Recognized by Council New Territory System

[ltmauve]

So, as we know, there are some problems with the faction territory and FP system. First, it discourages claiming more territory. Second, claiming a system is easy to do but difficult for an enemy to counter. (because the claiming faction block can be anywhere.)

FP (Faction Points) now come from claimed sectors and are spent on each member.
Each turn of the faction system, the system will add FP for claimed territory. FP will then be spent for each member of the faction. Active and online members cost less. There is no more FP cost for death, because that discourages playing while losing, or going and doing games of the shooty kind with friends. FP lost on death will go to the killer's faction, meaning deaths in faction or prearranged events will not be a problem. (DivineEvil for this)

Partial claiming and TCM (Bigger stations get you more FP)
Systems will no longer be claimable through only a single block. Instead, stations now have a score called TCM (Territory control mass, MrFURB 's original idea) Each block type contributes differently to the TCM a station has. (System blocks contribute a lot, hull a good amount, and dirt practically none.)
If you claim a planet, the TCM at the time will be stored and subtracted.
In order to fully claim a sector, the TCM of the stations must be above a limit. This gives the max FP per turn. There is a minimum claim level. If you have claimed a sector, you automatically get that percentage of the max FP per turn.

Claiming area (Automatically done around your stations)
No more claiming an entire system. Instead, faction stations claim sectors nearby. If the claim ranges of two stations overlap, their TCMs add in the overlapping sectors. If the claim ranges from two different factions overlaps, whichever faction has more TCM nearby the sector claims that sector as if the other faction wasn't there.

This map is using the parameter of a minimum/initial claim of 25% and 600 TCM needed for maximum claim (which gives you the other 75% of the claim). Each group of sectors has been labeled with the calculation.

Further notes on planets:
Any structure built on a planet will give the same effect as a structure of the same TCM as a station, because the TCM from all the dirt will be stored and subtracted.
However, planets increase the max claim level around them. A single planet raises the max claim level of nearby sectors by 100% (or whatever)
This increased claim can only be gotten by having more TCM in the area.

So in the example above, with 25% initial claim and 600 TCM to get the other 75%, if a sector was claimed with 600 + 800 = 1400 TCM, it would have a claim level of 200%. With two planets, 600 + (2 x 800) = 2200 TCM gives 300% claim.

Spoiler: Optional Idea: Sector types

Sector types: (Optional idea)
The idea is each sector is a type, and that type gives a bonus to certain activities in that sector.
The type of a sector is determined by the types (user-determined) of the stations nearby (basically, I say a station is type X, and nearby sectors are now type X.) Stations will only receive a bonus to their type if they are in a sector of the same type.
Sector types have intensity determined by the TCM of the stations claiming that type.
The types of different stations nearby will interfere in the same way as faction claims.

Types: (general idea)

• Mining base: Provides mining bonus boost.
• Forward base: Provides mobility boost.
• Fortress: provides combat boosts.
• Refinery: provides bonus output to micro assemblers and refineries.
• Manufacturing: provides bonus output to other factories. (maybe available in different flavors.)
• Shipbuilding: Provides speed and power bonus to shipyards.
• Civilian: provides bonus to getting NPCs (possibilities include getting more NPCs from the area, getting better NPCs, or getting NPCs cheaper.)

 

[Equilibrium21]

Interesting idea, it could be added in the game with a few more stuff and tweaks. Its surely better than what we have right now.

 

[Reilly Reese]

This will definitely help lead factions to proper wars rather than deep strikes into their homebases and that being a "war"

 

[Blaza612]

This is a brilliant idea, puts more emphasis on stations then the current system.

 

[hunterRAE]

Agreed, this would make system conquest plausible by other people and maybe make people not bulldoze planets like mad. There maybe be benefits for the amount of systems conquered (FP increase or more invulnerable stations).

 

[ltmauve]

Actually, I was thinking the benefits would come from having full claim rather than just expanding area. With the initial claim the most resource-effective way to get FP is to scatter a bunch of tiny stations all over the place.

 

[Knack]

Just letting a here a link to my older thread that has also links to other threads concerning Factions/FP/Territory
http://starmadedock.net/threads/knacks-faction-overhaul.7190/

My idea was also to give different FP-income and expense from what is in sectors.
I think a combination of this two suggestions would be possible and would add much gameplay.

 

[nightwalker_007]

Erm.. This is a cool idea. It also encourages big home base station builds. Now, it would be even more interesting if there was an added mechanic to encourage stations with interiors-- otherwise people would just build doom-cube stations, which would be annoying.

Station interiors could be calculated based empty volume with exposed decoration blocks, visits/dockings by faction and non-faction players (which would encourage more station traffic, and make stations other players would want to visit and explore), and distance between walls. It won't stop ugly solid-cube stations but it would discourage it.

Claimed planets should get max claim points. Planetary bases provide a unique challenge over space stations, especially since the gravity well poses design challenges for any large ship that wishes to land and then leave a planet again. Also, there's only a finite number of planets in a system. Players can spawn any number of stations they wish.

 

[Blaza612]

Erm.. This is a cool idea. It also encourages big home base station builds. Now, it would be even more interesting if there was an added mechanic to encourage stations with interiors-- otherwise people would just build doom-cube stations, which would be annoying.

Station interiors could be calculated based empty volume with exposed decoration blocks, visits/dockings by faction and non-faction players (which would encourage more station traffic, and make stations other players would want to visit and explore), and distance between walls. It won't stop ugly solid-cube stations but it would discourage it.

Claimed planets should get max claim points. Planetary bases provide a unique challenge over space stations, especially since the gravity well poses design challenges for any large ship that wishes to land and then leave a planet again. Also, there's only a finite number of planets in a system. Players can spawn any number of stations they wish.

I like the idea for interiors giving a bonus, especially if traffic is involved. However, you can easily just get a single block hole and have decor blocks the only exterior block in that hole. :P

 

[nightwalker_007]

I like the idea for interiors giving a bonus, especially if traffic is involved. However, you can easily just get a single block hole and have decor blocks the only exterior block in that hole. :p

Yeah.. well, if it's ugly then players would want to spend less time wandering around inside of I would think :D. Actually, if faction and non-faction member visits to a station had a strong role in the area it influenced, then that would put a very interesting dynamic on things. It would then be less beneficial to spam space stations all over the sector as well. If non-member faction visit got a slightly higher bonus over faction visits, then it would also encourage setting up alliances with others in the game to further increase the influence of a station.

I kind of think of this like the "culture" spread seen in some strategy games.

I mean really, a station like this should get major influence points:

 

[ltmauve]

My idea was also to give different FP-income and expense from what is in sectors.
I think a combination of this two suggestions would be possible and would add much gameplay.

What were you thinking as a reason to for bonuses? I don't think pirate stations are a good idea as the pirates are a faction and I think having this work for all factions, include NPC ones, is a good idea.

 

[Knack]

Then the whole galaxy is red at the beginning?
I thought you mean that only for player factions.

 

[ltmauve]

Then the whole galaxy is red at the beginning?
I thought you mean that only for player factions.

Well I do want NPC factions to be able to claim stuff. But no, the entire galazy should not be red at the start. In "wild" systems there should be maybe 5 or 10 stations, all clustered into a corner or along an edge of the system. And maybe they do claim entire systems, but definitely not all of them.
And I want NPC factions (or at least the system to work for NPC factions) because that means there will be forces already at work in the galaxy, and stuff can happen.

Claimed planets should get max claim points.

Nope, as that means a faction can get max claim from an area with a single block. Imbalanced.

Now, it would be even more interesting if there was an added mechanic to encourage stations with interiors-- otherwise people would just build doom-cube stations, which would be annoying.

I was thinking something along the lines of requiring NPCs on your station for maintenance, and they go nuts if they can't wander around, and then your station stops working. It's not a perfect idea, I know.

 

[Lecic]

If you claim a planet, the TCM at the time will be stored and subtracted.

So just a plain planet gives nothing? I completely disagree with this. A planet should be a major asset. Of course, full block power might be a bit overpowered, so maybe halve the amount it gives originally?

Claiming area (Automatically done around your stations)
No more claiming an entire system. Instead, faction stations claim sectors nearby. If the claim ranges of two stations overlap, their TCMs add in the overlapping sectors. If the claim ranges from two different factions overlaps, whichever faction has more TCM nearby the sector claims that sector as if the other faction wasn't there.

This map is using the parameter of a minimum/initial claim of 25% and 600 TCM needed for maximum claim (which gives you the other 75% of the claim). Each group of sectors has been labeled with the calculation.

I like the idea of claiming individual sectors instead, but I feel that would get a little cluttered on the galaxy map. If a faction has uncontested control of the system, it should show up as the sole owner. If a system is contested by two factions that are neutral to each other, it shows the two faction colors taking up whatever percentage of system they take up inside. If the two factions are allies, it shows some sort of allied symbol (maybe a green circle) on the percent divide. If the two factions are at war, it shows a hostile symbol (a red circle with a red line through it, perhaps?) on the divide. Divide it into 3 for 3 factions in the system, 4 for 4 factions in the system, etc.

 

[DivineEvil]

Great suggestion overall. Right now claiming systems is only a tool to make mining in a system more profitable. I completely support the direction.

Here are my take on particular aspects:

FP (Faction Points) now come from claimed sectors and are spent on each member.
Each turn of the faction system, the system will add FP for claimed territory. FP will then be spent for each member of the faction. Active and online members cost less. There is no more FP cost for death, because that discourages playing while losing, or going and doing games of the shooty kind with friends.

- Difference between spending FP on active/inactive members is unnecessary. The mere idea of spending points on inactive players is enough to make them a burden, but differential might make it hard on keeping people, who are away from a game for some reason.
- Asteroid sectors claimed in a system increases the mining output in that system up to a certain limit when mined by faction members.
- Planets within a claimed sector increases the FP output of that sector. Planets wont give any TCM by themselves and still will require structures being built on them to function as origin of claim to provide any TCM.
- Faction still loses FPs on death of its members, but instead these very FPs are given to the faction that performed the kill. This will make team-killing completely fine, since no FPs are taken from a Faction pool. You will still lose FPs if someone've been killed by Pirates or neutral players.

Claiming area (Automatically done around your stations)
No more claiming an entire system. Instead, faction stations claim sectors nearby. If the claim ranges of two stations overlap, their TCMs add in the overlapping sectors. If the claim ranges from two different factions overlaps, whichever faction has more TCM nearby the sector claims that sector as if the other faction wasn't there.

- I think it is necessary to implement the feature of Jump-Drive inhibition into the suggestion, so that you cannot jump into or our of claimed sectors if you're at war or a personal enemy of the faction, that holds a claim over them, so that their stations wouldn't be too easy to shut down. Privateers would be able to easily reach a station, but will have to leave on their own engines if a raid fails. This is a good alternative to adding a specific modules/blocks to perform the same function.
- Claimed sectors with Pirate stations formerly in them wouldn't generate any FP until unfactioned/destroyed. Claimed sectors wouldn't spawn any NPC/decayed stations in themselves.

I like the idea of claiming individual sectors instead, but I feel that would get a little cluttered on the galaxy map. If a faction has uncontested control of the system, it should show up as the sole owner. If a system is contested by two factions that are neutral to each other, it shows the two faction colors taking up whatever percentage of system they take up inside. If the two factions are allies, it shows some sort of allied symbol (maybe a green circle) on the percent divide. If the two factions are at war, it shows a hostile symbol (a red circle with a red line through it, perhaps?) on the divide. Divide it into 3 for 3 factions in the system, 4 for 4 factions in the system, etc.

It wasn't even established that particular sectors would be displayed on the galaxy map. The most convenient solution IMHO is to implement an additional "flag" option to the galaxy map, that would display a "pie"-graph over the currently selected system, that would show the relative control one or multiple factions have across that system by sectors.

 

[Ithirahad]

Erm.. This is a cool idea. It also encourages big home base station builds. Now, it would be even more interesting if there was an added mechanic to encourage stations with interiors-- otherwise people would just build doom-cube stations, which would be annoying.

Station interiors could be calculated based empty volume with exposed decoration blocks, visits/dockings by faction and non-faction players (which would encourage more station traffic, and make stations other players would want to visit and explore), and distance between walls. It won't stop ugly solid-cube stations but it would discourage it.

Claimed planets should get max claim points. Planetary bases provide a unique challenge over space stations, especially since the gravity well poses design challenges for any large ship that wishes to land and then leave a planet again. Also, there's only a finite number of planets in a system. Players can spawn any number of stations they wish.

A system that forces people to walk through your station so your faction stays alive? XD Sounds incredibly silly. I like the general idea, but in practice it would end up kind of ridiculous unless there were some things implemented that gave people an actual reason to visit said stations, and even then... This isn't Star Tourist Simulator 2015, this is Starmade :p

 

[ltmauve]

I like the idea of claiming individual sectors instead, but I feel that would get a little cluttered on the galaxy map. If a faction has uncontested control of the system, it should show up as the sole owner. If a system is contested by two factions that are neutral to each other, it shows the two faction colors taking up whatever percentage of system they take up inside. If the two factions are allies, it shows some sort of allied symbol (maybe a green circle) on the percent divide. If the two factions are at war, it shows a hostile symbol (a red circle with a red line through it, perhaps?) on the divide. Divide it into 3 for 3 factions in the system, 4 for 4 factions in the system, etc.

Nice idea.

- Claimed sectors with Pirate stations formerly in them wouldn't generate any FP until unfactioned/destroyed. Claimed sectors wouldn't spawn any NPC/decayed stations in themselves.

First part makes sense. Actually, this would probably be true of any other faction's stations, but the sectors would still be claimed and they couldn't build a station.
Second part, I disagree with. Because pirates are not the only NPC faction, it's just that any territory claimed by an NPC faction wouldn't spawn stations for other NPC factions. Derelict stations should spawn everywhere.

- Faction still loses FPs on death of its members, but instead these very FPs are given to the faction that performed the kill. This will make team-killing completely fine, since no FPs are taken from a Faction pool. You will still lose FPs if someone've been killed by Pirates or neutral players.

^This. Yes. I agree. Updating OP.

- Asteroid sectors claimed in a system increases the mining output in that system up to a certain limit when mined by faction members.

Um... what? I just figured that either the mining bonus would appear at full right from the start or be based on the claim level. I'd imagine that asteroid respawn would only happen in claimed sectors and the frequency would depend on the claim level.

So just a plain planet gives nothing? I completely disagree with this. A planet should be a major asset. Of course, full block power might be a bit overpowered, so maybe halve the amount it gives originally?

Putting one block on a planet is as easy as putting one block on a station. If you want to encourage people to build on planets there should be other incentives. Maybe planet TCM increases the number of AI ships you can field.
I'd also link the plates together with stats (so a form of shared shields and power) to make them a bit beefier and harder to destroy the core.

 

[Reilly Reese]

Star Tourist Simulator 2015

Theres such a thing?

 

[Ithirahad]

Theres such a thing?

No, but Starmade would become that if people could earn FPs from other people coming in and exploring their base. People would essentially start building amusement parks and other attractions (Zoos with the strangest fauna they could scoop up?) inside their stations, and trying to come up with attractions to bring people in :p

 

[kiraen]

People would essentially start building amusement parks and other attractions (Zoos with the strangest fauna they could scoop up?) inside their stations, and trying to come up with attractions to bring people in :p

I'm confused. Why is this a bad thing?