Stopping Advanced Build Mode spying

[BDLS]

We have all used A.B.M. to spy inside other people's ships and stations, right? You shouldn't be able to do that, especially with the new cargo system.

I propose (with a server.cfg setting to turn off if you wanted to) that the A.B.M. "camera" cannot enter the box dimensions of a non-allied entity.

If you have a better idea, feel free to post. I feel that hiding other entities in advanced build mode would make looking around a nightmare.

 

[FatCobra]

I like this idea. I would even go so far as to say it should only be able to a few block outside of the bounding box its in.

 

[Kilim]

I personally think that it would be good to remove advanced build mode completely from ships and only allow it to be used when docked to a shipyard.

 

[SpaceChief]

As an alternative to 'blocking' the camera from entering a non-allied entity, how about this: advanced build mode makes every other entity, except the one being edited, go wireframe. The silhouette is still visible, but the blocks comprising any other ship or station are not. That would probably help increase fps when building too.

I personally think that it would be good to remove advanced build mode completely from ships and only allow it to be used when docked to a shipyard.

Agree but I think it should be toggle-able from server.cfg. There's no reason you can't have a fun creative goof-off server and a hardcore server with restricted settings.

If we're going to remove advanced build mode, we also need to remove the F11 trick too.

 

[FatCobra]

What is the F11 trick?

 

[SpaceChief]

F11 gives you a fun remote camera in the center of the currently occupied sector. Same control as ABM, you can zoom in and with shift+scroll. You can also use it to cheat and explore other ships and stations ala ABM. Press F11 again, go back to whatever you were doing before.

 

[NeonSturm]

F11 is useful when shooting at water-block-targets to see the impact of a gun on a target (spread, penetration, ...).

But yes, I think you should only be able to use it if you have an entity with a camera block there.

 

[spunkiethefirst]

As an alternative to 'blocking' the camera from entering a non-allied entity, how about this: advanced build mode makes every other entity, except the one being edited, go wireframe. The silhouette is still visible, but the blocks comprising any other ship or station are not. That would probably help increase fps when building too.



Agree but I think it should be toggle-able from server.cfg. There's no reason you can't have a fun creative goof-off server and a hardcore server with restricted settings.

If we're going to remove advanced build mode, we also need to remove the F11 trick too.

Wireframe until it's hit with a scanner.

 

[Kilim]

As an alternative to 'blocking' the camera from entering a non-allied entity, how about this: advanced build mode makes every other entity, except the one being edited, go wireframe. The silhouette is still visible, but the blocks comprising any other ship or station are not. That would probably help increase fps when building too.



Agree but I think it should be toggle-able from server.cfg. There's no reason you can't have a fun creative goof-off server and a hardcore server with restricted settings.

If we're going to remove advanced build mode, we also need to remove the F11 trick too.

Exactly - would be good for build servers.

What is the F11 trick?

also f11 should be removed...seems like some dev tool at most

 

[Zekester81]

I think advanced build mode should be kept, but limited to the current structure and all docked components in the current structures docking chain. Everything else should be solid and unable to be passed through.

 

[lupoCani]

Alright, that somehow escalated from "Don't let the camera enter other entities" to "remove build mode".

In the long term, I'm all for making build mode purely a design tool, and require additional in-game equipment to modify physical ships accordingly. As the moment, though, let's settle for not rendering other entities.

 

[nightwalker_007]

I personally think that it would be good to remove advanced build mode completely from ships and only allow it to be used when docked to a shipyard.

I'd have to partially disagree with you here. Advance build mode while in a ship is useful, and shouldn't be done away with, but I can see a slight tweak to it, following my suggestion in https://starmadedock.net/threads/co...ps-asteroids-into-station-like-objects.22705/ for another use for shipyard computers. This allows a lone shipyard computer to be used to create a new design, or edit a new one Instead of having to move into a hologram of a ship core, you'd instead instantly be transported into a private sector in creative/build mode. From here, there's no spying. Once when you're done with your design, you can then tell your on-board shipyard computer to begin repairing/modifying your ship based on the new design, and just let it go--the only drawback is the build time will take place at 1/10th (or whatever the server admin sets) of the normal shipyard build rate.

Of course then, shipyard computers would have to be made a lot cheaper (using just alloy/crystal) so they can be used early game, otherwise it'll be very painful starting off. Getting enough materials to build shipyard columns would be a bit annoying with the gear a player typically starts off with. As a side effect, people will have to leave their ship core to design their craft, making astronaut play more relevant.

 

[SpaceChief]

Alright, that somehow escalated from "Don't let the camera enter other entities" to "remove build mode".

In the long term, I'm all for making build mode purely a design tool, and require additional in-game equipment to modify physical ships accordingly. As the moment, though, let's settle for not rendering other entities.

I suggested not rendering other entities because it seems easier to achieve, and is effectively the same outcome, as blocking the camera from entering other entities. Anything that prevents the camera from moving in advanced mode could be exploited, though.

Here's an extreme example: a player is building a spaceship, and someone with with megaship of some kind flies over and positions in such a way as to block the the builder from being able to see what they are doing. If a griefer did it right they could block a player from being able to build anything by trapping their camera.

Making other entities invisible prevents that example. All that said I realize the end goal here is to prevent spying by using the free-cam.

 

[lupoCani]

You seem to be arguing, but I can't quite see where you disagree with me. Care to clarify?

 

[SpaceChief]

My position is that blocking the camera is an overkill response to preventing spying. I agree with you in that something needs to prevent spying, and I agree with you that advanced build mode should not be removed at all; building ships 'by hand' in astronaut mode kind of sucks.

I like the system as it exists right now, I figured that wireframing entities would prevent griefing and spying until a better way to handle it is developed.

 

[Captainredfox]

This has all of my yes.

 

[NeonSturm]

OK. How do you like these:

Installed (even insufficiently supplied or inactive) jammer-blocks make ship-blocks impenetrable to the camera-object.
However, you can always see your own entity and sub-entities (not master-entities).