Creating effective and efficient mining systems

[Edymnion]

...

Wha? So what does each module add in salvage power per tick? Can I get that? I don't get how both your posts can be correct.

Well, for the first part its still "can only eat one block per tic", so its still going to cause some inefficiency.

So if you had 199 power you'd have 198 salvage power passed on to the next block on the second tic, and then you'd eat it on the third with most of that spilling over to the next block so that you'd eat it fully the next tick. And you'd keep eating at one block every tic after that until you reached the point where the spill-over stopped and it would take you two ticks again. Better than I thought it was at least!

What I don't understand is where he's getting the 91 blocks from because last time I checked each salvage block granted 2 salvage power, meaning if you want to fully eat one block in one tick you need 100 blocks for 200 salvage power, not 91?

 

[Malacodor]

What I don't understand is where he's getting the 91 blocks from because last time I checked each salvage block granted 2 salvage power, meaning if you want to fully eat one block in one tick you need 100 blocks for 200 salvage power, not 91?

Maybe he just made his hands dirty and tested it, instead of only theorizing.

 

[Edymnion]

Maybe he just made his hands dirty and tested it, instead of only theorizing.

Then something is very, very wrong that needs fixing.

Because the config file says its 200 total needed, and the readouts for the blocks say its 2 each. If its actually 91 blocks needed instead of 100, then either the readouts for savlagers (and possibly all weapons) are wrong, or the math going on behind the scenes is wrong.

 

[Nickizzy]

Then something is very, very wrong that needs fixing.

Because the config file says its 200 total needed, and the readouts for the blocks say its 2 each. If its actually 91 blocks needed instead of 100, then either the readouts for savlagers (and possibly all weapons) are wrong, or the math going on behind the scenes is wrong.

Or the tick calculator is glitching? Is this a salvage beam issue or a beam issue?

 

[Edymnion]

Or the tick calculator is glitching? Is this a salvage beam issue or a beam issue?

Hmmm... either way I'd still recommend building for 100 and not 91.

If 91 is technically working at the moment, I would say its a bug that will eventually be fixed. Better to overbuild now and not have to rebuild from scratch later, IMO.

 

[splatthecat]

They actually look okay! I'm surprised that they don't look as blocky as I thought they would. Now you need some cool launching system for them.

They have! See the second and third pictures where they are being carried and launched from a modified Isanth VI. How cool do you want it LOL!

 

[Nickizzy]

Stop ninjaing each other!

 

[MrFURB]

Because the config file says its 200 total needed, and the readouts for the blocks say its 2 each. If its actually 91 blocks needed instead of 100, then either the readouts for savlagers (and possibly all weapons) are wrong, or the math going on behind the scenes is wrong.

Oh, I KNEW I forgot something, thanks. The block behavior config has this stat sitting in the salvager section:
<InitialTicks>10</InitialTicks> <!-- Ticks to do at the initial contact of beam with a block -->
When I first did the tests myself I was also expecting a big round 100 modules being the max value, but I found that only 90 gave full value and the 91st only gave half value with all the following not giving anything. I attributed this to the initial ticks, as it's was the only thing left math-wise that I hadn't taken into account. Hope that helps.

 

[Nickizzy]

Oh, I KNEW I forgot something, thanks. The block behavior config has this stat sitting in the salvager section:
<InitialTicks>10</InitialTicks> <!-- Ticks to do at the initial contact of beam with a block -->
When I first did the tests myself I was also expecting a big round 100 modules being the max value, but I found that only 90 gave full value and the 91st only gave half value with all the following not giving anything. I attributed this to the initial ticks, as it's was the only thing left math-wise that I hadn't taken into account. Hope that helps.

So for max speed, 91 is the best, but if you want it to be a round number them 90 is 97.8% as effective. Hm. That's a big step up from the 20 rods I always use.

 

[DrTarDIS]

Hello folks, with the promise of the NPC update to come soon i'm looking at getting back into Starmade. Since I've been gone there have been many improvements and new features added to this game.

Right now I'm really interested in making effective mining systems. I'm curious as to how much we can automate now and what designs work well.

Just build a cheap blob with plenty of storage, an (empty) 4:1 thrust to mass(storage will lower that as it fills) and some BASIC shields. Spawn in various copies of it, make a fleet, and send it to unloaded sectors to mine. Unloaded mining is WAY more efficient than loaded mining.

 

[Malacodor]

Just build a cheap blob with plenty of storage, an (empty) 4:1 thrust to mass(storage will lower that as it fills) and some BASIC shields. Spawn in various copies of it, make a fleet, and send it to unloaded sectors to mine. Unloaded mining is WAY more efficient than loaded mining.

How many sectors around sectors with players are loaded? I forgot about it.

 

[Nickizzy]

Unloaded mining is WAY more efficient than loaded mining.

Unloaded mining is a thing?!?!?

 

[splatthecat]

Unloaded mining is a thing?!?!?

I've sent a fleet to an adjacent sector where I can physically see asteroids and left them to it but I too am unsure that unloaded mining is a thing? I have got an asteroid field marked in my nav and this is about 10 sectors away so is unlikely to be loaded unless the server is busy. I will have to try it out unless it can be confirmed by the good doctor.

 

[Malacodor]

Unloaded mining is a thing?!?!?

Even if it isn't, it's still better. Doing nothing in an unloaded sector at least doesn't waste your time watching the miners doing nothing.

 

[Nickizzy]

Even if it isn't, it's still better. Doing nothing in an unloaded sector at least doesn't waste your time watching the miners doing nothing.

Our faction homebase is surrounded by asteroid sectors.

 

[DrTarDIS]

How many sectors around sectors with players are loaded? I forgot about it.

your sector + every sector in a 3^3 cube surrounding it is loaded in. How long they stay loaded in after you change sectors is a value set in the server config. The more you know moment: This is why constant/instant-jump ships making their way in between galaxies can cause server lag. Load 9 sectors, load 9 more, load 9 more...oh it's time to unload the first 9...but I gotta load another 9 at the same time...

Unloaded mining is a thing?!?!?

It's a thing

 

[Nickizzy]

your sector + every sector in a 3^3 cube surrounding it is loaded in. How long they stay loaded in after you change sectors is a value set in the server config. The more you know moment: This is why constant/instant-jump ships making their way in between galaxies can cause server lag. Load 9 sectors, load 9 more, load 9 more...oh it's time to unload the first 9...but I gotta load another 9 at the same time...
It's a thing

How does it work? Is it just a set amount per second drained from a pool in the sector, which regenerates every once and a while? Or does it load the sector to do it?

 

[DrTarDIS]

How does it work? Is it just a set amount per second drained from a pool in the sector, which regenerates every once and a while? Or does it load the sector to do it?

AFAICT It's the exact same a regular fleet mining, except:

• no "maneuvering" calculations (EG idiot drone bumped the asteroid, all other drones must re-set)
• no "missing beams" (EG, drones fire their beams at target resource, then pan left-to-right with remaining beam time)
• entire array hits resources (EG you build a BIG mining drone, and most of the time it sprays beams out into space. unloaded, zero beams spray out into space)
• amount salvaged =total SPS of ship's salvage system. No raycast or vectors, resources just "chosen" and "mined" in pure numerical form.

 

[splatthecat]

AFAICT It's the exact same a regular fleet mining, except:

• no "maneuvering" calculations (EG idiot drone bumped the asteroid, all other drones must re-set)
• no "missing beams" (EG, drones fire their beams at target resource, then pan left-to-right with remaining beam time)
• entire array hits resources (EG you build a BIG mining drone, and most of the time it sprays beams out into space. unloaded, zero beams spray out into space)
• amount salvaged =total SPS of ship's salvage system. No raycast or vectors, resources just "chosen" and "mined" in pure numerical form.

The last time I tested this it wasn't a "thing", so I shall definitely be giving it another go, thanks!

 

[Nickizzy]

AFAICT It's the exact same a regular fleet mining, except:

• no "maneuvering" calculations (EG idiot drone bumped the asteroid, all other drones must re-set)
• no "missing beams" (EG, drones fire their beams at target resource, then pan left-to-right with remaining beam time)
• entire array hits resources (EG you build a BIG mining drone, and most of the time it sprays beams out into space. unloaded, zero beams spray out into space)
• amount salvaged =total SPS of ship's salvage system. No raycast or vectors, resources just "chosen" and "mined" in pure numerical form.

So it's all based on the SHS(amount of modules(?)? That seems really exploitable. Does it check for if it's an asteroid sector, or if it was just mined? And how does it calculate what ores to get?