Starmade systems too simplistic?

[Evilchicken]

I don't know about anyone else, but I think the many of the current systems such as shields, AMC, power, etc, are too simpleifed. They needs to be more complexity. Such the block have more sepefic roles, power cables, fusion reactors walls, coils, cannon barrel.

Now the blocks they work great on small ships (few dozens blocks), so maybe we can keep them just nerfed a bit. And as ships get larger the use more complex builds and powerful systems. thesse more advancded systems would be multiblock structures, which need a through and carful planning to biuld, like a fusion reactor, or a super powerdul plasma cannon that which needs injector and coils to accelerate the plasma ball.

I put this here instead os suggestion as this is a discussion thread to develop for what may hopefully become a more fleshed out suggestion.

 

[DracoNB]

Remember the game is only in Alpha, there are many things that are still being added, removed, and modified.

 

[MichaelSeph]

So far there are more and less optim/efficient ways to build the ship\'s systems, in a way that some people make semi perma stealth/jam major ships and others can\'t even shoot and move the ship at once.

It\'s not really that simple to make a proper/efficient ship, on big ships, but on small, yeah, it\'s very easy, that\'s why many people just like going around in a space fly.



If you are interested enough on this topic, I / we\'d like to hear a more detailed and exact functional version of what such systems and how they should work, to then be able to discuss those details. Because so far, yeah, there could be extra systems and details, but which to add first ? ^^

 

[Evilchicken]

All these ideas are for a long way down the road, of course.

One example is power. A tank blocks that enclosed a volume to be filled by fuel for fusion, a valve pumps out the fuel to a pipe, which the flows to a \'plasma injector\' that is place on a fusion reactor wall. The fusion reactor wall blocks allow for a space inside, the reactors efficient could be based off the volume inside the magentic coils the inflow of plasma and outflow of energy extractor blocks. the energy extractor blocks pass energy to cable blocks to transport energy to a energy storage tank (current blocks may work fine here) or sent straight to a weapon system or shields.

That example may be a slightly extreme and being possibly too detail for a game like this, but the idea is that powerful systems should not just be more expensive but more complex and so more difficult to build. If anyone here as play modded minecraft with gregtech installed you\'ll understand the complexity some of the end-game machines have.

 

[Comr4de]

I\'m pretty sure if this game were even the least bit more complex the amount of help topics asking how to do relatively mundane things would increase exponentially.

 

[Evilchicken]

This level of complexity would be for the very high-end systems and ships. The current blocks may still work work smaller simpler ships, although the current current should scale very badly to stop them being use for capitals.

 

[MisterVec]

When pondering such things as adding new systems or modifying the existing ones, it seems beneficial to consider if the additions add depth or simply add complexity. Depth is desireable. Complexity for complexity\'s sake is not.

For hyperbolized instance:

I will propose that, for the sake of realism, the engine system will require 5 different blocks all arranged in specific ways in order for engine blocks themselves to generate thrust. These additional blocks do not interact with any other system. There is exactly one right way to use them and nearly unlimited wrong ways. I have introduced complexity into the game\'s systems, but not added any depth. By doing so, I have simply made the game more obtuse and tedious without adding anything compelling or interesting.

Conversely, I can also propose that, for the sake of making things interesting, that we add a \"hull hardener\" system to the game that greately reduces the amount of damage amcs (but not missiles) will do to one\'s hull blocks. I will propose that this system basically works like cloaker or jammer, in that it drains an enormous amount of power and can\'t be run indefinitely by any but the most super-ultra-specialized of ships. It interacts with your power systems, is a useful option, but not the only or necessarily the best option. It has not added much complexity, but it has added depth to the game.

Any-hoo, that\'s my two cents for what they are worth*.


*my two cents is valued at $ 0.02 American.

 

[Evilchicken]

The multiblock systems should be diffirent from gregtech multiblock machines in that these machines have no fixed arrangment, but have rules about them that refine the effectiveness, like the current power generators.

For example if we had ion thrusters, ion thrusters could have basic components, magnetic coils ( accelerate ions), gas injectors (\'emit\' gas), ionizer (Strips electrons off the gas), hardened hull define walls, mabye other blocks as well. A basic layout could be, hulls in a short tude, pair of coils rap around the tube, injector at the back and ionizer inside the tube.

What I trying to say here is this a single huge block of AMC\'s or thrusters is too easy build, even power blocks are just long lines of them. Now on a small fighter that theres not enough \'resolution\' to build things like this, something like the current blocks are fine. Capital have more than enough space to build these things. There the capital ship build easy with simple parts which would be terrible and then theres the capital that is build hard hence it\'s much better that the other.

 

[omelet]

to the above well put point of mrvec, that the best kind of complexity added to the game provides depth yet does not render the game inaccessible. Everything needs to be relatively simple at first brush to prevent too high a learning curve, and needs to be consistent and scalable. If the more complex methods are not necessary for a beginning player, but provide advantages or increased configureability or abilities for the more advanced, that makes for a really great game with a lot of play value! I think this game is already on that path

 

[Evilchicken]

Many of you seem to fear that increasing the complexity generally for end-game/ capital ships is a bad thing, your also assuming I mean fixed arrangments of blocks for it to work, what I\'m looking for as a new relativity simple mechanic that lets players build complexity with it. I had an idea for pressure vessels. blocks the encass a volume, which is fill by a matter, possible cudatoms, and other blocks the alter the matter, ionizer turn gas to plasma. High pressure increase engine efficeincy.

Right now I don\'t feel like I\'m building a huge cannon, I\'m just\'ve order a huge cannon. Like an engine in a car, I\'ve not build it, I\'ve simply order a bigger engine.