Faction blocks, rights and reset, trouble

[Julianus]

We make mistakes! We sometimes press buttons we shouldn't. We press "p" in a faction block, thereby changing the permissions of all docked entities. We switch factions with a ship, but our turrets do not. Then, often there is silence of how to correct these mistakes.

We end up with rights we cannot reset anymore.

It would help, if one could correct these mistakes.

Proposal in pseudo code for reset behavior if faction blocks are removed, or the signature is reset:

RecursiveResetRights(ship):

SimpleResetRights(ship)
for each docked entity as entity:

if not hasFactionblock(entity):

RecursiveResetRights(entity)​

What is the effect? If you have a docked ship with no faction module, you can get control back if you can remove the faction module. Usually there is a small window of opportunity for such repairs.

Otherwise I think the right system is fine. It is certainly necessary to extend the rights to docked entities. Only the reset behavior should be modified.

Hope I haven't repeated a known issue too often,

Thanks for developing this game Schine.

 

[PLIX]

what about special pirate ships claim a core with the blue transparent docky thingy (cant be bothered to remember the name) to make a titan dock to the core and then you just type in the command and voila you have a free titan

 

[Julianus]

My proposal affects only ships without faction block.

Your Titan should have a faction block with rights you cannot remove as a pirate.

To my observation, rails do not move you, if your faction is different than that of the ship. Noticed when I had this cruiser with a simple ship docked inside, didn't move.

 

[jayman38]

It took me a while to grok this idea, but I agree. If the core ship's faction block is removed, reset all docked entities' faction to null or whatever value that faction blocks have when they are initially placed. However, Plix has a good point. Docked ships (as opposed to sub-entities like doors, turrets, spinning do-dads, etc.) should keep their own factions. So... How do you define what is a docked ship or not? This seems to be further evidence to warrant a change between full ships and ship parts. Turrets are already easily defined as a sub-entity/ship-part, because of their AI setting as a turret, but normal sub-entities, like doors, currently are just their-own-ships on a rail.

 

[Julianus]

Distinguishing between ship part and separate ship could be done by presence of a faction block.
Therefore you could still safely dock on another players station, he cannot take over.

I had cases where simple cores with no docking whatsoever were "owned" by "someone".
You cannot enter them, you cannot place anything on them, they are just there and need to be destroyed manually.
Same for full turrets, entire ships. Weird situation.

As I said, a strange situation which happened to me a couple of times.

As a limitation: Destroying a faction module with a gun may not be sufficient to reset rights. Here the "core overheats" logic my be preserved. Though you could destroy a faction block and then dock the ship.

I think its maneuver worthy of keeping i think. Not something to do easily. Maybe worth hiding your faction core inside a special protected room as you do with your core. Who can "pull" a dock like that during a battle?

 

[jayman38]

Distinguishing between ship part and separate ship could be done by presence of a faction block.
Therefore you could still safely dock on another players station, he cannot take over.
...

I put a faction block on all my sub-entities, no matter how seemingly insignificant. Basically, if it has a core, it also has a faction block. I bet I'm not alone in that habit.

Example requirement: I will typically place a wireless block on my sliding doors for opening and closing. Without a faction block, that door has absolutely no security. (Might as well not place a door there, and just have an open portal.)

If the sub-entity does not have a faction block, how does removing the core entity's removal of its faction block "lock" that sub-entity? In short, if there is no faction block, there should be no rights to reset. It should be access-able to anyone with or without a central faction block. Sounds like a bug to me....

On the other hand, if it's on a rail with an activator that has a faction permission module, then that's still on the core entity. Are you talking about resetting faction permission modules (and anything else with permissions) on the same entity when the faction block is removed? Because I fully support that too.

Edit: As far as removing the permission restrictionss on entities when the faction block is purposefully destroyed, I agree, and if it ain't happening, I consider that a bug.

 

[Julianus]

With faction blocks on the sub entities, you would have to travel from turret to turret, open it, change permissions every time something significant changes (faction change for example).

It could be considered a bug, if the case was ever part of the requirements.