Faction Wide Economy needs

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    One of the biggest problems in this game is the unwieldy nature of factions. Currently lacking security and a functional economy, there really isn't much need to expand and build an empire. Which is something I'm sure several of us want to do. I think my suggestion will fix the economy side of the problem.

    As it stands, there isn't much incentive to hold more than two sectors. Your home sector and another where you mine. Once you mine out one you abandon it and move to another. There isn't any real reason to hold territory beyond this, other than maybe bragging rights. But, if you could hold a sector and planets would trickle resources to your base, there would be a reason to hold multiple sectors and multiple bases. Here is how I would implement it.

    1) you would need to build a mine on a planet. This mine would link to a cargo space of any kind, be it plex storage or whatever Schema has planned. This would then trickle resources found on that planet at a slow rate to that cargo space. Once the cargo space is full one would need to link additional cargo space for resources to continue to trickle in.

    2) The trickle rate would be dependant on the planet size and quality. Each planet gets a quality rating based on size and damage done. So, if someone damages/blows up your planet your trickle rate would decrease/stop if the planet blows up. Destroying the mine would also reduce the trickle rate to zero. Leaving the planet intact leaves it open for you to mine.

    3) This would not reduce the need for traditional mining, as traditional mining removes blocks it would reduce the quality of the planet thus reducing the trickle rate. This would be a good tactic for pirates and warring factions, in addition new players, would need to mine to get started. Mining asteroids would also remain the same.

    4)Traditional mining would be much more efficient at first as well. One would need to hold several planets to meet the same resource rate as a traditional miner. Once reaching this end game economy it would allow a faction to focus on building creative ships rather than mining all their materials.

    I think this would have a few interesting effects on the game.

    1) It would give players reason to compete by building empires and capturing territories.

    2) It would give players incentive to defend their planets and build bases to defend sed planets

    3) It would reduce lag from strip mining planets.

    4) It would add to the end game economy and allow players to focus their creative abilities on creative new ships and competitive play.

    I'm open to suggestions and refinement of these ideas.
     
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    Mariux

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    But... Anyone can just come and blow up all your faction's planets while you're offline
     

    therimmer96

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    I disagree with this. What is to stop me on my own flying a few galaxies out and building mines on a load of planets. Nothing would need defending because no one would stumble across me, and I would get an essentially infinite amount of resources for pretty much 0 work.

    mining should be a task that can be automated, but not this automated.
     
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    I disagree with this. What is to stop me on my own flying a few galaxies out and building mines on a load of planets. Nothing would need defending because no one would stumble across me, and I would get an essentially infinite amount of resources for pretty much 0 work.

    mining should be a task that can be automated, but not this automated.
    It would be just as easy to fly out and blow up your planets then as they are undefended.
     

    therimmer96

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    It would be just as easy to fly out and blow up your planets then as they are undefended.
    But I am several galaxies away and I am one man. Why would you, and what is to stop me using the shit tone of resources I already have to just get some new planets?
     
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    So you'll have a shit ton of resources. If it is super easy for you to fly out that far it will be super easy for your competitors to get that far too. You'll likely lose a ton of faction points for the territory you've lost, thus your home base will become vulnerable. Your home base is public and you'll likely get blown up.
     

    therimmer96

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    So you'll have a shit ton of resources. If it is super easy for you to fly out that far it will be super easy for your competitors to get that far too. You'll likely lose a ton of faction points for the territory you've lost, thus your home base will become vulnerable. Your home base is public and you'll likely get blown up.
    But thats the thing, its not super easy to fly that far, but its possible. For example, those logic jump drives that people are building now. Start one of those and AFK for a few hours, or leave something heavy on W, align to C and AFK for a few hours.

    First system is free, so only claim one system and then the only way to lose points would be death, just log out

    also, this would need the entities being loaded all the time to keep track of the resources, increasing load on servers
     
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    But thats the thing, its not super easy to fly that far, but its possible. For example, those logic jump drives that people are building now. Start one of those and AFK for a few hours, or leave something heavy on W, align to C and AFK for a few hours.

    First system is free, so only claim one system and then the only way to lose points would be death, just log out

    also, this would need the entities being loaded all the time to keep track of the resources, increasing load on servers

    If you logic jump out far, you'll have to logic jump back.

    The first system is free yes, but if you want all those planets you'd have to claim them all. This costs faction points that you may or may not have. Losing those systems will cost you more faction points. If you don't want your base to become vulnerable this would become an unviable strategy.

    The entities would not need to be loaded all the time. An entity can be unloaded, at which time it probably already logs a time stamp. When an entity reloads it reads the time and adds the appropriate amount of material to your cargo hold. In my mind these are on the planets where you've claimed to keep folks from beaming materials sectors away.
     

    therimmer96

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    The first system is free yes, but if you want all those planets you'd have to claim them all. This costs faction points that you may or may not have. Losing those systems will cost you more faction points. If you don't want your base to become vulnerable this would become an unviable strategy.
    I think you're confusing sectors and systems there. Systems are the territory that you claim, blocks of 16^3 made of sectors. planets themselves cost nothing, and there are several in star systems, so you could have 5 planets all mining for you in the free system. planets being blown up won't cost you because you're not losing territory, you're losing planets inside the territory.
     
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    I think you're confusing sectors and systems there. Systems are the territory that you claim, blocks of 16^3 made of sectors. planets themselves cost nothing, and there are several in star systems, so you could have 5 planets all mining for you in the free system. planets being blown up won't cost you because you're not losing territory, you're losing planets inside the territory.

    I hear you. but at some point you're going to have to put a faction module in that sector correct? At least in my mind in order to "mine" the planets you'd have to have the sector claimed. You'll have to defend that if you want to keep your faction points. you'll also have to defend the planets from pirate players. This whole operation you're talking about becomes very costly very fast if you want to be invincible. The trickle would also be very slow. So holding that one sector with your invincible home base won't be super OP. It will take some balancing to get the numbers right, but I think it is very doable.
     

    therimmer96

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    hear you. but at some point you're going to have to put a faction module in that sector correct? At least in my mind in order to "mine" the planets you'd have to have the sector claimed. You'll have to defend that if you want to keep your faction points. you'll also have to defend the planets from pirate players.
    No, you won't. Because losing it would only cost the physical resources rather than the faction points.

    2 things make you lose points. a member dying, and the cost of maintaining a sector that isn't your first one. (its a crap system, building your suggestion on top of it is the main issue here. Bench hinted in a tweet that it's getting redone). losing the planet will not change that. Claiming a planet costs nothing and losing it costs the same.

    Yes, this is all very "this is what you could do" but just remember, this community has already shown a willingness to exploit things (infinite factories, block dupe bugs, logic jump, missiles aiming at center of mass and missing because its empty space) and sure as hell would do it again.
    [DOUBLEPOST=1445438145,1445438066][/DOUBLEPOST]
    The trickle would also be very slow.
    stay logged off and only login once every 48 hours to make sure the game thinks your active and gives you FP, not that its needed of course, the system is free
     
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    No, you won't. Because losing it would only cost the physical resources rather than the faction points.

    2 things make you lose points. a member dying, and the cost of maintaining a sector that isn't your first one. (its a crap system, building your suggestion on top of it is the main issue here. Bench hinted in a tweet that it's getting redone). losing the planet will not change that. Claiming a planet costs nothing and losing it costs the same.

    Yes, this is all very "this is what you could do" but just remember, this community has already shown a willingness to exploit things (infinite factories, block dupe bugs, logic jump, missiles aiming at center of mass and missing because its empty space) and sure as hell would do it again.
    [DOUBLEPOST=1445438145,1445438066][/DOUBLEPOST]
    stay logged off and only login once every 48 hours to make sure the game thinks your active and gives you FP, not that its needed of course, the system is free

    So fixes to my system would require that you lose faction points for losing controlled territory. That wouldn't be so bad. There would also be a limit as to how many sectors you can control as you can only farm so many faction points by logging in every 48 hours. Once faction in = faction out it becomes impractical to have more systems, you will need to have more players to maintain more systems.
     
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    Requiring that someone visit the planets to pickup the resources regularly might limit the abuse of building planets large distances out. You can't get the resources if you don't transport them. If there's a limit to how much can stockpile you can make it necessary to visit often.

    Perhaps make the mines more effective the closer the planet is to your homebase as well. After all in far off areas of space it's harder to stop rough characters from taking a cut of the profit.

    Both of these would lead to centralized territories in space around ones homebase, probably add a mine output bonus for it being in your home galaxy.
     
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    I disagree with this. What is to stop me on my own flying a few galaxies out and building mines on a load of planets. Nothing would need defending because no one would stumble across me, and I would get an essentially infinite amount of resources for pretty much 0 work.

    mining should be a task that can be automated, but not this automated.
    One simple feature fixes this. Have it so that it says in the diplomacy tab the systems a faction has claimed apart from only their homebase as it is currently.

    And Mariux
    4)Traditional mining would be much more efficient at first as well. One would need to hold several planets to meet the same resource rate as a traditional miner. Once reaching this end game economy it would allow a faction to focus on building creative ships rather than mining all their materials.
    He said it's going to make it so that new players don't need this, and is more of an end goal.

    I personally think this is a spendid idea. Will encourage expanding corporations to snatch all the resources and leave little options for those 1 man scrub factions, so they'll have to join a big one.

    Now all they need is for the Elwyneternity config to be the default one, so that factions actually can expand without having to have 30+ members who are active.
     

    Mariux

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    One simple feature fixes this. Have it so that it says in the diplomacy tab the systems a faction has claimed apart from only their homebase as it is currently.

    And Mariux

    He said it's going to make it so that new players don't need this, and is more of an end goal.

    I personally think this is a spendid idea. Will encourage expanding corporations to snatch all the resources and leave little options for those 1 man scrub factions, so they'll have to join a big one.

    Now all they need is for the Elwyneternity config to be the default one, so that factions actually can expand without having to have 30+ members who are active.
    I guess it makes sense. Planets can be blown up entirely right now, too anyway and as I suppose you are still able to mine the traditional way.

    +1
     
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    Lecic

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    Wasn't this already suggested? Numerous times? This is basically a copypaste of keptick's version.