Sensors Anyone?

[1adog1]

Hey guys, I've got a neat little idea that might help better maintain larger areas of space, sensors! There would be two kinds of sensors, long range and short range. Here's some basic ideas I've come up with:

Short Range:
Only has a 2 km radius
Activated by selecting target in navigation
Can give detailed information about a ship/object including: Name, Size, Class, Faction, Power systems, Shields, etc.
Information displayed on a side screen while in flight mode.

Short Rang Sensor Sample Display:
Name: ShipName
Faction: FactionName
Faction Status: Neutral
Mass: 7262
Dimensions: 50x25x15 Blocks
Class: Battleship
Power Production: 1,732,673 e/s
Power Storage: 3,525,263 Energy
Shield Power: 283,252 Power


Long Range:
Has a 10 km radius
Can only be placed on planets, asteroids, and space stations
Activated when any object comes into proximity range proximity (Variable by unit)
Gives basic information about a ship/object including: Name, Size, Faction
Information sent in a private chat message to a specified player.
Has short range sensors built in that can transmit information to allied ships

Long Range Sensor Sample Chat Message:
"ShipName" from the "FactionName" faction has entered proximity to Sensor 152.
Mass: 5273.
Distance from Sensor: 3.7 km.

I welcome any criticism, ideas, or changes that you guys can come up with, just no hateful/useless comments please.

-Cheers! :D

EDIT BASED ON WHAT PEOPLE HAVE SAID:
No class description
Seperate Chat Tab for Sensors
Sensor Probes
Limited Distances when information starts showing up and tolerances.
Increased Turret Accuracy
Different Frequencies and Jammers Effecting Sensors
Range increases based on size of sectors and number of sensor blocks (I came up with two formulas:

Short Range
(S+(B*100))<(S+5,000)
S=Sector Radius
B=Number of Blocks
5000=Max Extra Range for Short Range Sensors

Long Range
((S*5)+(B*250))<(S*10)
Same Idea as short range but the max range is 10 sectors)

 

[Zedrackis]

Its been suggested before. Still compared to the current idea of a fixed sensor range, omni-jamming, and fixed missile locking range there is a lot more room for future improvements if sensor blocks were put into the game.

 

[1adog1]

Can I has bump pwease?

 

[Ithirahad]

This would require separate tabs of chat so that you don't get sensor log spam popping up while you're trying to talk to people.

 

[Nauvran]

baah bloddy plane stole my idea (kinda)
I wrote something down in a hurry in the thread about sector sizes

I really support he idea and like Ithirad said we should probably get another chat for this or need to access the sensor/radar block to get the info

Spoiler: My "idea"

With logs and limit on radar with these size sectors I would say that we would need to have command like vessels.
Just add some blocks that are not able to be placed on a ship/station with weapons computers.
These new blocks would then make the radar range better and make the radar more "efficient" as in that it detects smaller vessels faster (for this we would say that a ship that is under a certain mass would be harder to pick up on a standard radar).

Another block could be added again (or the same block as before) which enables a kind of RTS view from where the pilot in th ecommand vessel is able to send out orders to the members of the faction, this could also be used for bobby AI ships or AI NPCs

These two types of blocks could be made more "efficient" like the other types of blocks, the larger the group or the larger the area it covers the better it will work.

This is just something I randomly mixed with a thought I have had and what I read in the chat a few minutes ago :p

 

[1adog1]

baah bloddy plane stole my idea (kinda)
I wrote something down in a hurry in the thread about sector sizes

I really support he idea and like Ithirad said we should probably get another chat for this or need to access the sensor/radar block to get the info

Hey I'm a pilot not a plane lol, sorry I didn't see your idea in the already created tabs it gives you when you create a thread.

Anyway yeah now that I think about it a separate chat tab for sensors would be a good idea.

 

[Nauvran]

Hey I'm a pilot not a plane lol, sorry I didn't see your idea in the already created tabs it gives you when you create a thread.

Anyway yeah now that I think about it a separate chat tab for sensors would be a good idea.

ahh its allright
I had posted it in a comment to a thread about sector sizes so it was a bit hard to find.

But yeah, either a separate chat or maybe add it to the navigation menu?

 

[Jack Caos]

i think chat, or booth, so you could easily see it while doing complicated fleet manouvers

 

[Elladan]

Well I'd see sensors in a more radical way.
No sensors, no mobiles target in navigation

( You can still see space stations and planets because you have a map ! )

And range would as you say increase with the number of blocks.

 

[psteiner]

Short Rang Sensor Sample Display:
Name: ShipName
Faction: FactionName
Faction Status: Neutral
Mass: 7262
Dimensions: 50x25x15 Blocks
Class: Battleship
Power Production: 1,732,673 e/s
Power Storage: 3,525,263 Energy
Shield Power: 283,252 Power


-Cheers! :D

This is great, except for one thing, STARMADE DOES NOT HAVE AN OFFICIAL CLASS SYSTEM YET.

So it's overkill to have a class. Perhaps a displayed value of distance, sector, thrust, and state (docked, docked turret, ai, ect)...

 

[Unnamed25]

This is great, except for one thing, STARMADE DOES NOT HAVE AN OFFICIAL CLASS SYSTEM YET.

So it's overkill to have a class. Perhaps a displayed value of distance, sector, thrust, and state (docked, docked turret, ai, ect)...

Or maybe you could modify the classes for the client in some sort of config on the game folder.

 

[Jack Caos]

why is ayone so obsessed with classes?

 

[Zeno9141]

Seriously. Don't make an official class systems. The only REAL class a ship can be, is the class the creator grants it.
But besides all the class crap, quite interesting.

I would say, increase the sensor size as sector size increases. With sectors of 5km wide, our navs are already extending to 10km far.

EDIT:
What would be very very awesome, if turrets would have sensors attached to them, they should have a greater accuracy, and targeting range. Same goes for all AI. BUT, I would see this as OP, and so do most of you. What, if the sensors had to have a computer and a system block, which would take up a lot of space to compensate for their accuracy and range?

 

[1adog1]

Hey guys I just updated the post with what you guys have suggested, and I guess I could call this a bump post.

-Cheers! :D

 

[SteelNorthman]

I've been recently think of this kind of thing too. In my opinion, sensors would be like most other systems, depending on the number of blocks in the system, it becomes more efficient and accurate, but the functions I've thought up are slightly different.

Functions:
range scales with x and z size, while accuracy scales with y. (set up like efficient power systems)
increases accuracy for turrets and AI within the range, that are apart of the same faction.
the computer block can be set to update to player/faction members if an object enters or leaves the sensor range, as well as giving simple information about object (size, mass, faction, pilot).

I would not have it send shields, power, or the what not for it is a little OP.

 

[jayman38]

...What would be very very awesome, if turrets would have sensors attached to them, they should have a greater accuracy, and targeting range. Same goes for all AI. BUT, I would see this as OP, and so do most of you. What, if the sensors had to have a computer and a system block, which would take up a lot of space to compensate for their accuracy and range?

Idea: Resolve the Overpowering accuracy and range with a server configurable hard limit. The AI accuracy can hit 750, but no higher, for instance. (99% accuracy at 750m). Different servers could have different limits, even keeping the ceiling at something low like 30, if they want. ("You can have sensors if you want, but the AI won't use it on this server!") Same thing for range. Range increase 1m per block (maybe server configurable) with a maximum range increase of 200m. Maybe put a parabolic curve on the increase formula for diminishing returns as more sensor blocks are added.

Maybe have range be a function of sensor dimension, not just count, so people would build giant sensor "dishes" instead of sensor "cubes".

Maybe limit the number of elements on a target ship that can be described as a function of distance, ECM variables (jamming and cloaking cubes), and sensor blocks.
So for example, a ship that's 2500 blocks away will simply be described as a ship with dimensions. Maybe make the dimensions have a random chance of being a few blocks off, so that a distance reading is unreliable. A ship that's 250 blocks away would have information like it's dimensions, docking status, shield status, mass, faction, etc. Things that are not visible or likely to be advertised should not be shown. For instance, while faction is likely advertised with a transponder signal (and inversely a pirate faction is advertised with a LACK of transponder signal) I don't think we should see a ship's energy generation count or shield regeneration count.

 

[SteelNorthman]

I agree with jayman38, the overpowered accuracy and range could be balanced through config files for servers/client. My pervious post, said of a way to make the Sensor systems more "exclusive", forcing the need to plan the ship better to enhance your other systems; as well as the limited data return on "objects"/"ships" that are within sensor range, but instead of the faction and docking info showing up at closer range, the faction block acts like a transponder sending signals to others within the same faction to "prevent friendly fire" kind of thing. the idea of Pirates having a LACK of transponder is an interesting take, it could also be that the transponder is within the ship core, and a player can disable the transponder for like espionage and the like. now being able to see another shield numbers is something that is OP, rather seeing a "note" about whether they're active or not would be better, there is already the way of seeing the percent the shield is act currently.

 

[jayman38]

Love the idea of "going pirate" temporarily by turning off the transponder signal for silent running. You would only get to use your faction's stuff after turning it back on. Otherwise, everyone would go pirate, to reduce their sensor signature.

I imagine the shield count is reasonable, seeing as that is probably the first thing about the target that your computer will read. Maybe it could read a random count of the true shield amount, so the number you see could be 1% of the real shield count or 99% of the real shield count. You shouldn't be able to see the percentage of the true shield count. Maybe make it so that the shield count gets more accurate the longer your scanner can focus on target. (From a programming point of view, every minute (or however long you want to set the delay), get another random number of the total shield count. If it's closer to 100% than the current shield count in the scanner for the current target, update to the more accurate count.) Then, you have some idea that the count is somewhat accurate if you go for several minutes of scanning without an updated count. But you are never quite sure. This will make scout ships with dedicated cloak and sensor systems a viable fleet resource, getting detailed information about an enemy vessel prior to engagement by the rest of the fleet. (At least in a RP setting. Regular vanilla StarMade will simply see large ships pounding each other until the shields are down, with minimal thought to shield strength before opening fire.)

 

[SteelNorthman]

I'm currently a programmer by trade, and the idea of sensors in a programming sense is not too hard. The addition of the longer/more focused scan of a target gets better shield info would be useful. The way of scanning would need some more input/voting about how it would work before we can say the scanners can focus on a target or you just having to wait. EVE-Online has Probes that are used to find certain kinds of objects in a system, if a system for remote controlling "drones"/probes from long range comes in the use of sensor probes would be available. The Probes could be an alternative to "scout" ships if remote drones come to be. I do see larger ships ignoring the notion of trying to get each others shield info, and would rather go straight to pommelling one another.

 

[NeonSturm]

I like how EVE-Online does it.
There should be many more hidden objects that you can discover. At least in populated sectors.

I especially like the idea of accelerator gates which aid navigation, but there should be a reason why you are unable to line up your ship with the object and just fly straight ahead.

All ships should have easy access to jammers which hide their most significant signal sources, but "active scanning" should require you to turn it off.

There could be more different signal types with different jamming costs and different distances/difficulty to detect.
But I would like an easy default setup and some ways to modify it rather than a complex system all-over.