My thoughts on StarMade

[Blakk]

Hello and a good day,

I have a couple of thoughts about StarMade and wanted to share them in the hope that others might develop them with me.

StarMade is still in alpha phase and therefore I do not expect it to be well developed at this point even though I have to admit that it is very good already. Nonetheless there are a few basic things that I find to be heading into the wrong - or rather an un-optimal direction.

I like that you can build your very own ship but the way it is done is too simple! It all comes down to placing thousands of blocks. Sure there is some thinking involved when building reactors but in the end that's simple as well. The result is that players build giants that can outtank anything because they have a 300 000 shields/sec regeneration rate while pirates don't even do 1 000 damage/sec. To counter such a Leviathan you simply have to build a larger one. Not very creative. A possible solution might be to have more complex block-interaction. I am thinking of the IndustrialCraft, BuildCraft and Forestry mod for MineCraft: there are endless ways to build something and therefore your creativity knows no limits. It also would allow for very clever systems and a much more personalized wayd of building ships. For example the power generation: in IndustrialCraft there is a power unit called EU/t (EnergyUnits; EnergyUnits/tick) and there are many ways to generate that energy like fossil fuels, biomass, solar power, nuclear reactors, etc. In order to use that generated energy one has to lay down a power-grid that may have different currents and therefore you need different type of cables that are made out of different materials that where extracted from different ores and so forth. And what about a communications array? Sure simple, server-wide chat is easy to do but wouldn't it deepen the experience when you actually have to be in communications range to talk to someone? For longer distances you could build stations that act as communication-relays.

Don't just give the players a block that does everything for them make them do it themselves!

Another thing that I was thinking about is more subsystems. For now you pretty much have certain systems integrated like radar that lets you spot objects that you may not even be able to see yet. Why not make it that such a system has to be build by the player themself? Maybe by giving a sensor block and the more sensor block a ship has the further it can scan e.g. for pirates that are 10 systems away. My personal preference would be a complex, self-developed system like mentioned above. Another subsystem could be internal anti-personnel turrets. I always wondered why in all the sci-fi movies the warships never had any internal turrets. How easy would it have been to defend the Enterprise if AI-guided turrets would simply kill all the intruders instead of running around in jump-suits and getting hit by lasers.

Some kind of FTL-Drive: this topic has already been discussed but I wanted to give my opinion at this point anyway. My implementation idea is as follows: a subsystem that needs to build up power based on the distance and the mass of the ship. Maybe add some base value to it so 1 sector jumps would take longer to charge than to travel by sub-light but at the same time make very long distances not as time consuming. A exemplary calculation could be like this:

charge duration (in seconds) = (mass * distance)^(1/3.6) + 60
mass = 4000 (as example)
sector size = 3000m*3000m*3000m (don't know what the actual size is)
distance = in meters in a direct line to the target location

charge for 1 sector = (4000 * 3000)^(1/3.6) + 60 = 2m32s
charge for 2 sectors = (4000 * 6000)^(1/3.6) + 60 = 2m52s
charge for 5 sectors = (4000 * 15000)^(1/3.6) + 60 = 3m24s
charge for 10 sectors = (4000 * 30000)^(1/3.6) + 60 = 3m55s
charge for 20 sectors = (4000 * 60000)^(1/3.6) + 60 = 4m32s
charge for 50 sectors = (4000 * 150000)^(1/3.6) + 60 = 5m34s
charge for 100 sectors = (4000 * 300000)^(1/3.6) + 60 = 6m32s
charge for 1000 sectors = (4000 * 3000000)^(1/3.6) + 60 = 11m30s

This number could also be interpreted as travel time where the player would plot a course, enter warp instantly (be put into some pseudo-dimension) and after the duration teleport to the target destination (this way there will be no heavy load on the server).

Drones. Different types of drones like combat drones, repair drones, mining drones, sensory drones could be awesome! Small, AI-controlled ships that you can dock/undock by remote command.

Some other things that, as I think, everyone can agree on:

• Navigation screen needs some filter option (I don't care for all the asteroids in my sector)
• Pirate loot is too much/valueble (whats the point of money when you reach credit limit after 3 hours of playing?)

That is all I can think of for now.

 

[Chevalleis]

1+. I think your ideas, especially the subsystems need some work but I can\'t think of noteworthy improvements as of now.

 

[Stakhanov]

I don\'t see how more required subsystems would deter gigantism in any way (see the main thread) as large ships can support a larger fraction of misc blocks , while also shielding them from enemy fire. Small fighters would have more critical subsystems crippled once shields are down , even from a few stray shots.

Any method of restricting in-game communication between allies is ultimately useless , because of third-party chat/messengers and voice comms.

Drones don\'t seem feasible in a game of freeform ship building. In Eve , drones are strictly limited and often specialized , so that net damage and utility functions can compare with ship-bound modules. I really don\'t want to encounter carriers lagging me to death with hundreds of tiny fighters.

 

[ImperialDonut]

Starmade is still in early Alpha and intricate systems are yet to be added, but more suggestions/support for more complex mechanics is always good in my book. I wrote a pretty extensive weapons system proposal in my suggestion thread that would fit nicely to this I think: http://star-made.org/content/donuts-suggestion-thread-combat-holograms-planets-much-more

I\'m a big supporter of a lot more complexity in starmade, and a combat system much more based on a rock/paper/scissors style of offensive/defensive systems would fit perfectly in Starmade imho.

However, I do believe that bigger ships should remain mostly dominant, since completely ignoring the basic rules of physics in favour of gameplay makes little sense and kindda kick people who build these ships in the face.

With a rock/paper/scissors approach a smaller kind of ship can do a lot of damage to a capital ship if used right, but since they are built to take a lot of punishment you should not be able to take it down easily. Unless of course you use the absolute worst kind of resists/defensive systems versus the attackers kind of ofensive systems.

 

[fdshfn]

I definately think pirate loot needs to be nerfed, I often net 700mil+ in L5 minerals from a single kill.

 

[MrFURB]

Ah, more good discussion!

You make a good point, and I\'m sure that some people will find more complex systems a ton of fun. The problem with that, though, is that you would have to have those subsystems be optional, else it raises the bar of entrance for the game, narrowing the audience that would enjoy the game. Forcing someone who wants to play Minecraft to play Tekkit usually requires friends or a lot of manuals.

Options are good. Options are what makes freeform games good, and I\'d love to see more that make sense from a gameplay perspective.

Not having a global communications system built into servers causes a lot of problems. Players are less likely to find each other, set up trades/ambushes, and it really is nice to just talk with random people sometimes. Forcing players to build communications infrastructure for basic server chat kinda takes away from the social aspects of being on a multiplayer sandbox where people are supposed to be constantly interacting, not running 400 sectors away and wondering why they\'re getting bored of just building.



FTL Drive: The problem with most FTL systems I have is that a sufficient generator allows you to pop into any sector you want unannounced. You could set up ambushes with carriers, you could bypass tons of pirates, any exploring you would have to do, all in favor of typing in coordinates and charging up the drives. In warfare, any type of FTL not reliant on visible, defendable/attackable infrastructure with a limited range is going to change the way people play completely and turn it into a more Minecraft-esque game of hide-and-go-raid with factions hiding their bases infinite sectors away and everyone else trying to guess their location from trillions of sectors.

Also, drones/AI fighter-bombers for the win!

 

[Stakhanov]

Come to think of it , a simple way of limiting drone usage is to make each deployed drone require exponentially more bandwidth (or whatever variable) from drone control blocks. So , while carriers could host a lot of drones , they could only deploy a few at a time. Destroying drones belonging to smaller craft would cripple those more durably.

You want to be careful with drone size , however. If they can compete with player-piloted ships , that would give the player in the largest ship effective numerical superiority. Who needs friends or combat skills when AI can do all the work for you !

 

[Alkarym]

Ftl is a good thing... if used properly! you have to take all the sci-fi movies and shows, when a ship enters FTL, it leaves a tral, so here\'s another cool, usefull subsystem!

also, whenever a ship is bound for a sector of space, there\'s always someone to shout: \"Capt\'n there\'s a huge ship in approach! it will be here in 2 minutes!\" therefore, another kind of system, long range scans...

if you plot a course for sector 32,532,-12 all the ships in that sector with long range scans will see a new nav point showing where you\'ll land! with maybe a line pointing in the direction of you point of origin! so yeah, by the time you get there, they would have time to mobilize!

 

[MrFURB]

How would one manage a blockade to keep people out of your faction\'s territory? You would have to add another item/subsystem for that one purpose. How would you ensure that the expansion of humanity doesn\'t make the findind of rare materials moot?

If we\'re allowed to expand at light-speed, people will simply go through a billion sectors of unexplored space and mine out all the rare materials in their private corner of the universe without anyone else knowing, instead of trading, negotiating, or fighting for rare materials with other players. If rare materials aren\'t being fought over in one way or another, then they lose importance and the whole idea of rare resources is for naught.

I have stated my views on FTL travel a hundred times before; I think that gates should be built that allow ships smaller than them to warp to any other gates connected to their \'network\'. They should be relatively expensive but not overly so (An inexpensive gate won\'t be worth protecting when you could lose ships doing so, but a hugely expensive gate won\'t be buildable by smaller factions who also need some form of fast travel) Gates will have limited, but long, range. You could use a gate to travel 100 sectors, but not 1,000. In order to travel thousands of sectors, you need to build a network of gates stretching along the distance.

With gates, other players or factions can cripple your ability to fast-travel by sieging your bases and destroying them, as they hold your gates. This provides incentive to build multiple bases encompassing a territory and to defend them, as well as scout out the enemy\'s bases, trace their gates, and cut off valuable junctions to split an enemy up.

Smaller groups of players can use just two gates to have a private, two way fast-travel system to and from their base as well. Just be careful to close the PLEXdoors behind you, else someone might follow you through the gate.

 

[Alkarym]

again, you imply that you can hide somewhere in the universe? but no! every ship leaves a trail behind that can be followed... it dissipates over time, sure, but the farther you went, the bigger the trail and the longer it will last. any rogue vessel wandering on such a trail could be compeled to follow! and you could even set traps with those kind of trails, knowing where the said rogue will pop out! FTL would bring a whole new aspect to the game... as long as it\'s not \"here, jumping to FTL\" ... \"poof : gone into oblivion\".

 

[Alviss]

I support Furb\'s idea of the jumpgate. To build your jump portal, you\'ll need to actually fly to the sector, deploy it, and then link them together. If you add in that gates cannot be locked, and anyone can use them, it becomes an even better way to expand and get new resources but not a way to isolate yourself.

 

[Blakk]

Protecting your own sector can be done by a station that emits some kind of warp disruption field maybe. Also you could build an observation station that is large enough to scan in a radius of let\'s say 100 sectors for players/pirates. The jumpgates are a pretty pointless idea since at some point everyone will have enough resources and experience to simply build jumpgates all over the place. Actually it\'s kinda similar to the nether gates in MineCraft where which divide the distance to travel by 8 so people often build nether rail systems which transport you thousands of blocks quickly. Those rail systems are uncommon directly after a map reset but shortly established. This, of cause, is only possible if they don\'t get griefed. Same goes for jumpgates: if griefers destroy your gates all the time there is no point in having them in the first place and therefore it is not a viable long-distance travel method. Why make everything so complicated? Just put a FTL drive on it and test it. If it doesnt work it can be removed again or if it needs some improvement/alteration then that. After all experimentation is what an alpha version is good for. Hell why not just put FTL drive and jumpgates into the game and see what comes of it.

The communications array is probably really not such a good idea but maybe some player implemented mail system. Like every mail station is kinda like a mail server IRL where you send a message to station X and then someone can pick it up there. It would be a good option to send messages to players that are not online. I don\'t know how this might work or not but in my experience people really love to do stuff that might be dealt with in a more efficient way but they like to build their little goodies and get prestige for it.



One thing that I always missed in MineCraft that I strongly think might, in some scenarios at least, be a really awesome idea is some kind of way to let players include their custom sounds(streams). In MineCraft that it could have been some special audio-block that you activate and them some custom music plays. In StarMade maybe you can do this for some space-station bar that you build where you want to play some cool music, or some standard audio transmission when you dock to a stataion (\"Hello, traveler: welcome to the trading hub of the faction XYZ\"), or on a very populated server you could do some radio broadcasts with news from the server internal affairs, maybe some propaganda that is being send into every corner of the galaxy etc. The sound quality could be something like 64kbit ogg and an option for the server and the players if they want to allow such transmission.

Then there was this idea that I had about server-clusters. The number of players that can play simultaneously on a server is obviously limited by the computation power of that server. What about putting several servers (that are run by different people) togheter in a way that lets say server one hosts sectors 0,0,0 to 128,128,128; server 2 hosts sector 128,128,128 to 128,128,256 etc. This would be highly experimental of couse but why not? There would have to be some server-to-server communication aswell as the client would have to know what sectors are being opperated by which server so that a seamless transition from one server to another would be possible. If this works the outcome could be that there are MMORPG like universes with thousands of players in a single universe while at the same time the computation power (and the server costs) is shared by a community as a whole.



While writing this I do understand that StarMade is being developed by a single individual and the workload of all these proposals would be immense! Then again this could be the golden duck that will make him rich :D

 

[Senzorei]

Maybe have like a jukebox in a bar where you can play music files from your computer for a cost? That would be kind of cool :D