A pack of changes that will improve the boarding concept

    jorgekorke

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    This is a "pack" of ideas that I've had those days after analyzing the brand-new boarding concept that came with the recent patch. Some of those ideas are similar to this thread as well, but slightly refined. Here we go.

    ---

    1 -
    The implementation of anti-astronaut turrets is a short-sighted way to counter boarding. It was supposed to create difficulties for a boarding party, but instead, makes it flat impossible, should the player have a minimum I.Q. of 5.

    A better and more entertaining way for creating hazards for boarding parties is to improve the way the NPCs interact. Instead of turrets that focus on enemy astronauts on sight, NPCs could do this job inside a ship, and for a good bonus, gives them a function, since today they are pretty much useless.

    A fire fight on a ship with lots of pew pew is a better idea and makes boarding difficult but STILL possible, now depending on your skill on shooting people. Shooting between astronauts is very enjoyed by people on build/creative servers and are never used on the actual game, so that's the chance.

    ---

    2 - Players operating a ship should not be allowed to place any blocks once the ship is in combat. This prevents them from placing that huge chunk of Advanced Armor right on the heads of a boarding party to make them stuck almost forever.

    It is very easy to implement that to the game. Currently, ships can detect when they are in combat or not, causing the shield recharging rate to drop, until the shooting is done. Use this same system to avoid block placement.

    ---

    3 - Increase a bit the torch damage. 3 is a reasonable number, and will still require effort. This is due to the almost impossibility of breaching a massive blast door or an advanced armor piece.

    ---

    4 - Another easy way to clean up your ship without any effort is the usage of pulses. Press one button and your ship is purged. This could be avoided by making entities that are aligned to a ship to be immune of the ship's own weapons.

    If entity A (player or NPC) is alligned to ship B, B's weapons can't harm A.

    ---

    5 - Another way of making boarding impossible is the usage of gravity lifts on small holes, with the usage of logic. A simple solution is making logic activation blocks and gravity modules usable for everyone. Area triggers already follow this rule, no matter the faction, so the concept can be re-used.

    ---


    1 - REMOVE ANTI ASTRONAUT TURRETS FROM THE GAME , ALLOW NPCS TO SHOOT THEM ON SIGHT

    2 - DO NOT LET PLAYERS PLACE BLOCKS WHEN IN COMBAT

    3 - BUFF TORCH DAMAGE FROM 1 TO 3

    4 - SHIP'S OWN WEAPONS CAN'T KILL ALLIGNED STUFF

    5 - ANYONE CAN USE LOGIC STUFF, NOT FACTION LOCKED.
     
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    I'm like 99% sure that build mode in its entirety is going to be beaten hard with the nerf bat when shipyards come along

    Also, doesn't the core overheat reset a ship's faction? So by extension, logic IS usable for everyone.

    But I do agree that anti astronaut turrets should be removed, we already have a way to protect our interiors through NPCs
     
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    I like it, however #5 conflicts with the fact that buttons and the like really shouldn't be usable by everyone, it's too easy to cause problems and grief if that's the case.
     

    jorgekorke

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    I like it, however #5 conflicts with the fact that buttons and the like really shouldn't be usable by everyone, it's too easy to cause problems and grief if that's the case.
    True. Gotta think of a different way to counter that, then. Hmmmm
     
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    I kinda like Anti-personnel turrets, but I do agree, that there needs to be a better way to deal with them. Perhaps disable any form of shields on anti personnel turrets so that player-held rocket launchers stand a chance against them?
     
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    I agree with all points except 1 and 5. Logic blocks shouldn't be able to be activated by everyone, definitely only the faction they belong to. Gravity though, yeah. I think though gravity shouldn't have to be activated, though that's for another thread.
    Yes, anti-astronaut turrets are imbalanced, but I think they should just not be able to have shieldsor something. In real life sentry turrets are pretty dangerous, just look at this thing :P
     

    Reilly Reese

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    Well the BEST way to do it would be like EVE's hacking system. Interactive and making you unable to do anything else. Failure could result in the console "overloading" and blowing your face off.
     
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    This is a "pack" of ideas that I've had those days after analyzing the brand-new boarding concept that came with the recent patch. Some of those ideas are similar to this thread as well, but slightly refined. Here we go.

    ---

    1 -
    The implementation of anti-astronaut turrets is a short-sighted way to counter boarding. It was supposed to create difficulties for a boarding party, but instead, makes it flat impossible, should the player have a minimum I.Q. of 5.

    A better and more entertaining way for creating hazards for boarding parties is to improve the way the NPCs interact. Instead of turrets that focus on enemy astronauts on sight, NPCs could do this job inside a ship, and for a good bonus, gives them a function, since today they are pretty much useless.

    A fire fight on a ship with lots of pew pew is a better idea and makes boarding difficult but STILL possible, now depending on your skill on shooting people. Shooting between astronauts is very enjoyed by people on build/creative servers and are never used on the actual game, so that's the chance.


    ---

    2 - Players operating a ship should not be allowed to place any blocks once the ship is in combat. This prevents them from placing that huge chunk of Advanced Armor right on the heads of a boarding party to make them stuck almost forever.

    It is very easy to implement that to the game. Currently, ships can detect when they are in combat or not, causing the shield recharging rate to drop, until the shooting is done. Use this same system to avoid block placement.

    ---

    3 - Increase a bit the torch damage. 3 is a reasonable number, and will still require effort. This is due to the almost impossibility of breaching a massive blast door or an advanced armor piece.

    ---

    4 - Another easy way to clean up your ship without any effort is the usage of pulses. Press one button and your ship is purged. This could be avoided by making entities that are aligned to a ship to be immune of the ship's own weapons.

    If entity A (player or NPC) is alligned to ship B, B's weapons can't harm A.

    ---

    5 - Another way of making boarding impossible is the usage of gravity lifts on small holes, with the usage of logic. A simple solution is making logic activation blocks and gravity modules usable for everyone. Area triggers already follow this rule, no matter the faction, so the concept can be re-used.

    ---


    1 - REMOVE ANTI ASTRONAUT TURRETS FROM THE GAME , ALLOW NPCS TO SHOOT THEM ON SIGHT

    2 - DO NOT LET PLAYERS PLACE BLOCKS WHEN IN COMBAT

    3 - BUFF TORCH DAMAGE FROM 1 TO 3

    4 - SHIP'S OWN WEAPONS CAN'T KILL ALLIGNED STUFF

    5 - ANYONE CAN USE LOGIC STUFF, NOT FACTION LOCKED.
    i agree with most of the stuff, exept a few things:
    #2 is not good.
    who says a ship is Always under fire when a boarding part comes in.
    and also:
    #5 it would be nice, but then everyone can also fk up your logic on a station.
    and most likely, a plex/blast door will be a bigger problem.
    #1 like the idea, but how the hell are you going to get rid from internal turrets, i've had them before the docking upgrade, because you never know. i dont think people will just do it because they want to give people a change.
    also the NPC can't do sh*t as defenders on a ship, ever tried to hit a target on a moving ship? hehe.
    snipers is what you need to fight on a moving ship, but these are too op to use for NPC.
    also, when on a not moving place, npcs are kinda op, they aim like a beast and even move while shooting.
    i cant survive 2 salvos of them. you need to either downgrade them (aiming and HP) or upgrade us (battle suit or something)

    I'm like 99% sure that build mode in its entirety is going to be beaten hard with the nerf bat when shipyards come along

    Also, doesn't the core overheat reset a ship's faction? So by extension, logic IS usable for everyone.

    But I do agree that anti astronaut turrets should be removed, we already have a way to protect our interiors through NPCs
    i have pretty much boarding experience, and i shot a core for about 10-15 minutes when i gave up, it just wouldn't overheat, then i broke an advanced hull, yes im a real try hard i exualy did that, and found the faction block, broke that and then i was able to enter.
    note that this was a not entered abandoned ship.

    ninja 6 took some time to write :P
     

    Reilly Reese

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    AI are tough but not as tough as a tiny turret with 50 million points of shields :p
     
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    I'm like 99% sure that build mode in its entirety is going to be beaten hard with the nerf bat when shipyards come along

    Also, doesn't the core overheat reset a ship's faction? So by extension, logic IS usable for everyone.

    But I do agree that anti astronaut turrets should be removed, we already have a way to protect our interiors through NPCs
    I personally don't think build mode should be done in, I think it should still be usable to repair things the way it's used now, however it should turn off in combat as was suggested.
     

    Lecic

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    3 - Increase a bit the torch damage. 3 is a reasonable number, and will still require effort. This is due to the almost impossibility of breaching a massive blast door or an advanced armor piece.
    I agree with the rest of the post, except this. 3 is waaaay too small a number. Advanced Armor, Blast Doors, and Forcefields have 250 HP. With 1 DPS, that's over 4 and a quarter minutes to break one block. With 3 DPS, that's about a minute and a half to break down a block. Even with 5 DPS, that's still 40 seconds. Those numbers are ridiculously high. I think 10 DPS for the torch, plus small, expensive breaching charges that ignore shields and armor, would be much more fair.
     

    Reilly Reese

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    Ehh forty is to fast imo. Have you seen how long it takes to cut through modern blast doors? Though a C4 device would be a good addition as long as it only has a 3x3 blast area.
     

    Lecic

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    Ehh forty is to fast imo. Have you seen how long it takes to cut through modern blast doors? Though a C4 device would be a good addition as long as it only has a 3x3 blast area.
    It might take a while to cut through a modern blast door, but that doesn't lead to fun gameplay. Slicing my way through a 5 block thick door is not my idea of a good time. The challenge for repelling boarders should be with well designed interior defenses, not just slapping down a really big door. You know, things like cover for defenders, interior turrets (though they'd need a serious nerf), etc.

    And yeah, a 3x3 C4 type device was exactly what I was thinking.
     

    Winterhome

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    A weaker warhead or something? I can get behind that.
     
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    A weaker warhead or something? I can get behind that.
    maybe add functionality to the warhead that it can be placed anywhere and when broken by a torch it does ~500 block damage (no astronaut) in a 3x3x3 cube, ignoring shields and armor? that way the health of the warhead determines the minimum "fuse"
     
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    Or we could just give astronauts a hacking tool, and then let them hack the door open.
     
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    Lecic

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    Or we could just give astronauts a hacking tool, and then let them hack the door open.
    Then, allow astronauts on board to "counter hack" so that hacking the door open takes longer.