Atmosphere blocking Projectiles?

[CyberTao]

Just a random thought I had, and not sure if it was every suggested but here goes.
The idea is that a new effect block is added, and 'conventional' weapons (cannons/beams/missiles) are blocked by a planet's atmosphere (both ways, from within or outside).

In order to attack through an atmosphere, you would need to use a new effect (Effect X because I suck at naming). Effect X would lower shield and hull damage by 25%, but allow shots to pass through the atmosphere.

As an unbound effect, Effect X could possibly allow an 'auto-gravity' function, or act as a possible O2 system (if/when we ever get that). A better idea for the unbound effect would be as a weak pull effect applied in all directions, like a DamagePulse/-/Pull with greatly increased range, creating a form of gravity well (does not affect astronauts). Such an effect could be used in combination with damage pulse to give it more of a use.

Edit; Idea update 1
The atmosphere of a planet would have to be divided into "layers", flat planes that extend across the entire surface of the face, set at certain intervals. A projectile would have to pass through 4/5th of the layers before they would be removed, with their damage being reduced per layer it passes through. Doing it as such would prevent large ships from just sticking their noses into the atmosphere and bypassing the mechanic entirely.

The idea was to try and add a tactical advantage to building bases on planets, and encourage 'planet-based' warfare, like hover tanks, fighters or ground combat, since those could easily be ruined by a passing warship that could do the job all in 1 shot. Just something to ponder or consider, or ignore if you don't care.

 

[Krazzydragon]

for an effect name Atmosphere Piercing maybe?

 

[CyberTao]

for an effect name Atmosphere Piercing maybe?

"Pierce" is already an effect, so might lead to confusion. Plus it's kind of a mouthful compared to the other effects. Good try though.

 

[xlBlackhawklx]

Atmospheric Disruptor, or Field Displacer. Either way thats a great idea and would add depth to the game. Though Im not sure it would be easy to implement since the atmosphere is nonphysical so there might not be a way to reduce the round break through. I'm not sure if it can be done. Calbiri is this possible with current game mechanics?

 

[jayman38]

Name suggestion: Gravbore (uses artificial gravity to push atmosphere out of the way, or some such technobabble)

It's a fun variation on an idea that has been kicked around before. Along with atmospheric effects, I have seen a pattern emerge: when suggesting atmospheric effects, most suggesters suggest an atmosphere (and related effects) extend way out beyond the planet surface.

Now for the rub: let's assume that we get an atmosphere that extends way out beyond the planet surface by 100 block lengths. What happens when there is a ship in-atmosphere? Do you want to calculate a percentage of the atmospheric effect (realistic but adds another calculation to the already-calculation-heavy weapon firing subroutine), maintain the full effect even if the ship is a single block away from the planet's surface (maddening), or eliminate the effect for ships in the atmosphere (annoying)?

 

[CyberTao]

Now for the rub: let's assume that we get an atmosphere that extends way out beyond the planet surface by 100 block lengths. What happens when there is a ship in-atmosphere? Do you want to calculate a percentage of the atmospheric effect (realistic but adds another calculation to the already-calculation-heavy weapon firing subroutine), maintain the full effect even if the ship is a single block away from the planet's surface (maddening), or eliminate the effect for ships in the atmosphere (annoying)?

Why not just add stages? Break the atmosphere into 5 layers for example, each layer the shot travels through would decrease the damage by 25% and after 4 layers the projectile would just be removed, as it would have 0% damage left. The reason I said 5 layers, but said you only need 4 layers to remove shots it to prevent warships from just poking their noses into the outermost atmosphere and bypassing the whole system, Easier for calculations, and would support larger atmospheres with this effect (could be 8 layers and needing only 5 as well, whichever seems like the best option)

Atmospheric Disruptor, or Field Displacer. Either way thats a great idea and would add depth to the game. Though Im not sure it would be easy to implement since the atmosphere is nonphysical so there might not be a way to reduce the round break through. I'm not sure if it can be done. Calbiri is this possible with current game mechanics?

What could be done is a flat plane of blocks over each plate per layer. The plane would consist of a transparent, non-physical block that would not be salvage-able (You could apply the right-click with docking beams mechanic to make it so salvage beams go right past it). When a projectile hits the block however, it behaves like pierce (The block having 100% armour and regenerating HP like the planet to make it unbreakable). Piece is (or was) was set up to allow a % of damage to go through, despite whether or not the block had been destroyed, so setting it so that ~25% of damage is removed for each layer it passes through should be doable.

 

[AtraUnam]

Have the atmosphere be a thin layer X blocks up. Normal weaponry works above or below it but cannot pass through it. Then you either have to use this effect to perform orbital strikes, or use conventional weapons mounted on planet based tanks and fighters.

 

[CyberTao]

Have the atmosphere be a thin layer X blocks up. Normal weaponry works above or below it but cannot pass through it. Then you either have to use this effect to perform orbital strikes, or use conventional weapons mounted on planet based tanks and fighters.

The problem I see with just a single layer is capital ships playing "peekaboo", sticking their nose ends with weapon outputs below the layer. Think of bubble shields and shoving your nose under to negate the shielding entirely, it's that same issue. So multiple layers would be almost required.

-I made an update to the OP including the layer idea and a better sounding passive effect.

 

[Lecic]

Yeah, you aren't the first person to bring this idea up, Cyber. Even I had one for this, though it involved dealing increasing amounts of block damage to ships entering atmosphere depending on mass to deal with the "nose poking" issue of big ships.

However, your layer idea makes much more sense to me.

If we REALLY want ground-based combat to be viable, though, some sort of change needs to be made to make planets a viable thing to fight over. I think the "mantle extractor" thing that's been tossed around seems like the best bet. There'd need to be some sort of mechanic preventing people from just burying a faction block near the planet core and encasing it in rock, though. You can't really take over a planet with that being there.

 

[CyberTao]

If we REALLY want ground-based combat to be viable, though, some sort of change needs to be made to make planets a viable thing to fight over. I think the "mantle extractor" thing that's been tossed around seems like the best bet. There'd need to be some sort of mechanic preventing people from just burying a faction block near the planet core and encasing it in rock, though. You can't really take over a planet with that being there.

That would be the hard part really. I personally don't like seeing planets salvaged down to a thin layer of rubble, not because of the lag, but because it ruins the planet. As such, I'm for removing ores from planets and adding a "drill" module that can harvest ores and materials from the planet's core (not the plates themselves) that could give the planet's current average ore payout over the course of a week maximum (with ore chance being semi-random like it is for asteroid spawns now). I also support things like geothermal power and a greater dependency on power storage, but that's more a modding idea. Things like ruins and mobs would increase the explore-ability of planets, but afterwards there is no real reason to not just reduce it to rubble.
Any value planets would have to stem from the fact they are planets though, and not some arbitrary stat boost/increased efficiency or blacklisted block that only works on planets because reasons.

Hiding something underneath rock isn't really something that can be controlled. Can't specify a height because the different planets have differing heights, and you say "at max height, like a turret core being at the bottom" because that would leave it really exposed. When it comes to taking plates or a planet as a whole, we'd probably need a 'flag' system that would probably come from modding before anything else, since you can't force people to take part in it either.

Planet warfare would be something that needs a lot of work, this idea was just to try and give more strategic depth to planets for now, an extra layer of defense that might make people consider it a little more often, and get people to be a little more creative when assaulting said bases.

 

[jayman38]

Drill extraction sounds great! I don't know if I have seen that kind of suggestion before. I think it solves many of the planet-devouring versus planet-value arguments cleanly. I'd still like to see some rare ore biomes (not just random collections of ores, but rare chunks that are almost all ore).