Shield blocks?

[WhiteWolf6AW]

I have a quick question reguarding shield blocks and i cant seem to find the answer posted anywhere.

I'm wondering if shielding is relative to ship mass. the reason i ask is because the wiki states that each block should provide 400 shield points. for smaller ships, this appears to be true, but in my current capital project i have literally thousands of shield blocks and each one is yielding only about 5 shield points.

 

[gamesaucer]

Shield capacity benefits from a non-adjecent grouping system, whereas shield regeneration rate scales linearly. This means that the first shield block you place on a ship will provide the highest capacity.

I tackled this issue myself by mounting seperate hull segments onto my main ship using docking modules. Each hull segment has different shielding, and therefore overall a higher capacity. It looks ridiculous, though.

This is only really needed if you need your shields to last for a while. As said, shield regeneration scales linearly, 2s/sec for each block, which means your project is probably safe from most potential enemies even without a high capacity.

 

[Trinova]

Shield capacity benefits from a non-adjecent grouping system, whereas shield regeneration rate scales linearly. This means that the first shield block you place on a ship will provide the highest capacity.


That\'s not right... this has nothing to do with adjacency. All blocks on your ship count the same way if they are adjacent to other shield dispersers or not. Your way to increase the over-all capacity is by docking OTHER SHIPS (which includes turrets) to your ship, not by avoiding any kind of adjacency.

 

[gamesaucer]

It IS right.


That\'s not right... this has nothing to do with adjacency. All blocks on your ship count the same way if they are adjacent to other shield dispersers or not.


That is exactly what I was saying:


Shield capacity benefits from a non-adjecent grouping system


Non-adjecent is the term used to refer to this system in-game.

 

[Trinova]

Your shield capacity is: 905 * [# of Shield Dispersers]^0.5

Your shield regen is: 2 * [# of Shield Dispersers]

Since shields still keep regenerating while under fire the more interesting value is regeneration. If you have let\'s say 5k shield dispersers you are invincible to any foe with less than 10k DPS. But if your enemy has 20k DPS your shields will last only 6.4 seconds of sustained fire (64k / (20k-10k)). At this scale your shield capacity is still worth to mention. If you scale up capacity will be less interesting. Let\'s say you have 25k shield blocks thus 50k regen. Let\'s say your enemy now doesn\'t have 2x the damage but only 1.5x. Your 143k shield would still hold for about 5.7sec (143k / (75k - 50k)). This means the bigger your shields get the bigger your enemy needs to get to harm you. BUT the easier for a ship of your size it becomes to overcome your shields, too because you need only an array of 275 AMCs for a 4k DPS waeapon while you need 2k shield blocks for 4k regen.

 

[Trinova]

That\'s bullshit. The word \"adjacent\" means adjacent (SUPRISE). Not anything you think it should mean.

SD HCT xm3.4 Power Blocks, Weapons Blocks and Thruster Blocks have adjacency effects. Shield effects don\'t have. If they are adjacent doesn\'t matter. And just because you think \"adjacent\" means \"in the same ship\" doesn\'t make it right. Use a fucking dictionary.

 

[gamesaucer]

I am only referencing the in-game way of referring to the implemented grouping system that shields benefit by.

And that system, whether you like it or not, is called non-adjacent. So you should call Schema out and tell him to use a dictionary, not me. I\'m only repeating what it says in the game, and I quote:


While it is not affected by the tradition (Adjacent)
grouping mechanism, they are affected by the
non-traditional (Non-adjecent) grouping mechanism.
Meaning that two SD Shield Dispersers next to each
other, and two that are apart but attached to the same
object, will have the same output.

 

[Trinova]

The information in the shops is just not up2date. Don\'t you see the difference on how power generators and weapons work to how shield blocks work?

In the description is something written about Cloaks and Jammers how they benefit from size and shapes... that\'s not true either. If you use one or multiple Cloaks it doesn\'t change the effectiveness (ignoring the additional mass which makes more than one beeing worse than a single block).

If he writes in the tooltips that AMCs shoot fireworks and spawn virgins it doesn\'t mean it\'s true.

 

[gamesaucer]

That is exactly what shield blocks do, and exactly what you said they do as well.

We\'re just arguing about a choice of words here which is not even my own.
I\'m not going to let this topic turn into one big argument (which it kind of already is) any further.
Therefore, you have won. Have the thread for yourself and go bask in your glory. Have a nice day.

 

[Trinova]

X = shield O = hull

XOXOXOX gives the same shield as XXXXOOO does. Isn\'t it obvious that in one build the blocks are adjacent and in the other they are NOT? And still do the same? It doesn\'t matter WHERE i place them... they work always the same as long as they are part of the ship.

If you do the same with generators you get different numbers for regen with the patterns above. It\'s so fucking frustrating to talk to someone too fucking dumb to realize it.

One for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect

 

[Aura of Souls]

Trinova you really need to crack open a dictionary. When Gamesaucer says non-adjacent it mean exactly what youre describing. Meaning they dont require to be grouped up but are part of the same ship. Just because you cant comprehend doesnt mean he was wrong. Basic English my friend.

 

[Trinova]

Aura... he sais: \"Shield capacity benefits from a non-adjecent grouping system.\"

Ok now plz tell me where is the benefit from \"XOXOX\" in opposite to \"XXXOO\". Since he sais there is a benefit for non-adjacency i\'m realy curious what it is.

\"Not benefitting from adjacency\" is something else than \"benefitting from non-adjacency\".

There is NO benefit caused by ajacency or by non-adjacency. It just doesn\'t matter.



On Topic: Shields were changed today:


- shield balance:
-- capacity: (shieldBlocks*3.5)^0.66666)*350
-- recharge: (shieldBlocks*4)^0.48)*50
-- introduced recovery when hit (by shield blocks used)

 

[evkol001]

Take a break from internet. Go on vocation. No need to be annoying for everyone.

 

[Alblaka]

Much rather you should take a break from bashing him.

In what Trinova wants to say, he is right: There is no direct benefit from not placing shield emitters adjacent to each other. (Likewise there is no benefit from placing them adjacent.) Fact is that for shield emitters (and a few other blocks, like Radar Jammers, etc) their position and grouping on the ship does not matter, only their count does (though in case of Radar Jammers even the count doesn\'t influence the ship\'s behavior past higher energy consumption).



And, btw, in my oppinion flaming people for minor spelling errors is probably the worst waste of time you can come up with. Except for playing CoD or eating sand, probably.

 

[gamesaucer]

I strongly recommend everyone to stop posting here. This thread is turning into a flame war.

Let it slide, all of you.

 

[Racr]

When using bold text, I can feel the power within me grow to abnormal levels.

 

[Pizzalord]

Well the new update has added in recovery I\'m not quite sure how that works out yet. Can any one car to explain?

 

[Trinova]

I can only guess atm but there were suggestions on shields to make them stop regenerating when they get hit.

Since i was observing a bigger recovery value on bigger shields i\'d guess it\'s some kind of factor on regeneration that decreases when under fire. I\'d suggest to observe the value while under fire to see if it interacts with damage.

EDIT: Just tested and it didn\'t change under fire and it didn\'t seem to have any influence on regeneration.

 

[Littlehelper]

\"This value is shown in build mode and determines the time in seconds the shields will start to recharge after a hit. This value depends on the amount of shild blocks placed on a structure.\" - see news.

The current test values i can give without much testing are:

1-256 blocks: 0.5 sec recovery

257-1024 blocks: 1.0 sec recovery

1025++ blocks: 2.0 sec recovery

As my ship with 6,7k shield has 3.0 sec recovery I\'d assume it to be:

1025-4048: 2.0 sec recovery

4048-16k: 3.0 sec recovery

but that is just a guess and not tested

 

[Trinova]

17814 blocks give 4 sec recovery delay which would match your pattern (16001 to 64k = 4.0sec)

EDIT: And the 1812 blocks of my frigate lead to a 2sec delay... i think this proves your theory.