Disabling movement dampening when directional input is applied

    Keptick

    Building masochist
    Joined
    Sep 26, 2013
    Messages
    4,062
    Reaction score
    1,841
    • Councillor 2 Gold
    • Railman Gold
    • Thinking Positive Gold
    So, everyone is probably familiar with the dampening (space friction) that exists in the starmade universe. It serves a couple of different purposes, such as ensuring that ships will eventually stop if a player jumps out, making it easier to control ships and avoiding lag issues from a couple of ships freely floating around. However, there are also some issues with the dampening that can compound into pretty annoying problems.

    Facts
    • Dampening increases with ship speed
    • Dampening is always present
    • Fps lag also causes imput lag, meaning that you'll actually get lower acceleration with lower fps (frames per second). So if you have a thrust/mass ratio of 2, at 20 fps you'll probably have a 1:1 thrust/mass ratio (not that actual numbers but I can confirm that acceleration is lower).
    Problem:
    First of all, dampening is keeping ships with low thrust/mass ratios from attaining max server speeds (which is ridiculous, this is space). Secondly, having low fps lowers acceleration, which compounds with the first problem; a ship will have lower top speed depending on how good your computer is.

    For example, I was flying in to dock a rather big ship (which had a 1:1 thrust/weight ratio). Now for whatever reason I started getting massive collision lag, even though my ship wasn't colliding with the station, and the imput lag problem kicked in. That's right, my ship actually started DECELERATING because my thrust could no longer overcome the dampening at that speed. I've noticed situations like this also occuring in combat; getting bad top speed due to a low FPS count.

    So, an opponent with a better computer will not only have better fps; He will also have better acceleration and a higher top speed (and better aim due to less imput lag).

    Note: This might not be as noticeable at the default top speed value as it isn't high enough to notice the problems. However it certainly is on servers with higher speed values (most good servers) and modified single player configs.

    Solution:
    First of all, I strongly suggest that imput detection gets a look at. Being penalized with lower thrust for having an average computer isn't cool.

    Now with the actual suggestion; Have the dampening value get set to 0 when directional imput is detected (a player is actively moving the ship). I know that the dampening value can be changed through ingame actions, since that's how the stop effect works. It shouldn't be that hard to implement what I said above.

    Why do this?
    What this would do is eliminate all problems with dampening and ensure that a player has the same acceleration, no matter the speed he's going at. For those out there thinking that capital ships would be greatly buffed by this, they would not. It'd still take an eternity to reach the maximum speed compared to smaller, lighter crafts (with better thrust). It'd also level out the playing field speed wise between different computers. Having atmospheric-like drag in space also breaks the immersion quite a bit.

    TL;DR Reduce dampening to 0 when a player is actively moving, removing the unrealistic drag issues that occur at higher speeds and/or low fps.
     

    Mariux

    Kittenator
    Joined
    Jun 20, 2013
    Messages
    1,822
    Reaction score
    658
    • Purchased!
    • Community Content - Silver 1
    • Legacy Citizen 8
    I think dampening should be removed entirely.
     

    Keptick

    Building masochist
    Joined
    Sep 26, 2013
    Messages
    4,062
    Reaction score
    1,841
    • Councillor 2 Gold
    • Railman Gold
    • Thinking Positive Gold
    I think dampening should be removed entirely.
    Tbh I think that it should still remain a server option. I just really want to stop having the impression of flying inside a gas giant while still having the good sides of dampening (like unmanned ships not floating on for ever if a player gets disconnected).
     

    Top 4ce

    Force or Ace?
    Joined
    Jul 25, 2013
    Messages
    527
    Reaction score
    274
    • Competition Winner - Small Fleets
    • Community Content - Bronze 1
    • Legacy Citizen 9
    Tbh I think that it should still remain a server option. I just really want to stop having the impression of flying inside a gas giant while still having the good sides of dampening (like unmanned ships not floating on for ever if a player gets disconnected).
    The ship stops when it's unloaded. However, that can be quite far from the disconnect. I also believe that it should be turned off. It make the game more interesting. You can cruise, you can turn while moving at a different direction making combat more interesting. You can also do cool visual effects and fun stuff with asteroids. You'll have to make sure you have stop weapons included if you want to harvest after battle. All in all, I love the game with it turned off.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: Will2brown

    Keptick

    Building masochist
    Joined
    Sep 26, 2013
    Messages
    4,062
    Reaction score
    1,841
    • Councillor 2 Gold
    • Railman Gold
    • Thinking Positive Gold
    The ship stops when it's unloaded. However, that can be quite far from the disconnect. I also believe that it should be turned off. It make the game more interesting. You can cruise, you can turn while moving at a different direction making combat more interesting. You can also do cool visual effects and fun stuff with asteroids. You'll have to make sure you have stop weapons included if you want to harvest after battle. All in all, I love the game with it turned off.
    Fair enough, you raise good points.

    However, that's not really the point of this suggestion. I'd rather not have the topic stray too far in that direction (since it's really opinion based).
     

    Mariux

    Kittenator
    Joined
    Jun 20, 2013
    Messages
    1,822
    Reaction score
    658
    • Purchased!
    • Community Content - Silver 1
    • Legacy Citizen 8
    The ship stops when it's unloaded. However, that can be quite far from the disconnect. I also believe that it should be turned off. It make the game more interesting. You can cruise, you can turn while moving at a different direction making combat more interesting. You can also do cool visual effects and fun stuff with asteroids. You'll have to make sure you have stop weapons included if you want to harvest after battle. All in all, I love the game with it turned off.
    Yup. And most importantly, it's more realistic.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: Ithirahad
    Joined
    Feb 15, 2015
    Messages
    158
    Reaction score
    37
    So, what yer saying, keptick (for those of us with less brain-power), is that rather than just going into yer server.cfg file and setting dampening to zero, dampening should only be applied in x and y cases with modifications according to the above described circumstances. And that yall need to buy me a better pc so I can accelerate and shoot better.... ~.o
     
    Joined
    Aug 28, 2013
    Messages
    1,831
    Reaction score
    374
    • Legacy Citizen 2
    • Top Forum Contributor
    • Legacy Citizen
    Having damping only engage when a collision is detected, until thrusting, solves the problem of damping.
    Also given your description of the problem input does need to be looked at.
     
    Joined
    Aug 2, 2013
    Messages
    11
    Reaction score
    1
    • Purchased!
    • Legacy Citizen 2
    I think you can disable it in the config files (Server and client)
     

    Keptick

    Building masochist
    Joined
    Sep 26, 2013
    Messages
    4,062
    Reaction score
    1,841
    • Councillor 2 Gold
    • Railman Gold
    • Thinking Positive Gold
    All of us already knew that. But there are some cases where damping is useful.
    Exacty. That's why I'm not just turning dampening down to 0.

    And I've been told that the imput lag thingy is caused by the way starmade detects user imput. Schema would pretty much have to rewrite it I believe (it'd be worth it though).
     
    Joined
    Feb 15, 2015
    Messages
    158
    Reaction score
    37
    Errr... I hate to be the grammar/spelling police, but... I believe you mean "input." Unless the jargonites have invented a new word while I was taking a break from walking the beat getting donuts. ;)
     

    Keptick

    Building masochist
    Joined
    Sep 26, 2013
    Messages
    4,062
    Reaction score
    1,841
    • Councillor 2 Gold
    • Railman Gold
    • Thinking Positive Gold
    Errr... I hate to be the grammar/spelling police, but... I believe you mean "input." Unless the jargonites have invented a new word while I was taking a break from walking the beat getting donuts. ;)
    whooops xD