Possible solution to many player's catalog gripes.

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    In another area of the forums people have been debating the catalog system. About how it spawns materiels out of thin air at the cost of some credits, killing manufacturing and any chance of materiel scarcity.

    I may have a solution.

    When the military wants to build something they don't go to the local home depot and buy out the store. They approach a supplier and make a deal for the stuff they need to be delivered to them.

    That's what I propose the shops do in regards to the cataloge.

    1. The game checks to see what blocks and how many are needed for a blueprint
    2. Then it checks the player's inventory to see if the player has some of the neccesary mats, and if the player lets it, it will take those materiels to reduce how many blocks are needed to be bought.
    3. Then the store will check it's inventory, and take from it's supply, adding the cost of the parts to the cost of the blueprint.
    4. Once the store is out of mats and it needs more it starts looking nearby for other shops. Taking parts from that shop, and adding a surcharge for every sector away the other shop is.
    5. Repeat 4 until all the nessesary materiels are obtained.
    6. If there are no shops with the materiel in the explored universe, either generate the materiels and add a random multiplier to the existing surcharge (handwaving distant shops in stock) or generate additional map area
    7. Show the player the final price (and possibly a block breakdown with prices and surcharges, exactly like an invoice) and ask for confirmation

    This should still promote a scarcity, as populated sectors quickly drain surrounding sectors of commonly used parts and the surcharges become prohibitive. And allowing factories to work their magic. While still preserving the convienience of the catalog for small ships, those who have the money, and those willing to explore away from the population centers.

    Any thoughts, complaints, or kittens?
     
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    Kittens. Many kittens.



    This would fix a lot of economy issues and make factories at least worth building, if not profitable.
     
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    more reason to use factories definatly a +

    more reason to explore definatly a +

    as i said in another thread on this, it would be great if you could make the blueprint yourself without needing a shop, just make a shipyard that is wider taller and longer than the ship you plan to spawn and feed it all the materials needed like a factory. both things are great ideas and could possibly be combined
     
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    I also liked the idea of the shipyard. I figure combining the two would be a simple matter of checking the shipyard\'s inventory. And if the operator so chooses the shipyard could also pull missing materiels from nearby shops, exactly as the shops would.
     
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    I liked the idea of encouraging trading between shops. If someone posts a demand for materials at a shop, at a higher price than normal, it would encourage other players to transport those materials from nearby shops themselves, making trading a viable profession.
     
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    It seems like your way of \"fixing\" the catalogue may take up a lot of resorces for the game which are used elsewere (not ingame materials, but memory and whatnot)

    Also This topic was already created by someone with the same exact way of \"fixing\" the catalog... which was shot down pretty thoroughly by Planr, So since this is another posting of the same topic/subjuect Ill jsut copy/paste the facts which the wise Planr posted.




    I understand the complexity of the system perfectly. If you\'re going to call me out as misunderstanding, keep in mind that this supply and demand system you are speaking of is a player-upheld idea, assuming of course you are referring to player-to-player resource trading (it would help if you were to clarify on that). It does not actually exist in the game currently because players do not trust each other enough to trade as one does with goods in real life. Granted, I have seen some players \"trading\" items with each other on rare occasions as one would in a real \"supply and demand\" system but other than that, the idea you are speaking of currently does not exist in StarMade.


    as well as:


    Then they can go and buy more red hulls as supply blueprints at a shop. 1 minute of traveling and 5 seconds of safe buying.

    Or, they can toil for several hours to get the resources needed to feed through a factory, and then wait another hour for the machines to properly process all of the needed materials.

    Or they could wait ~10 minutes for a \"merchant\" player to come to their sector claming to have the items they need, only to get annihilated by said \"merchant\" who is really in a large battleship. The supply and demand system you are talking about does not work in StarMade because there is nothing preventing one side of the trade from being \"voided\" and one player destroying the other for fun/more materials. This is not TF2, where you trade strange items for hats, etc. Players can literally destroy each other\'s vessels. Supply and demand in trading does not work.


    All of this can be found here:

    http://star-made.org/content/catalogue-system-absolutely-broken-and-exploitable
     
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    I\'m not certain where this idea is mentioned in that thread outside of my own posts, which Planr did not reply to. The only response I got for this suggestion (which I did indeed post in that thread) is that I should make a suggestion thread for it. Which is why it is here.

    In fact as far as I could tell Planr is responding to a completely diffrent post entirely, and I\'m confused at how it relates to this suggestion, can you please clarify?

    As for additional server load for calculating this, yes it would, but there are options to minimize that. The processing could be spread out, instead of doing all that searching at once only searching a handful of sectors every 5 seconds or so, while giving the client a cool little clientside window of the found materiels slowly climbing as they are found. It\'s not like the trading guild would be able to get all that stuff instantly anyway, so spreading out the processing time both makes sense and spreads the load to background levels instead of lag spike inducing troubles.
     
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    Perhaps it should take time for the parts to be delivered to different shops and for the ship to be built, so people don\'t just poof it out of the air. I\'m not sure how it would work in multiplayer though, that\'s the only issue.
     
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    Sorry, that post wasnt Directed fully at your topic, though it does seem like its a repost. someone trying to fix somthign that was thought out and implamented into the game with great care.

    The Quotes were mainly for people who think that it should be changed to make the games \"Suply and demand\" better for player to player tradeing. sorry. XD
     
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    i saw that post by planr in the other thread too, and all i have to say to that regarding this variation of the idea is: we are not talking about player trade here and why on earth would an hour ever be considered a reasonable wait time for the shipyard, i mean maybe if you got some rediculously massive ship to justfy a rediculouse wait time.... but i was thinking something more along the lines of every 200 blocks adds 1 second to the construction time
     
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    I read the previous thread that you guy are talking about, and I just don\'t agree with Planr at all.

    His argument was basically: \"There is no economic impact from the existing blueprint system. There is no problem with players making a blueprint of 1,000 sheild dispersers and then ordering them over and over to salvage the blocks. There is no real supply-and-demand anyway, so what does it matter? Don\'t restrict gameplay just to fix a problem that doesn\'t exist..\" and blahblahblahblahblah

    Sorry, but he\'s just flat out wrong. Anyone who understands the system can see that there are serious economic/balance problems with the existing blueprint system, esspecially the fact that you don\'t even have to be at a shop to instantly create a ship from a blueprint. Also the fact that it makes shop inventory completely pointless since you can get ANY blocks you can afford at anytime from anywhere using a blueprint. That\'s pretty clearly broken and I really don\'t understand why the heck Planr was so adamant about not changing it.

    The proposed solution in this thread is great, but I fear it might be a bit too complex. But if it could be done, I think it would be a huge improvement. It might even be good to require a small waiting time before the constructed ship is delivered. Nothing too drastic, but between 1 and 5 minutes seems reasonable.
     
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    I\'d be happy with just chaning the \"Buy\" to \"Build\" and require the player have the items on them. Another thought would be to build ships through a factory module with ample slots for blueprints with many unique items.