Starmade and 3d decorations.

[Bench]

It seems a lot of comments are focused at: why is there this or that particular feature being a focus for the team instead of this other feature that we think is more important and would add more to the game.

What you have to understand is our teams are spread out over a number of features at once and generally speaking we only really announce or introduce features that are near being finalised to go into the game.

Some comments have been insinuating that the team shouldn't be focusing on fauna but should be focusing on another feature that requires both modelling and additional gameplay mechanics. The thing is, fauna has been in the works for probably six months now, the same time the rail system update has been underway. Our modelling team has been doing all the work they've needed to be doing on that, and a number of other things as we all wear several hats, and during that time our coding team was completing a performance update and then the entire rails implementation and balance, so it made sense for the two projects to happen at the same time.

There's a couple issues that are presented with adding additional block-type models into the game, things like block data would need to be reworked to re-support it, a rework of how shadows and lighting are approached for them and in relation to their interactions with other blocks, again another rehash of collision detection to then take care of all the arguments that would need to be supported for that, player collisions, and for something like player position tracking, we'd need to look at new meta-data to associate a player with a relative position of a ship, which then means that we would need to look at how that data is also stored, with the player or with the ship etc etc. There's probably other restrictions and problems that I'm not forseeing, I just know that in the past adding other block shapes has always been described by schema as a bigger project than it seems.

We're not saying it won't happen, just not as a replacement for features we're pretty much complete on already. The features we're bringing you are not something we've just made up and said oh let's just do this feature this week, they've been the best features to work on in tandem with what everyone else has been working on. Our internal list has a lot of features on it and so for us we have to look at what's the best ones to work on at the same time so everyone is working on stuff and we don't have a whole team sitting on their thumbs doing nothing waiting for another team to finish.

 

[CyberTao]

I blame Kupu for starting this.

The actual vote should read "Does the community find decorative furniture to be more important than Fauna".

 

[Ithirahad]

When did the topic change from saving player position on a ship while logged to command chairs? Chairs would be simple enough in comparison.

You said something about copying code and logic integration and defensive effects, which was in turn in response to my saying that chairs would mostly reuse existing tech. Sorry if you misunderstood that bit, it was a bit of a jumbled mess.

Eh, from what I know, creature spawners is just a tag attached to a block, all they would have to do for stations is to set the spawns before saving the blueprint, so that the spawns are there when it is loaded by the game. For planets, you could probably attached the tag to a random planet similar to how they randomly attach ores to rocks. Probably a very boot-legged way to do it, but it would work pretty well I would think.

Not without pointless creatures getting stuck places we'll never see them. E.g. sealed-off caves underground or the middle of a rock formation.

What good are they? Well mobs can have drops. When a player dies with drop blocks on death enabled, they create a small loot cloud. Just apply that to creatures and make them spawn with a inventory of a couple plants or some other drop. Hell, give them a drop that when crafted together with 9 others creates a ore shard (or something stupid like that). Probably wont add much to the current game, but offers framework and potential for later additions (modding included).

Sure, that works. The immediate effort vs. return ratio for a feature like this at this stage of development still bugs me, though.

All I know is that some players are really starting to get tired of the purely ship-based additions. If creatures could be tied together with some planet optimizations and maybe the reintroduction of cities and junk, some people might just get less uppity about that. For the most part, 3D models would just be readding what was already in the game (redoing plants, adding command chairs, etc) and adding additional fluff. We just had rails that catered to the builders, HP will cater to the PvP'ers, why not let the next big thing cater to the PvE and explorers?

If you want to cater to explorers, then little critters running around won't do it; people will get bored of that pretty fast. Particularly with no real use for 'em. Try... try improving planets first, then adding more variation to their generation (Terrain geometry AND materials)? That would definitely create something to explore, for what seems to be about the same amount of effort. A.k.a. a lot.

I'm all for 3D models and stuff (would require changing of how the blocks are done I think), since that would let us have that last Block shape that we need and I curse God for not having, but sometimes you need to lean a bit in the other direction before your leg gives in.

And stahp with the insulting of the whale, trading guild does the same thing and we still have them ingame.

I want space whales too... Just not yet. As for the trading guild, having the game go /spawn_mobs "Isanth-Zero Cc" -2 3 and then ship.ai.PathTo(FindNearestEntity("Shop").location); three times is a lot easier than generating a random variation of space whale, including movement scaling, AI modifications, and so on, then having it go mob.ai.PathTo(GetRandomLocation());.

...But I really do want those space whales, believe me. :p

EDIT: Bench, thanks for the info.

 

[CyberTao]

You said something about copying code and logic integration and defensive effects, which was in turn in response to my saying that chairs would mostly reuse existing tech. Sorry if you misunderstood that bit, it was a bit of a jumbled mess.

Ah, I was referring to how passive effects mostly just seemed like a copy of the Jamming/Cloaking computers, which is why they could not operate on logic or without a player inside. Small bits like that are why just copying bits of code wouldn't always work.

Not without pointless creatures getting stuck places we'll never see them. E.g. sealed-off caves underground or the middle of a rock formation.

I don't visit many planets (mostly just Ice ones), so I have no idea if the game struggles with caves and plants. Another option would be to place the spawning blocks above the ground and just have mobs drop down.

having the game go /spawn_mobs "Isanth-Zero Cc" -2

From what I can tell, the game doesn't normally spawn just 1, it spawns a couple based on a wave strength and values of the ships, it does have to pick which ships pop out after all. It's not quite as simple, but isn't complicated either, I imagine creature would also fall into that not-simple but not complicated grey area of mystery as well.

 

[Ithirahad]

From what I can tell, the game doesn't normally spawn just 1, it spawns a couple based on a wave strength and values of the ships, it does have to pick which ships pop out after all. It's not quite as simple, but isn't complicated either, I imagine creature would also fall into that not-simple but not complicated grey area of mystery as well.

Nah, the game just does some kind of modified wave initiation process. I wasn't being literal there with the spawn_mobs thing. But yeah, I do see your point.

 

[kiraen]

I would like to see a system that allows people to create in-game 3d assets like you describe. I think this would be most ideal way to enhance game play and follow the build it yourself philosophy of Starmade.
<...trim...>
I think if it could be done in-game it would be the perfect fit for SM. If we do it outside of the game we should allow players to make their own resources to add.

^^^^^^ Pretty much agree with what everyone said so far. Decoration would be a wonderful tool to enhance building.

Extremely not important for me, waste of time relative to other crucial features that have to be implemented first.

These are the posts that made the most sense to me. Anything and everything that can be added to the game as far as decorations are concerned is a good thing. Creativity will go through the roof and many decorations will be re-purposed. Opening it up so that players can create/mod their own decorations will expand things exponentially and take the burden off Schine. Finally, while I voted 'Extremely important', I would also vote 'low priority, it can wait'.

 

[FullMetalFox]

I find it funny how many people write stuff like "Its unimportant! Work on more important stuff like XYZ!"...
Well, its true that certain things should be prioritized, i wont argue with that, but keep in mind that nobody can do everything, right now on this we are discussing about the work of one person, saber, with a minimal additional work from the 3 programmers to implement it, so keep that in mind... or would you rather have the 3D artist waste his time by trying to code some faction features, huh? :p

On Topic:
Im not really an interiour fan, so most of whats been posted here is kinda meh for me, but there are a few very simple things id like to see for ship building, slabs, stairs, panels, tubes/pillars, handrails... and all the missing block shapes for hulls. But i think thats so much stuff, that we need to redesign the block meta first, otherwise this would eat up a lot of IDs.

 

[Saber]

I wanted to address a few things that have been coming up in this thread. Creatures are not just going to be a gimmick, it will be a core game feature that will tie in with starmade's gameplay. I can't tell you everything that they'll be able to do because I'm not a programmer, however I will be working closely with the dev team to make sure each one turns out as intended. There will be creatures you can interact with, there will be creatures you can fight, and there will be creatures you fear. Space will be a dangerous place.

I understand your desire for more decorative pieces. I'm not saying they aren't coming. I am saying that they aren't coming yet. As we develop new features the various departments of the team have to work together in order to push these features out. As such we can't be super flexible with large systems, so if the team is pushing forward with one feature, we can't have departments that should be involved in that spending all their time working on other areas of the game. I want to see interior's take on a new life just as much as many of you, however it has to be when the time is right for it.

Additionally many of the things that have been mentioned aren't just decorative 3D models, spawning on ships and saving player location on logout isn't something I can just model and make happen. This is another example of the team working together to see that a new feature gets created. I appreciate all your enthusiasm but please keep in mind we are a small team with a plan, and if we don't follow that plan then new features will be less consistent and much lower quality.

Thank you all for your patience and feel free to keep throwing out ideas for decorations, but know that we aren't able to put them in at this time.

 

[Warprider]

Everyones just a bit agitated seeing as how planets never end up quite right (yet)

 

[Ithirahad]

Everyones just a bit agitated seeing as how planets never end up quite right (yet)

Yeah, exactly. It's kind of gotten to the point where I don't really know how good of an idea it was/is, no matter how huge and gameplay-integrated the new fauna and flora systems will be. While this is a bit of an exaggeration, it's like taking a flimsy cardboard box (current planets) and building an amazing and intricate statue (what the new creature system sounds like) on top of it - no point if the base isn't of sufficient strength and quality to support it; if someone just sneezes in front of it all that work will fall, shatter, and have gone to waste - besides, it would look really silly. If you're going to spend a year and five people worth of work to make an intricate glass statue, you probably should've spent a while making a sturdy and well-decorated stone base first (better planets)... Or just don't make the statue yet and work on something that can support itself or that you already have an excellent support structure to build from. (Ship stuff.)

That said, hopefully Schine will prove me wrong... But right now, I'm not convinced. Too late anyway, I guess, so no matter. Back to trying to get ships balanced. (Again!) Oh, and hammering out some universe and faction suggestions, eventually, but never mind that.

 

[kiraen]

From what Zanaten said it sounds like this 'glass statue' is going to be animatronic with hover capabilities. And the base is quite a bit more substantial then cardboard. Ugly. But sturdy enough to support the fauna.

It seems to me that the thing most people are misunderstanding, is that the 'current' projects are only 'current' in that these are the ones that are ready to be rolled out. I wish I could find the post to reference, but it's been said they are working on multiple projects all at once. Just the tip of the iceberg and all that.

 

[iceman6491]

I just wanted to point out that a lot of these comments come across as quite insulting* to those who are working their arses off to make this game we all love... and dont forget, no one here paid £40-50 for it....

Lets try avoid biting the hand that feeds eh?

*not saying that was the intention or how it was taken, but written word is very easy to take the wrong way...

 

[Visitor]

Late to the thread, won't take part in the actual arguments regarding importance of features - Schine already shared their take on the whole matter. Now, onto furniture/other such assets.

I have chosen 'important' for the assets themselves, though their role in the mechanics of the game as how I'd like it to become in the future I'd consider very important.

Some of the things I already see mentioned, but instead of quoting or recounting what I'd see more or less important from other users' suggestions, I'll simply state what I see both as basics and as most necessary above any other furniture.

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Assets themselves I'd divide into those of practical use:

Computers/consoles with screens (preferably with option for a single one to be able to take place of several activation blocks, as well as turn on/off subsystems and display status of connected blocks [like power] - possibly in lieu of current menu available when piloting a ship)

Guardrails - just simple rails in G environment allowing a person to look at stuff near the edge of some ramp, balcony or whatever without risking falling or being forced to setup glass walls.

Ladders for the G environment (could be connected to railing if said railing could be build both vertically and horizontally) - especially in smaller constructions they'd probably seem/work far better than the 'chunky' lift system.

Medical bunks instead of current healing of characters and with possibility of diagnosis for different afflictions if Schine is ambitious enough to flesh out the shipless gameplay in the future.

Dedicated containers with their own models/graphics like weapon lockers, industrial containers (should we get slightly more automated and advanced crafting where refinery would automatically take and process materials [like ore] stored in dedicated containers and turn them into preset items), refridgerators (again, should shipless gameplay and possibly survival elements would be fleshed out and characters would need/could use edibles, from regular food to some.. recreational consumables) as well as suit lockers (if equipment mechanics will be ever polished enough allowing different armors/suits and weaponry of different effects while limiting ability to just hold all of them in the character's inventory simultaneously) - and if I expect too much, even just as decorations such things would be nifty.

Vending machines/store boxes in combination with NPCs or as automatic shops so we wouldn't just have NPCs pulling tons of hull bits from thin air, we could drop there objects we'd like to possibly sell to others players (player-owned shops) or so we won't have magical 'approach a station, materialize magically objects in your inventory for cash'.

and most importantly, separate consoles for ships of varied size and complexity.

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...as well as purely decorational items:

Bunks/beds which theoretically could have a practical function but even as a fan of survival elements I don't think that actually demanding for characters (at least player ones) to sleep would do gameplay good. Still, characters being able to lie down would be nice.

Tables/desks - simple ones to put in a private quarter, office or a mess hall would absolutely suffice.

Seats/chairs - similarly simple ones that would go well with tables/desks as well as allow sitting character to reach and use computers/consoles - especially important in case of fighters and other small, single-crewman ships for the sake of creating cockpits.

Sanitary units for space stations and generally, living quarters - vague 'closed shower cabin' two-stacked-blocks big boxes would suffice here. Certainly I do not hope (in fact, I'd be against) that they'd be given a practical function, beyond their separate version possibly fitting as small decontamination chambers if we'll ever get hazardous contaminants.

Potted plants - some simple flowers and shrubbery, possibly ones we already have in game, to drop in corridors, especially for commercial stations.

Standalone screens of varied size - I wouldn't even mind simply multiblock/connecting to each other current screens so they'd form one bigger (up to a limit of maybe 6 - 10 such blocks connected in various configuration) - for the sake of advertisement, more important notices etc.

All of the above, often for reasons already specified near each entry, would be quite fitting - IMHO - for Starmade and in fact nearly vital for the sake of creating any constructions, especially habitats that wouldn't look sterile and dead like most of the current stations do. To be honest, I wouldn't expect or care much for them being even particularly nifty - a few boxes combined into vague shape of a table etc would be enough without requiring much work from the devteam or rendering/calculations from the system when in-game.

As mentioned, some of the assets would also be very useful in case Schine has ambition to improve, develop and polish certain aspects of gameplay - from 'shipless' playing to suggestions already considered and accepted, like actual cockpits and command bridges instead of crude, improvised magical vortex cubes.

 

[EndoSkull]

Late here as well.

Wondering have you considered building a prop editor - in which you could build within a 3d grid with smaller voxels and colors - if there was an editor in the game like http://www.minddesk.com/ <--- this You would just go into a mode where you build your props save them and place them.

Just a thought.

 

[SomethingSlimy]

I've always thought the interiors in StarMade look a bit too "smooth" compared to, say, Minecraft. Because of it's lack of non-voxel decoration.

Purely aesthetic additions are never a waste of time. They serve the function of making the game more interesting, especially since the bulk of it is spaceship building. I support aesthetic changes regardless of it's gameplay function. (However, I still don't think it's "cancel all your current plans" important. Just most definitely worth looking into.)

 

[Planetside Industries]

.

 

[Ithirahad]

Yeh. Now that I see what is actually being done, there's no need to drop everything and go make cool things to put in ship interiors... :P

I assume that once chairs are put in, more stuff will follow.