Torpedo Bombers

[Rixit]

"Just make it bigger," I foresee titans on your server that fire moon-sized torpedoes which can one-shot other titans. If you can make a titan you can afford a few warheads.

The bomber-sized torpedoes, even with the amped-up warheads seem to be easily countered by good old spaced armor. Of course, now I'm thinking of a two-stage torpedo that uses a push beam to launch a secondary payload from the drive section 0.5 second after impact, hopefully into the hole...gtg.

Ya it is making me want to join that server for actually making a weapon that takes skill and logic worth while.

Instead of just buying more cannon/missile modules and stacking them.

Torpedo = Real Missile

If AI module was enhanced you could almost completely remove the magical appearing missiles.
It makes kinda sense for beams to come from a block but... missiles?

Cannons should require ammo.

Guess just my personal opinion after playing Aurora too much..
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2433..._intergalactic_exploration_and_expansion.html

Too much of actually designing missiles.

 

[Spartan-228]

If that armor had been say only three meters thick and then subsystems, the hole would have been meany times bigger

 

[Gristle]

Rixit makes some valid points but uses some bad examples. Better examples would be the rise of the carrier and fading of the battleship as the center of naval formations during WWII. There are plenty of examples during WWII of fighter bombers crippling or sinking large capital ships.


it's LOSE not LOOS. Loos is more than one toilet.

 

[Lecic]

Or, maybe you should build titans that can actually take damage, instead of look pretty.

You mean build bricks? Yeah, that's a ton of fun.

Hey, who wants to see my brand new ship killer? Absolutely minimal cost for ridiculous gain.
[DOUBLEPOST=1441427245,1441424210][/DOUBLEPOST]

The distances between the docked warhead lines may be a bit off, but the base is there. A cheap cloaker with 100% overdrive, a scanner, a fast jump drive, and storages for spare warheads. It'll probably kill anything small on that server, and put a nasty hole in things even with thick armor.

 

[sayerulz]

Not everyone wants to have to build gigantic flying paper weights with super thick armor. I think I will stick to ships that look good thank you very much. The whole point of the game is creative freedom to build after all.

As Lecic did an exellent job of pointing out, super buffed warheads like this mean that something that took ten minuets of effort and a tiny bit of resources can destroy hours of work and a huge amount of resources. No matter how much WWII logic you use, that is not balanced.

If you use anywhere near a titans cost in fighters, however, then you have a good chance of at least severely damaging it. All that is needed is improved AI to make such mass deployments practical.

 

[Lecic]

If you use anywhere near a titans cost in fighters, however, then you have a good chance of at least severely damaging it. All that is needed is improved AI to make such mass deployments practical.

Around 20% of a ship's mass in drones is usually enough to kill it.

 

[Jaaskinal]

Something I want to point out with the real world examples; it's a game, it's meant to be fun. Some peoples version of fun is realistic (arma III players) while others do not enjoy that level of realism (90% of video games minimum). Just because it's realistic doesn't mean it's fun, and just because it's realistic doesn't mean it should be in a game.

This opinion may be a little bit biased though, I don't think this balance would work for the competative meta in Starmade at all. I'm even considering seeing if I can drag my faction onto this server, and destroy every titan we can find in a week just to prove how imbalanced it is.

 

[Spartan-228]

You mean build bricks? Yeah, that's a ton of fun.

Hey, who wants to see my brand new ship killer? Absolutely minimal cost for ridiculous gain.
[DOUBLEPOST=1441427245,1441424210][/DOUBLEPOST]

The distances between the docked warhead lines may be a bit off, but the base is there. A cheap cloaker with 100% overdrive, a scanner, a fast jump drive, and storages for spare warheads. It'll probably kill anything small on that server, and put a nasty hole in things even with thick armor.

How the hell do you intent do fire those things without blowing yourself up. Also the push effect is finicky and wont always send a torpedo in the direction you want it to. I would recommend you cover those warheads in armor and use the trigger logic to set them off. You should also remember that the problem of warheads not imparting their damage to things they do not physically touch has been fixed. So you can blow your self up if you get to close to the blast.

I suppose this is an analog to a submarine and I like the idea. However don't forget about scanners, and if you loos your cloak or jamming for just one second your are screwed. Also I can make mines and depth charge analogs that will ruin your day.

Something I want to point out with the real world examples; it's a game, it's meant to be fun. Some peoples version of fun is realistic (arma III players) while others do not enjoy that level of realism (90% of video games minimum). Just because it's realistic doesn't mean it's fun, and just because it's realistic doesn't mean it should be in a game.

This opinion may be a little bit biased though, I don't think this balance would work for the competative meta in Starmade at all. I'm even considering seeing if I can drag my faction onto this server, and destroy every titan we can find in a week just to prove how imbalanced it is.

You can try and I don't mined if you do. I want to point out that what Galaxies Aflame is trying to do is make players think about what they are building. We started out with making it so players couldn't just buy shields, they had to make them. Witch has been very interesting and has encouraged trading between players (And we have talked about doing that to more blocks, but that is another topic). Now we made warheads useful, and thus the race to see what you can make with them and what you have to do to defend against them has begun, and I am very interested to see how it turns out. We may make acquiring them more difficult than in a vanilla game, but that will be for later.
I doubt this will spell the doom of titans. I feel it will spark peoples imaginations and drive players to invent new ways of building ships.
However there will always be three types of players, those that try to build nice works of art, those that try to build purr efficient killing machines, and those that try to do both. The player that builds for purr efficiency will always win, and the player that builds for looks will always loos that's just how this game works and no amount of balancing will change that. The only hope that the artists have is to have greater numbers.

Also you can build nice looking ships with lost of armor. I know Eosian likes his Sidonia lookalikes, but you don't have to build like that to have good armor. This heavy cruiser has more armor than most titans.

Oh and as a parting note you might want to try trigger activated defense screens. At the very lest it is worth trying, you know I think I will go do that.

 

[Lecic]

How the hell do you intent do fire those things without blowing yourself up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamikaze

I'm not launching anything.

 

[Spartan-228]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamikaze

I'm not launching anything.

Okay well have fun with that like I said mines and depth charges are always an option.

 

[Neogenesis]

This reminds me of a time when shields were all that mattered. I tricked someone into coming to my coordinates so he could get revenge on me harassing him in his large ship in the protected spawn. We had just entered the server btw.
I "let slip" my coords as if I was sending a PM to one of my friends, I built a ship (if you could call it that) of maybe 6 thrusters enough power to power said thrusters and a long line of grey hull going away from the core. At the end of said hull was a large brick of warheads. 1 min later a large ship I was harassing jumps in and starts turning toward my ship. Before he can bring his guns to bare I stab my "arrow" into the heart of his ship stripping away critical systems and armor. I hastily reapply the warheads and smash my arrowhead into his now exposed core, and kill him.
Everyone on server sent a wide-eyed response in chat. Apparently I killed the server admin. Good times.

 

[Gasboy]

Okay, here.

I'll give you two Rwandan pirates with AK's in a fishing dingy, and I'll take a Nimitz class aircraft carrier. Now show me how a small fighter is supposed to realistically take down a titan on their own.

Although, in all fairness, a titan that even blinks at a million damage bomb going off isn't much of a titan.

Exocet.

Or the nuclear missile that could be carried on American jet fighters.

Those could take the big ships out.

It is entirely possible for a small fighter to take out a big ship in real life. Why shouldn't it be doable in a game?

 

[DuckyQuacks]

Hmm Torpedo Bomber? it'll need to be Fast!

 

[StormWing0]

Would be funny to make a titan out of warheads and slam it into another titan. :P

 

[Spartan-228]

Look I know these things can be used by griefers as some have pointed out. However I do not intend to let the threat of griefers take a fun tool away from every one ells. That said I wont do nothing, warheads have been removed from the shops meaning you have to make them. As of right now they can be made in basic factories for very little. That will change once my self and the other admins have gone over how we wont to change that. I can tell you now they will be moved to advance factories, but the materials needed to make them is still up for debate.

 

[Lecic]

It is entirely possible for a small fighter to take out a big ship in real life. Why shouldn't it be doable in a game?

Because that isn't fun from a gameplay perspective? Who the hell wants to get killed in a 300k block destroyer by a cloaker with a bunch of warhead spikes on it?

 

[Spartan-228]

Because that isn't fun from a gameplay perspective? Who the hell wants to get killed in a 300k block destroyer by a cloaker with a bunch of warhead spikes on it?

Who want to get killed period.

 

[StormWing0]

Then someone like me comes along and makes a fleet of nova bombs with this and destroys one of the larger factions overnight. XD Try to keep in mind there are people that destructive. :P

 

[Spartan-228]

Then someone like me comes along and makes a fleet of nova bombs with this and destroys one of the larger factions overnight. XD Try to keep in mind there are people that destructive. :p

I am, read what I said earlier.

Look I know these things can be used by griefers as some have pointed out. However I do not intend to let the threat of griefers take a fun tool away from every one ells. That said I wont do nothing, warheads have been removed from the shops meaning you have to make them. As of right now they can be made in basic factories for very little. That will change once my self and the other admins have gone over how we wont to change that. I can tell you now they will be moved to advance factories, but the materials needed to make them is still up for debate.

 

[Gasboy]

Because that isn't fun from a gameplay perspective? Who the hell wants to get killed in a 300k block destroyer by a cloaker with a bunch of warhead spikes on it?

Oh, so your idea of fun gets to override other people's ideas?

Who wants to fly around in a neat fighter only to get one-shot by a billion block cube? Turn around is fair play, don't you think?