Read by Schine Power usage to adjust shields, weapons, thrust

[Wolverines527]

Hello

This is a thought i have been thinking of how to best use of power as it is now its about who has the better set up while power is important i believe its importances on everything and the need to balance it in your ship to allow for

Weapons (firepower, rate of fire)
Shields
Thrust
Exc arc(random power users like lights)

Higher power allows for more powerful shots but with a slower rate of fire then on a lower power usage

Lower power would allow faster fire rate then with more power but with less damage then with a higher power usage.

To adjust power usages for the weapons would be done through a weapons computer

Example

Cannon computer

Power. [1000000]

Available power [50000000000]

Fire power [20000]

Rate of fire 20 shots per minute


Shields power usages would be split between maintaining said shields and recharging

Shield computer
Recharge power. 1000000
Recharge rate. 300000 per second
Power to maintain 100000

Thrust computer

Mass 1000000000000
Power. 2000000
Speed 34

Lights and other power users like say a arcade would use a preset power like 1 power per appliance

It makes better sense then the using computers to boost performance and bring us to more sci fi verse and balance out ships obviously bigger ships will have harder hitting power then smaller ships but that is common sense bigger ships will have much more power at their disposal then a lighter class vessel and they shouldnt have less it should come down to who can out muscle and out think their opponet



This will force players to have to choose between
offensive
Defensive
Or mobility

 

[jayman38]

Idea for a Power Management HUD layout:


I imagine this would be accessed through an engineering block or control chair or maybe a special entry in the entity menu. My current idea is to have a server-configurable limit of 200% that you can increase the power to for any given system. (Any technobabble excuse can be given for not being able to go above 200% or whatever upper limit you choose, such as power overload, meltdown, radiation, etc.)

Starting from the left:

1. Shield Power adjustment (yellow): adjusts from 0% to 200%, with 100% being normal, naturally. (I figure this would only change recharge rate, not shield storage.)
2. Current active hotbar slot power adjustment (red): adjusts the currently selected hotbar item from 0% to 200% with 100% being normal.
3. Power generation (blue): shows the full amount of power generated by the default blueprint, so as reactor blocks are destroyed, this bar can actually drop.
4. Power excess (blue): shows the amount of power generation left over after everything gets its current power draw. This has to be above 0 e/s before any other power adjustment can be raised. Conversely, this bar raises when any power adjustment bar is dropped.
5. Thrust power adjustment (red): adjusts from 0% to 200% with 100% being normal.

While the arrows might be good basic step adjustments, the player should be able to drag the bar to where they want it. (E.g. Dragging to 150%, by grabbing the bar and moving it to the 3/4 mark along the bar.) Also, I think you should be able to reset to baseline 100% by simply single-clicking on the bar.

Finally, I think that cannon slave should be solely responsible for refire rate, so I think weapon power management should affect weapon power alone.

 

[Wolverines527]

Idea for a Power Management HUD layout:
View attachment 23952

I imagine this would be accessed through an engineering block or control chair or maybe a special entry in the entity menu. My current idea is to have a server-configurable limit of 200% that you can increase the power to for any given system. (Any technobabble excuse can be given for not being able to go above 200% or whatever upper limit you choose, such as power overload, meltdown, radiation, etc.)

Starting from the left:

1. Shield Power adjustment (yellow): adjusts from 0% to 200%, with 100% being normal, naturally. (I figure this would only change recharge rate, not shield storage.)
2. Current active hotbar slot power adjustment (red): adjusts the currently selected hotbar item from 0% to 200% with 100% being normal.
3. Power generation (blue): shows the full amount of power generated by the default blueprint, so as reactor blocks are destroyed, this bar can actually drop.
4. Power excess (blue): shows the amount of power generation left over after everything gets its current power draw. This has to be above 0 e/s before any other power adjustment can be raised. Conversely, this bar raises when any power adjustment bar is dropped.
5. Thrust power adjustment (red): adjusts from 0% to 200% with 100% being normal.

While the arrows might be good basic step adjustments, the player should be able to drag the bar to where they want it. (E.g. Dragging to 150%, by grabbing the bar and moving it to the 3/4 mark along the bar.) Also, I think you should be able to reset to baseline 100% by simply single-clicking on the bar.

Finally, I think that cannon slave should be solely responsible for refire rate, so I think weapon power management should affect weapon power alone.

You were almost there i was thinking use the cannon computer to access a menu section for that power feed for that particular weapon to type in the power usage if you use the minimum power with an abundance of energy you get faster but weaker shots then you would if you used just enough to keep a stable power supply for stronger but slower to fire shots on cannons for devestating alpha strikes without having blackouts on your ship

Shields and engines would require computers too to move and adjust powers accordingly

The extras would only take 1 power

 

[nightrune]

When it comes to power management all I want to be able to do is allocate certain percentages to certain systems.

Basically so I can reserve power for a main gun or reserve power for sensors.

 

[Madman198237]

Yeah, this is another neat idea.

The amount of energy you put into each shot should matter for damage, but you can't really affect reload rate by frying circuit boards with too much power...it just doesn't work.

That said, the adjusts are a neat idea. The more power you dedicate to any one system, the better/more powerful it gets, but it should get progressively less efficient to dedicate more power to a system.

 

[jayman38]

You were almost there i was thinking use the cannon computer to access a menu section for that power feed for that particular weapon to type in the power usage if you use the minimum power with an abundance of energy you get faster but weaker shots then you would if you used just enough to keep a stable power supply for stronger but slower to fire shots on cannons for devestating alpha strikes without having blackouts on your ship

Shields and engines would require computers too to move and adjust powers accordingly

The extras would only take 1 power

Unfortunately, your suggestion is a regression on the way that the weapon slaves work. Once upon a time, one could change slider bars to affect how a weapon worked, donating so many points to range, rate of fire, damage, and maybe a fourth element. When I put it like that, my slider bar suggestion is a regression too. It would be better to come up with some kind of block-based way to change the settings. The devs generally prefer to go with a dynamic block-based approach. Especially if it can be integrated and changed on-the-fly with logic.

My idea is based around the concept of having an engineer crew member, but it needs to be usable by the pilot as well.

 

[Wolverines527]

Unfortunately, your suggestion is a regression on the way that the weapon slaves work. Once upon a time, one could change slider bars to affect how a weapon worked, donating so many points to range, rate of fire, damage, and maybe a fourth element. When I put it like that, my slider bar suggestion is a regression too. It would be better to come up with some kind of block-based way to change the settings. The devs generally prefer to go with a dynamic block-based approach. Especially if it can be integrated and changed on-the-fly with logic.

My idea is based around the concept of having an engineer crew member, but it needs to be usable by the pilot as well.

Its very much a work in progress i generally like debates on my threads because it allows more ideas to flow on the subject

I like the idea with the more power you put into the system the better it gets

Weapons like cannons i wanted to be very flexible and work well for fighters you would need very little power for rapid fire
[DOUBLEPOST=1459377122,1459376876][/DOUBLEPOST]

Yeah, this is another neat idea.

The amount of energy you put into each shot should matter for damage, but you can't really affect reload rate by frying circuit boards with too much power...it just doesn't work.

That said, the adjusts are a neat idea. The more power you dedicate to any one system, the better/more powerful it gets, but it should get progressively less efficient to dedicate more power to a system.

Thanks hope we can get some good ideas in here to build up on the idea

 

[Lecic]

Higher power allows for more powerful shots but with a slower rate of fire then on a lower power usage

Lower power would allow faster fire rate then with more power but with less damage then with a higher power usage.

To adjust power usages for the weapons would be done through a weapons computer

Example

Cannon computer

Power. [1000000]

Available power [50000000000]

Fire power [20000]

Rate of fire 20 shots per minute

Definitely no. Slaves are a much better system.

Lights and other power users like say a arcade would use a preset power like 1 power per appliance

Lights shouldn't cost power. It prevents people from using lights to guide the way while exploring caves on planets, and they're decorative block, so they shouldn't be a detriment to have.

As for the general idea of rerouting power- I think I'd like something like what nightrune or jayman38 are suggesting more, personally.

 

[Nickizzy]

I think this would be like FTL's power bar microsystem...? Because I really liked that. I would suggest using the slider system showed above to allow people to balance between certain systems. Blocks would add to two different values(or maybe one with that at 0 or 100), one for minnimum power usage(this is minimum power level of the block), and one for max power usage(the maximum output of the block). About 10% of regular for min and 500% for maximum(~config shinanigans).
This wouuld add the really cool meta of varying power to certain systems. Cause who doesn't get goosebumps when han solo pulls power from the rear shields(I have no words about modular shielding) generator to the front one for an attack run, or putting all power to the engines to escape?

You could change different settings through(?) a power controler? Or a power block to save IDs? Adds pros for a copilot for that. You could pull power from your main cannon while mining, then start it up again when you prepare a siege. Run away by pulling out your shields, effects, and weapons just to pump every last drop of power into those engines.

 

[Wolverines527]

I think this would be like FTL's power bar microsystem...? Because I really liked that. I would suggest using the slider system showed above to allow people to balance between certain systems. Blocks would add to two different values(or maybe one with that at 0 or 100), one for minnimum power usage(this is minimum power level of the block), and one for max power usage(the maximum output of the block). About 10% of regular for min and 500% for maximum(~config shinanigans).
This wouuld add the really cool meta of varying power to certain systems. Cause who doesn't get goosebumps when han solo pulls power from the rear shields(I have no words about modular shielding) generator to the front one for an attack run, or putting all power to the engines to escape?

You could change different settings through(?) a power controler? Or a power block to save IDs? Adds pros for a copilot for that. You could pull power from your main cannon while mining, then start it up again when you prepare a siege. Run away by pulling out your shields, effects, and weapons just to pump every last drop of power into those engines.

After some thought i agree that the slide bar would be a good idea to have included with the manual type it in for a more accurate reading instead of having to fiddle with the bar

(This is off the record i spend more time trying to get an accurate number im after with slide bars)

As long as that option is there guys like me who rather type in a number for the precise number i want in seconds im sure I'm going to get a few jabs for this but im prepared lol
[DOUBLEPOST=1459402697][/DOUBLEPOST]

Definitely no. Slaves are a much better system.



Lights shouldn't cost power. It prevents people from using lights to guide the way while exploring caves on planets, and they're decorative block, so they shouldn't be a detriment to have.

As for the general idea of rerouting power- I think I'd like something like what nightrune or jayman38 are suggesting more, personally.

Though i do agree with nightwing and that was precisely what i was going for the lights do think should require power as i stated earlier though minute enough to be very barely noticeable unless your ship suffers a power loss but as for caves and lights thats where i very much disagree without a power source it shouldn't work unless you have a reactor block powering it i might be being a tad too much of a realist

 

[ToasterBorst]

Bumping to council for further review, keep up the good discussion! Personally, agree w/ Nightrune's suggestion about power allocation to certain systems.. this would be huge.. and have always wanted to see lights and logic require power.. as to Lec's point about caving.. well, we have flashlights now!

 

[Wolverines527]

Bumping to council for further review, keep up the good discussion! Personally, agree w/ Nightrune's suggestion about power allocation to certain systems.. this would be huge.. and have always wanted to see lights and logic require power.. as to Lec's point about caving.. well, we have flashlights now!

Ok thats great news
Nightrunes idea was a great idea. Hope we can continue to have some good ideas

 

[Criss]

There are some concerns here that need to be looked at.

What is the point or difference in having a cannon cannon system, and then taking the power and boosting it for lower fire rates? We nullify the weapon combo system entirely to accomplish something that we could have already achieved.

Diverting power from thrusters to shields or similar scenarios is much more useful, and does not become redundant. It adds tactics to your combat.

Requiring power, even 1 for an individual light block is punishing, as they do not really contribute anything on the ship. It's not necessary and it would mean unlit ships are more efficient for simply looking less exciting. A better alternative is to have lights dim or die out when there is a power failure, something the Schine team has expressed interest in during multiple discussions.

 

[Wolverines527]

There are some concerns here that need to be looked at.

What is the point or difference in having a cannon cannon system, and then taking the power and boosting it for lower fire rates? We nullify the weapon combo system entirely to accomplish something that we could have already achieved.

Diverting power from thrusters to shields or similar scenarios is much more useful, and does not become redundant. It adds tactics to your combat.

Requiring power, even 1 for an individual light block is punishing, as they do not really contribute anything on the ship. It's not necessary and it would mean unlit ships are more efficient for simply looking less exciting. A better alternative is to have lights dim or die out when there is a power failure, something the Schine team has expressed interest in during multiple discussions.

To answer that question i was looking for a very tactical look into everything you do i most times you will have a very large unused pool of power that seems pretty endless with no other use for it so i was thinking put it to use for firepower, shields or thrust so that each ship you build you calibrate it for a certain tactcal edge

The slow down in a fire rate is for the purpose of not having a crippling black out in a battle when you deliver a full powered shot at your enemy which could cut a medium armored ship with no shielding in half and knock a immense chunk of shielding down

If you went evenly with out a you would have a fast cannon rate that you would get with cannon on cannon linked computers

Much of what i wrote was inspired by some sci fi space battles i read where everything relied on a ships power output

If you or anyone wants to bounce ideas around we can find better ideas like nightwings idea

 

[Madman198237]

I agree that adding such an effect to a weapon group can often become counterproductive, but would really like to see the possibility of giving more energy to shields to increase regen or capacity, if even for a short period of time (Overclocked shields, anyone?).

Same with thrust, because really, the afterburner effect is generally not useful on larger ships. Or, at least, it's not useful in my experience.

 

[Nickizzy]

There are some concerns here that need to be looked at.

What is the point or difference in having a cannon cannon system, and then taking the power and boosting it for lower fire rates? We nullify the weapon combo system entirely to accomplish something that we could have already achieved.

Diverting power from thrusters to shields or similar scenarios is much more useful, and does not become redundant. It adds tactics to your combat.

Requiring power, even 1 for an individual light block is punishing, as they do not really contribute anything on the ship. It's not necessary and it would mean unlit ships are more efficient for simply looking less exciting. A better alternative is to have lights dim or die out when there is a power failure, something the Schine team has expressed interest in during multiple discussions.

What if the effect only increased power usage and output, as in only increasing flat damage or max power or power gen(if they are different systems)* . This is a bit less exciting compared to greater or lesser power usage affecting things like blast radius, or range, or shot size, or slowing fire rate, but that complicates things.

* Make it a bit less efficent than adding more blocks on, so it takes like 600% power to do 500% output, so people don't just make power blocks.

 

[Wolverines527]

What if the effect only increased power usage and output, as in only increasing flat damage or max power or power gen(if they are different systems)* . This is a bit less exciting compared to greater or lesser power usage affecting things like blast radius, or range, or shot size, or slowing fire rate, but that complicates things.

* Make it a bit less efficent than adding more blocks on, so it takes like 600% power to do 500% output, so people don't just make power blocks.

I was trying to not make it over powered purhapse i made it under powered it looked good on paper now it just looks underwelming

 

[Nickizzy]

I was trying to not make it over powered purhapse i made it under powered it looked good on paper now it just looks underwelming

Ikr. Don't stress the numbers, just say config shinanigans, throw it out there, and see what sticks.(That should be like the forum saying-throw it at a wall and see what sticks.)

 

[Wolverines527]

Ikr. Don't stress the numbers, just say config shinanigans, throw it out there, and see what sticks.(That should be like the forum saying-throw it at a wall and see what sticks.)

Lol i made it a tad too sticky most of my threads i like to build it up instead drawing it down


This is Off the record i like to just blow shit up and build some cool builds i like to be meticulous in what i build and have a strategy

 

[StarWars1981]

And now... to throw my 2 cents in for fun.
I'd like to see a way to fiddle with power. However, I've got a different idea.
First, allocating regen loses its point, although you may still do it for something I don't think of in this post.
You can allocate CAPACITY to different systems. This would be expressed as both a percent and a direct number. First, if a cannon has X capacity, it should be able to be directed to use Y percent per shot. If its dedicated capacity runs out, it stops shooting. No power blackouts now!

Thrusters could be given an "overdrive" percentage of capacity, to just burn at a maximum (config shenanigans) percent above normal power usage, adding thrust with a higher power efficiency than the standard thrusters' standard thrust. However, during this time, say the system locks down or whatnot, and that percentage of capacity cannot be recharged/recharged power cannot be used by the overdrive effect.

Shields, meanwhile, get a regen boost. If you have the regen to support it, perhaps, you can keep the effect coming, or it could be locked down like thrust (which would be OP to continue for too long; shield regen, meanwhile, may have a lower efficiency boost. I see a MASSIVE boost in efficiency in the overdrive effect) so it can't be permanently maintained.

The point is, systems handed a larger percentage of capacity, and given the ability to use more power than standard to draw on that capacity beyond normal (temporarily!), will be more powerful. These dynamic settings could be accessed by a slider in the core. A set of sliders, actually, containing subsets such as: Docked Entities (to power whatever, including turrets + docked ships' shields. Could also power their thrusters if inherit-thrusters-from-docks is set to ON), (SPECIFIC and INDIVIDUAL) Weapons Computers, Shield Regen, Thrusters, and your fancy light show!

Please note this ONLY allocates capacity; recharge would need to be messed with to refill each capacity via percentage of TOTAL capacity. This means that a system with 40% of capacity gets 40% of recharge. Simple on this end, but Idk about the coding.

TEXT WALL! Thanks for reading. Or, if not, thanks for understanding that us nerds need to post walls occasionally. It's a hobby. - Edits: spaced text out more to make it readable, fixed my rambling to do the same. Says the same thing but better.