

 

[EMC007]

I feel that if factories were to be allowed on ships they should

A) require absurd amounts of power

B) increase the mass massively

C) require your ship to be stopped while operating

And finally

D) allow torches to do more damage (just an idea, not required)

To be honest though, I don't really feel like ships should be allowed to have factories on them, I love the idea of needing a base of operations to do everything, which is why I'm hyped about the upcoming shipyard update.

And I like the way homebases are now, so I hope they keep them that way.

 

[Zackey_TNT]

interesting

Homebases are the rallypoint of a public faction and can often be the most important station for the faction and if you are running a faction being with your team is often more important then keeping stuff from public view.

 

[kiraen]

I see no problem with factory ships. One of my favorite books takes place on a military repair ship. The thing is massive and requires three times the power to go one fourth the speed of a commercial vessels. And that is with military grade engines. It's also one of kind, more of an accident through retrofitting then actually designed. The price tag on the thing was beyond ludicrous. It was completely unarmed and only carried basic meteor/radiation shielding.

A full fledged factory ship is not a combat vessel but it will rival any titan in size and internal volume.

If your ship has a full factory and is completely combat capable we're talking Death Star size. And it's going to take a lot of other infrastructure to get you there. Not to mention time. It's not like these things are going to be popping out of a shipyard. Assuming a shipyard of sufficient size even exists. Assuming you can get the resources together. A shipyard capable of this would have been as major a construction project as the combat factory itself, requiring at least as much infrastructure. And time.

Any faction that can build a fully combat capable complete factory ship should be revered as elite players. If a single player manages it, then s/he is a god. Great for bragging rights, but pretty pointless in the long run.

We are a long way from the above concepts to be true, but that is how I envision factory ships. To make this work factories need to have increased mass. The volume of a factory set-up should also be increased. Most factory machinery I've seen is massive and weighs a (literal) ton. Adding actual pipes would go a long way to addressing both of these issues.

If factories require more power, that's fine. But it should have nothing to do with whether it's on a ship or not. Regardless of the requirements, it's going to be drawing from the same capacitors as the shields, weapons and engines. If you are wasting power making Grey Hull in the middle of combat, you're crippling yourself and deserve a Darwin Award.

Torches are completely off topic and irrelevant, as is home base vulnerability.

On a slightly tangent, why do most people assume that a ship has to be combat capable?

 

[Zackey_TNT]

I see no problem with factory ships. One of my favorite books takes place on a military repair ship. The thing is massive and requires three times the power to go one fourth the speed of a commercial vessels. And that is with military grade engines. It's also one of kind, more of an accident through retrofitting then actually designed. The price tag on the thing was beyond ludicrous. It was completely unarmed and only carried basic meteor/radiation shielding.

A full fledged factory ship is not a combat vessel but it will rival any titan in size and internal volume.

If your ship has a full factory and is completely combat capable we're talking Death Star size. And it's going to take a lot of other infrastructure to get you there. Not to mention time. It's not like these things are going to be popping out of a shipyard. Assuming a shipyard of sufficient size even exists. Assuming you can get the resources together. A shipyard capable of this would have been as major a construction project as the combat factory itself, requiring at least as much infrastructure. And time.

Any faction that can build a fully combat capable complete factory ship should be revered as elite players. If a single player manages it, then s/he is a god. Great for bragging rights, but pretty pointless in the long run.

We are a long way from the above concepts to be true, but that is how I envision factory ships. To make this work factories need to have increased mass. The volume of a factory set-up should also be increased. Most factory machinery I've seen is massive and weighs a (literal) ton. Adding actual pipes would go a long way to addressing both of these issues.

If factories require more power, that's fine. But it should have nothing to do with whether it's on a ship or not. Regardless of the requirements, it's going to be drawing from the same capacitors as the shields, weapons and engines. If you are wasting power making Grey Hull in the middle of combat, you're crippling yourself and deserve a Darwin Award.

Torches are completely off topic and irrelevant, as is home base vulnerability.

On a slightly tangent, why do most people assume that a ship has to be combat capable?

Don't assume I can get 10 billion in one hour using shops.

 

[kiraen]

Don't assume I can get 10 billion in one hour using shops.

I don't. But I am confused. What is the relavence of this statement?

 

[Zackey_TNT]

I don't. But I am confused. What is the relavence of this statement?

*If your ship has a full factory and is completely combat capable we're talking Death Star size. And it's going to take a lot of other infrastructure to get you there. Not to mention time. It's not like these things are going to be popping out of a shipyard. Assuming a shipyard of sufficient size even exists. Assuming you can get the resources together. A shipyard capable of this would have been as major a construction project as the combat factory itself, requiring at least as much infrastructure. And time.*

This is false it would take me about 5 mins to pop out a 4 million block station and an hour at most first starting out.

 

[kiraen]

First,

We are a long way from the above concepts to be true, but that is how I envision factory ships.

Second, how do you get 4 million blocks in 5 minutes of joining a server without admin commands? That's quite impressive and I can only guess Shine will fix that bug and/or balance issue. I mean seriously, what would be the point of playing?

 

[Zackey_TNT]

First,


Second, how do you get 4 million blocks in 5 minutes of joining a server without admin commands? That's quite impressive and I can only guess Shine will fix that bug and/or balance issue. I mean seriously, what would be the point of playing?

Five minutes currently an hour when first joining.

The econ of starmade is currently stupidly broken if you know what you are doing.

 

[Zaphord]

If I were to build such a ship, it would be comparable to Red Dwarf, which is 11 km long by 6 km wide by 5.5 km tall! That's gargantuant! Plus it has no weapons seeing as it's a dedicated mining ship. It would have to rely on smaller ships to defend it, would move like a slug, and manuver like a cow in a shopping cart. I see no combat advantage here.
[DOUBLEPOST=1439979718,1439979370][/DOUBLEPOST]Just a thought, once the cargo update kicks in you'd also need vast amounts of room to carry your raw materials for a factory ship, making a combat capable one even less likely since most of the interior would be devoted to cargo space.

 

[CyberTao]

I'm too lazy and tired to bother reading through this, cause it feels like some people got distracted.

From what I can recall, factories on ships is planned as part of the capital ship system and will induce a speed penalty for having many of them. I remember this because "Muh Stations".

Why dont we have it yet? Probably a broken economy (It is kinda broken to shit still) and starting difficulty curve (why even bother with a early game station?) are the main things.

 

[Valiant70]

Here's my two cents: Allow factories on ships, but not factory enhancers.