What do you think about the new shield system?

[Mariux]

While it is pretty annoying having to update all the ships, I think this will be better for everyone in the long run

 

[Winterhome]

I like the concept.

Space superiority fighters with high recharges vs. bombers with high capacities for surviving single runs and returning to the carrier.

 

[Guard13007]

Why did you even put "I accept the first answer without reading it." ? You're just inviting the three of us that did that to do that...

In all seriousness, I think this may add some difficultly in designing fighters, but overall is a good addition. As always there just needs to more balancing and it will eventually get there. I just hope we can get spawn points on vessels and maybe some sort of partial shield penetration with missiles (I like the idea of having them be a little more effective than they currently are, but then again I haven't played all that much combat in the latest versions so maybe I'm out of date there).

 

[ToyotaSupra]

Why did you even put "I accept the first answer without reading it." ? You're just inviting the three of us that did that to do that...

In all seriousness, I think this may add some difficultly in designing fighters, but overall is a good addition. As always there just needs to more balancing and it will eventually get there. I just hope we can get spawn points on vessels and maybe some sort of partial shield penetration with missiles (I like the idea of having them be a little more effective than they currently are, but then again I haven't played all that much combat in the latest versions so maybe I'm out of date there).

Coz people do it and it irritates me.

Spawn points on ships I'd love as well, but it's unlikely to happen due to glitches from spawning at high speed, the same reason we can't have plex lifters on ships (Even though that would also be a useful and logical addition too.) People would throw hissy fits as well.

You can get get anti shield rockets: Add a ion (Or emp can't remember) effect to the rocket computer.

 

[Guard13007]

I honestly didn't think anyone blindly voted like that, I only did it this once because I thought it was funny. Not so funny now. :/

You can get get anti shield rockets: Add a ion (Or emp can't remember) effect to the rocket computer.

You misunderstand, I don't want anti-shield rockets, I want missiles that damage blocks partially and damage shields partially, instead of having to have shields down to damage blocks.

 

[Legolas170]

Post update, I think the system works great. This combined with the modules creates very interesting combonations for ship construction. The real question with the fighter debate is: What do you consider to be a fighter? My heavy fighters are on the larger scale around 20 blocks max dimentions. And they work fine. With the addition of remove filters, replacing is easy, and the shields are basically the same, seeing as 50 regen blocks and 50 capacity blocks is equal to 100 old-shields. This just adds more customisability

 

[BeefBacon]

I'm not sure what the concern is surrounding fighters. Currently the only weapons that are effective against them are other fighters and missiles. Regular AMCs are too inaccurate and beams are too short-ranged. The vulnerability of fighters against missiles makes me hope for a countermeasure system.

I like the new shields. I'm still an advocate for a constant power-drain while shields are active, but this is definitely a step in the right direction.

 

[Solarquatic]

After messing around with fighters for awhile (I build fighters to be under 20 mass) I have to say that they seem to end up being zero-hull ships except for an outside frame, because of the size requirements only for weapons/effects balance. I have no idea how people are even going to fit the blocks for shield regen/cap on a fighter, much less supply the power. Should fighters just opt out of shields entirely and focus on an alternate defense system? (Hull Damage reduction effect anyone?)

On the topic of effects, you can make more shields better just by throwing on an Ion effect for your ship. It's not like big ships really need the hull benefits of not using it. I'm wondering why more people aren't considering effects when discussing the shield/hull and big/small ship balance.

 

[Sven_The_Slayer]

I'm not sure what the concern is surrounding fighters. Currently the only weapons that are effective against them are other fighters and missiles. Regular AMCs are too inaccurate and beams are too short-ranged. The vulnerability of fighters against missiles makes me hope for a countermeasure system.

I like the new shields. I'm still an advocate for a constant power-drain while shields are active, but this is definitely a step in the right direction.

• The default AI accuracy is SOO bad... A better default may be warranted. I'm still messing with that setting myself.
• Yes on counter measures
• I like the split too and I agree with shields needing power in theory but it would require a rebalance of the power systems as an added drain has consequences on everything else that uses power. I also feel that 5-10sec shields @ 1:1 shield:weapons ratio is far too underpowered.

 

[BeefBacon]

• The default AI accuracy is SOO bad... A better default may be warranted. I'm still messing with that setting myself.

I think part of the problem is that the AI can't aim ahead of a moving target. Having 100% AI accuracy is actually worse because all of their shots will completely miss a moving target. Hopefully the AI's targeting will be improved to take movement into account.

 

[der_scheme]

I think part of the problem is that the AI can't aim ahead of a moving target. Having 100% AI accuracy is actually worse because all of their shots will completely miss a moving target. Hopefully the AI's targeting will be improved to take movement into account.

Was that removed? Because they certainly could hit targets moving on a constant vector without problems before 0.15*.

 

[BeefBacon]

Was that removed? Because they certainly could hit targets moving on a constant vector without problems before 0.15*.

I guess it must have been. I can't think what else would account for turrets being incapable of hitting their targets, even with 100% accuracy. I'll have to do some tests... or somebody who's more proactive should do some tests. That's what I really mean.

 

[Qweesdy]

• The default AI accuracy is SOO bad... A better default may be warranted. I'm still messing with that setting myself.
• Yes on counter measures
• I like the split too and I agree with shields needing power in theory but it would require a rebalance of the power systems as an added drain has consequences on everything else that uses power. I also feel that 5-10sec shields @ 1:1 shield:weapons ratio is far too underpowered.

I agree with all of this!

However, I still want information about how ion effect is supposed to work as a defensive effect (to reduce damage taken by shields). In theory the ion effect may help fix the shield capacity problem while also adding a "need power to maintain" aspect to it.

Note: if ion effect reduced damage taken to shields by 50%, then it'd be equivalent to doubling the shield capacity and doubling the regen. For example; with no ion effect 10000 shield capacity and 100 s/sec regen would be able to take 10000 damage and would regenerate in 100 seconds; and with ion effect reducing damage by 50% you could have 5000 shield capacity and 50 s/sec regen, and still take the same 10000 damage and regenerate shields in the same 100 seconds.

Of course at the moment this is entirely buggy, when the bugs are fixed it'll be extremely unbalanced (under-powered?), and if it's "balanced" it'll just become unbalanced in the opposite direction (over-powered?). Maybe in another 6 months time we might be able to determine how ion effect influences shield balance.

 

[Cornedo]

What did you think alpha meant ? The game is still in the early stage of construction. It's expected to break the combat ability of ships every few updates as stuff is being added or revamped. But it's not like any updates broke hulls so far. Maybe keep blueprints of your ship hulls before stuffing them with modules ?

That only works if you finish the outer hull before you really start filling it in.

 

[marshrover]

Honestly I still the only way to obtain proper balance in combat is to remove combat regen. This will ensure that one ship will always die and that there will never be a stalemate unless you both manage to disable the other ships guns before they die. The amount of regen you have compared to your capacity could determine how long are stuck in the no regen state during combat.

I disagree. On my small fighters I only put minimal shields but as much regen as I can fit. This makes them capable of surviving a hit from another fighter but not from a capital's anti-fighter turret since the shield capacity is too low and regen doesn't matter when the shields are already drained.

You misunderstand, I don't want anti-shield rockets, I want missiles that damage blocks partially and damage shields partially, instead of having to have shields down to damage blocks.

Put 50% Ion effect.

 

[Qweesdy]

Put 50% Ion effect.

I think you still misunderstand.

Normal missiles do 50% of their damage to shields when the shields are up; and if the shields are down they do 50% of their damage to blocks.

With 50% ion effect; missiles would do 75% of their damage to shields when the shields are up; and if the shields are down they do 25% of their damage to blocks.

What Guard13007 wants is missiles that do 50% of their damage to shields and 50% of their damage to hulls when the shields are up; and 50% of damage to hulls when shields are down.

Note: I'm not saying that I think what Guard13007 wants is a good idea. Anyone that's attempted to repair a large ship will be able to guess how I'd feel about having to repair after a minor fight with a single weeny little pirate bomber.

 

[marshrover]

I think you still misunderstand.

Normal missiles do 50% of their damage to shields when the shields are up; and if the shields are down they do 50% of their damage to blocks.

With 50% ion effect; missiles would do 75% of their damage to shields when the shields are up; and if the shields are down they do 25% of their damage to blocks.

What Guard13007 wants is missiles that do 50% of their damage to shields and 50% of their damage to hulls when the shields are up; and 50% of damage to hulls when shields are down.

Note: I'm not saying that I think what Guard13007 wants is a good idea. Anyone that's attempted to repair a large ship will be able to guess how I'd feel about having to repair after a minor fight with a single weeny little pirate bomber.

Oh, now I understand.

 

[OverlordDarkWolf]

Well, I just tried the new system after the regen buff, and my ship with 13589599.1 power capacity and 1073367.6 power regen now cannot sustain 1278126 Shield cap and 40936 shield regen. My transport pods are the same way with their power (default cap and 238 regen) and shields (163 cap and 16 regen). So this means that my battlecruiser build, at round currently 15000 mass (20000 it would have been when completed) Will have to have its interior gutted for more power regen block. With this whole constant drain for shield power, it seems I may have to make a bigger ship than I want if I want an interior and usability.

EDIT: Upon further experimentation, I found out that My power regen must increase along with shield regen. I am a moron. Ah well, live and learn. Starting to get used to the new shield system, though.

 

[Ithirahad]

I like this, but it's kind of underpowered. Shield regen is okay (It's weak, but ships shouldn't strategically rely on regen; that's silly.), but capacity needs to be about twice its current value, if not more.

 

[Guard13007]

What Guard13007 wants is missiles that do 50% of their damage to shields and 50% of their damage to hulls when the shields are up; and 50% of damage to hulls when shields are down.

Note: I'm not saying that I think what Guard13007 wants is a good idea. Anyone that's attempted to repair a large ship will be able to guess how I'd feel about having to repair after a minor fight with a single weeny little pirate bomber.

Yes that is what I mean, and I know it would get very annoying which is why if it did come about it should be optional and probably disabled by default. I just want it available.