Keep Faction Homes Invincible

[Edymnion]

The problem with your attitude is:

1) You are forcing your way of playing on someone who doesn't necessarily want it. If you want a pure no holds barred PvP server where everyone understands that from the start, that's fine. But core game play mechanics that apply to all games and servers by default should not cater to that kind of mindset. Plenty of people just want to design and build cool stuff, and don't want to be attacked for no reason. Seeing as how this is a voxel game, the builder is the default player, not the pvper.

2) You are actively admitting that you understand someone doesn't want to fight you, is actively avoiding fighting you, but you are hunting them down and forcing them to fight anyway? Doing that doesn't make someone a pvper, that just makes them an ass.

3) PvP is about fighting another player. Rolling a lvl 100 character over a lvl 10, or a capitol ship over a miner isn't a fight, it's just ganking. If the other guy has no hope of defending themselves, it's not PvP, it's just griefing.

 

[Incap]

1) You are forcing your way of playing on someone who doesn't necessarily want it. If you want a pure no holds barred PvP server where everyone understands that from the start, that's fine. But core game play mechanics that apply to all games and servers by default should not cater to that kind of mindset. Entry of people just want to design and build cool stuff, and don't want to be attacked for no reason. Seeing as how this is a voxel game, the builder is the default player, not the pvper.

The only one I see forcing anyone to play in a particular way is you and Major. You don't like PvP, so therefore all PvPers are rubbish and must be forced out. That's the impression I'm getting here. I would argue that it should apply to both a creative and PvP mindset, but my opinion means little unless I agree with you completely, yes?

2)You are actively admitting that you understand someone doesn't want to fight you, is actively avoiding fighting you, but you are hunting them down and forcing them to fight anyway? Doing that doesn't make someone a pvper, that just makes them an ass.

I don't recall saying anything of the sort. All I said is if you don't like PvP, don't go on servers that allow it. What do you think is going to happen? You can't blame other people if you decide to walk through a firing range with a massive bullseye on your face.

3) PvP is about fighting another player. Rolling a lvl 100 character over a lvl 10, or a capitol ship over a miner isn't a fight, it's just ganking. If the other guy has no hope of defending themselves, it's not PvP, it's just griefing.

I agree. What's your issue then?

 

[Edymnion]

My point is thus is not a discussion about specific servers, it is about the default game.

Invincible faction bases stop griefers cold, and this is a good thing.

ANY circumstance that strips that immunity from an active player outside of their consent for any reason is a bad thing.

Not being able to completely destroy every single block someone owns does not stop you from having pvp. Allowing it DOES stop people from being able to play PvE and building, because the asshole griefers will jump through any hoops to make it happen.

There were plenty of stats back for Wow showing that PvE players outnumbered PvP players (based on total server populations across all servers) nearly 2 to 1.

PvPers in MMOS are a minority. A large one, but still a minority. Most players dont like it, and don't want it. Seeing as how Starmade is a voxel game that literally has building as the core game mechanic, I'm willing to wager that ratio is even higher here.

My point is faction home base invincibility must remain. I would rather see PvP be hurt than see everything else flat out destroyed by griefers.

 

[StormWing0]

Would rather have HB invincibility be a server option and if people want to turn it off let them. In any event as for a new setup to determining if the base can be destroyed or not well I'd say asking the community what kind of possible setups for this would be would be a good idea because just throwing something out there is a good way to have a mob with torches at your door. ^_^

 

[FrankRa]

-snip-

-snip-

Oh boy... long paragraph incoming. Brace yourselves guys...

I don't know what people are getting so afraid of. There is no 'default' game; have you even been playing this game for the last 3-4 updates?
Everything that has been added or tweaked can be turned off in the server config file. Have you not noticed that destructible HBs are already a thing? It's a server option of course, and by this being the case now you can rest assured that it will be an option for the servers to decide to accept or not.

On the topic of StarMade PvP, according to you, what is good PvP? Because according to the majority of the PvP faction scene, to which I am mostly friendly with, is a fair and square fight between equal forces in an arranged scenario. That's what they want, not to roll over some noob with a 1k mass grey cube, where is the fun in that? The majority of factions even have in their rules and guidelines that they will leave newbies alone. Because it's not fun to attack them.
Your statements only scream of bad experiences with "PvPers" in the past, and the way you want to somehow carpet bomb every single PvP aspect of the game is either impossible, or completely unnecessary.

Of course, if you hate PvP that much, why not go on an RP server, or a PvE server, or a Build server, since all you want is to build and kill pirates. You could make the argument that these are not very populated or popular servers, but that's really not the case, the prime example being GenXNova, the "#1" server right now (in quotations because server popularity is very volatile these days), which hosts a PvE galaxy, with factions and stuff. And why would you go play into a server infested with these "terrible terrible PvPers that will screw everything I do up".
You disliking PvP or being bad at it does not mean that everyone else who enjoys it should be dragged down to your own level under the excuse of "fairness" and "justice".

Now, returning to the topic of homebase invincibility, while I do agree that there is no reason to take it off yet, I do expect to see it go eventually, as I'd put destroying an enemy's base the "win condition" to end wars. However if it were for me, I'd leave it on forever, because wiping an enemy faction off the server also harms the victor, as they no longer have that particular set of targets to shoot at, and the server, because destroying everything a faction has would only drive those people away the server. Up to Schine I guess.

In conclusion, nothing is being forced down on you, stop acting like it is, if Schine is pushing for something with their updates is for player and server owner choice. As much as people whine this will not change. You choose to go into a server that fits your preferences, and if there aren't any, your only options are to make one yourself or adapt to the existing server's playstyle. And if you can't beat these horrible human beings that you speak of, then you should organize against them with other players, because you can, and playing this game alone is honestly not fun for me. Don't know about you.

This is really interesting. No one is even reading the posts from the other side. Just skimming enough to find something to attack.
Can we get a mod to lock and / or delete this regurgitated flame war? Moving on...

Please do not act like there are personal attacks flying everywhere or something of that sort, there really aren't. I just see a discussion with valid arguments from both sides. There is no reason to say this is a flame war when it isn't.

 

[StormWing0]

I've ran into PKers before unlike most PVPers these guys don't leave anyone alone. They intentionally hunt anyone they can most often people that can't fight back and yes even gang up on well established players to try and take them down. There is nothing fair and square about these guys. Normal PVPers I can handle because unless I bug them they don't bug me, but full on PKers and trolls well no one likes either and it usually results in a huge fire fight that gets the PKers and trolls totally destroyed and/or likely banned. >_>

 

[FullMetalFox]

Well lets see whats up with old starmade... oh one of those threads...

The problem with your attitude is:
1) You are forcing your way of playing on someone who doesn't necessarily want it.

This quote is very funny IMHO, because if you take a close look, you are doing the same thing.
So why exactly do we yet again need on of those old "Carebear vs HurrDurrPVP" threads, were the brain dead members of both extrems bash their heads in? Seriously, i get it, its fun to read all this bashing, smattering and bigotry, but why dont you guys try to come up with ideas to that benefit all involved sides?

3) PvP is about fighting another player. Rolling a lvl 100 character over a lvl 10, or a capitol ship over a miner isn't a fight, it's just ganking. If the other guy has no hope of defending themselves, it's not PvP, it's just griefing.

The term Player vs Player just describes any situation in which one or more players engage in combat against one or more other players, and combat does not even requiere the attacked party to counter. So even ganking and combat related griefing is PvP by devinition, no matter what you view as fair. If those are fun/meaningful, if they are staged/roaming/wars/ganking/griefing/etc, or if they are unscaled/scaled/equalized is a differnt subject. They all, in any combination, fall under the term PvP.

So please dont try to portray one of PvPs catergories as the only "true" PvP, depending on game design even ganking has a purpose.

 

[MrFURB]

Howdy folks. It seems recess is over, so I'll be temporarily locking this thread while I perform a clean-up operation and assign points where needed.

Edit: Alrighty, that mess is done with. Thanks for your patience; let's resume normal conversation.